Are infinity and non-existence distinguishable from each other?

[super animator]

I say no, because you can't measure infinity and non-existence, by definition.

 

[Eudaimonist]

I say no, because you can't measure infinity and non-existence, by definition.

You can't measure them, but I would think that an infinity (if such an entity is even possible) is still a "something", and non-existence isn't.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[quatona]

I say no, because you can't measure infinity and non-existence, by definition.

You can´t measure both because they are abstract ex-negativo concepts.
You cannot only not measure them, you actually can´t do anything with them.

 

[super animator]

You can´t measure both because they are abstract ex-negativo concepts.
You cannot only not measure them, you actually can´t do anything with them.

Not quite, u can do some useful things with them in mathematics regarding infinity. Also where did you get the notation that infinity is a "ex-negativo" as you put it.

 

[super animator]

You can't measure them, but I would think that an infinity (if such an entity is even possible) is still a "something", and non-existence isn't.


eudaimonia,

Mark

How are you going to determine that it's a "something" besides measuring?

 

[quatona]

Not quite, u can do some useful things with them in mathematics regarding infinity.

...and you also can distinguish them in mathematics.

 

[Hieronymus]

I say no, because you can't measure infinity and non-existence, by definition.

Zero does not equal infinity.

 

[super animator]

...and you also can distinguish them in mathematics.

Sure thing, but originally I was talking about reality, we can't simply "define" things like in mathematics, that make our lives easier.

 

[super animator]

Zero does not equal infinity.

Zero does not equate non-existence.

 

[quatona]

Sure thing, but originally I was talking about reality,

So why did you move the argument to mathematics when I responded in regards to reality?

we can't simply "define" things like in mathematics

Bingo. Non-existence and infinity aren´t things in reality, in the first place.

that make our lives easier.

...unless you insist to complicate them with word games.

 

[Hieronymus]

Zero does not equate non-existence.

Actually it does.
When there are zero flying spaghetti monsters, flying spaghetti monsters do not exist.

 

[quatona]

sorry

 

[super animator]

So why did you move the argument to mathematics when I responded in regards to reality?

Your post makes it seems that you dismiss the entire notation of infinity. If I somehow misunderstood you then I apologize.

Bingo. Non-existence and infinity aren´t things in reality, in the first place.

1.) I'm not arguing they there exist or not, rather that can be differentiate from each other.
2.) I won't say that without evidence or a convincing argument that it's impossible for them to exist. If you have them, by all means let us hear it. I'm curious.

 

[SkyWriting]

I say no, because you can't measure infinity and non-existence, by definition.

They are each easy to distinguish from each other.
Booth ideas have values in different ways.
Near infinity has large proportions and getting
there provides numerous values.
Non-existence would be a number close to 1
and would be very hard to support based simply
on lack of information, locally.

 

[Eudaimonist]

How are you going to determine that it's a "something" besides measuring?

Are we talking about mathematics? Or physical entities (or the lack thereof)?

In mathematics, if you have an infinitely long line, you can still plot positions along the line.

If physical reality, if you have an infinitely large universe, you can still note your place within that universe.

What is the problem here?


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[quatona]

Your post makes it seems that you dismiss the entire notation of infinity.

I´m just pointing out that you have to make up your mind:
Either you want to talk about "infinity" and "non existence" as concepts. In which case they aren´t measurable because that´s what all abstract concepts have in common: they aren´t measurable. You can´t measure the abstract concept "seven", either.
Or you want to talk about them as descriptors of an amount of a measurable [X]. In which case they are distinguishable. No pizza is distinguishable from an infinite amout of pizza. You can distinguish them by measurement: No pizza isn´t measurable - because there´s nothing to measure. With an infinite amout of pizza, you can start your measurements - you just won´t get to finish them. So as soon as you can even start measuring something you can tell that it does not not exist.
.

1.) I'm not arguing they there exist or not, rather that can be differentiate from each other.

Measuring implies existence.

2.) I won't say that without evidence or a convincing argument that it's impossible for them to exist. If you have them, by all means let us hear it. I'm curious.

Me? I am not a guy who even tries to measure entirely abstract concepts.

 

[dysert]

I´m just pointing out that you have to make up your mind:
Either you want to talk about "infinity" and "non existence" as concepts. In which case they aren´t measurable because that´s what all abstract concepts have in common: they aren´t measurable. You can´t measure the abstract concept "seven", either.
Or you want to talk about them as descriptors of an amount of a measurable [X]. In which case they are distinguishable. No pizza is distinguishable from an infinite amout of pizza. You can distinguish them by measurement: No pizza isn´t measurable - because there´s nothing to measure. With an infinite amout of pizza, you can start your measurements - you just won´t get to finish them. So as soon as you can even start measuring something you can tell that it does not not exist.
.

Measuring implies existence.

Me? I am not a guy who even tries to measure entirely abstract concepts.

Where did you get the notion that "measuring implies existence"? And even if it did (which I don't think it does), infinity is still distinguishable from non-existence even with regard to measuring.

A non-existent pizza has a diameter of 0.
An infinitely large pizza has a diameter > 0.
They are distinguishable.

 

[BadHabit]

I immediately thought of an asymptotic line when the question was posed. Though this is just a construct to allow us to visualize concepts like infinity and non-existence. Interesting question.

 

[quatona]

Where did you get the notion that "measuring implies existence"?

Well, enlighten me. How do you go about measuring something that doesn´t exist?

And even if it did (which I don't think it does), infinity is still distinguishable from non-existence even with regard to measuring.

Yeah, that´s what I pointed out in regards to "infinity" and "non-existence" as amoutn descriptors.

A non-existent pizza has a diameter of 0.
An infinitely large pizza has a diameter > 0.
They are distinguishable.

Indeed another way of making my point - not sure why you are telling me that.

 

[Chriliman]

I say no, because you can't measure infinity and non-existence, by definition.

Yes, you can experience infinity(never ending existence) but you cannot experience non-existence. In that sense they are distinguishable.