Antichrist comes out from the church

[ewq1938]

The Gog Magog war will turn out to be the Syrian conflict of the last decade as all those countries mentioned have already been fighting and dying in the promised land given to Abraham. It will end when Jerusalem itself is threatened. We think of a full blown war like the world wars, but that is not necessarily the case.

How many times will all those nations be involved together in a conflict for it to fulfill a prophecy? Once? Twice? So far, all those countries have already been in conflict. The missing point is that this conflict effects the over all well being of the Israelites themselves. Since Jesus steps in to protect Jerusalem, how many times can Jerusalem actually be threatened before Christ the Prince steps in?

Where does the antichrist rule from during the Great Tribulation?

 

[Timtofly]

Yet if we accept your premise, When the apostles told their flocks "it's coming soon, without delay, it is near, about to take place, it IS the Last Hour", such terms were indeed meaningless to them.

How were the original receivers supposed to understand the apostles exhortations of soonness and nearness? It appears you are saying they were free to ignore them?

Again, when God says something is "far off" and not coming "for a long time" what does that mean?

If soon can be 10,000 years (which again renders soon to me meaningless) How long is "far off" to God?

Your presupposition is based on a cursed fig tree. Jesus based His point on a blooming fig tree.

So did Israel become a Sovereign Nation in 70AD? Or did Israel cease to exist altogether and millions killed or scattered across the earth in 70AD?

Correct. They asked about the signs of the end of the age THEY WERE IN. (The age you say ended at the cross)

They expected THAT age to end with Jesus' Parousia. Jesus NEVER corects or admonishes their understanding.

In contrast, you have the apostles asking about the end of an age they had no idea was even coming. If they had no idea it was coming, how could they ask about its end?



Rather, There have been several "Day of the Lord" events in Israel's history.
Lamentations is NOT prophesy. It is the LAMENTING of a PAST event, which the Author called "the day of the Lord".

Jesus did not answer what they asked about. Jesus answered what they needed to know.

 

[ewq1938]

Your presupposition is based on a cursed fig tree. Jesus based His point on a blooming fig tree.

And every other type of tree:

Luk 21:29 And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees;
Luk 21:30 When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand.
Luk 21:31 So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand.

Summer here is when Christ returns. There are signs of a coming summer in the spring, just after winter has ended. Winter is the dark time of the Great Tribulation. Spring is the ending of winter, the ending of the Great Tribulation. There are certain events that will tell us that Christ's return is near, like when the two prophets are killed and 3.5 days later resurrect. The second coming happens the day they ascend into heaven.

Winter = the main time of the Great Tribulation
Spring = trees start to blossom, Summer is near, the Great Tribulation will soon end.
Summer = the second coming happens and the thousand years/Millennium

 

[Timtofly]

Where does the antichrist rule from during the Great Tribulation?

Jerusalem after Jesus' Second Coming when He as Prince sets up His glorious throne.

Many argue over a temple. Jesus claims His glorious throne is part of that Temple. Where else would Jesus take residence and set up His glorious throne? It is not like Jesus needs a bedroom, nor dining room, nor even a living room.

When the 7th Trumpet sounds is when Daniel 9:27 is fulfilled. It is a week of days, not years. If God sees fit the week will be split, and Satan takes over. You will have to take that up with Satan, who is actually in charge. Don't trust someone's imagination from a book or movie. Which verse in Revelation does John even give pointing to an "AC"? The closest thing I see is the image that is the AoD, as the only beast mentioned as this "AC". The other two characters are Satan and the FP. Seems like they agree without killing each other over the throne for those 42 months.

 

[ewq1938]

Jerusalem after Jesus' Second Coming when He as Prince sets up His glorious throne.

Many argue over a temple. Jesus claims His glorious throne is part of that Temple. Where else would Jesus take residence and set up His glorious throne? It is not like Jesus needs a bedroom, nor dining room, nor even a living room.

When the 7th Trumpet sounds is when Daniel 9:27 is fulfilled. It is a week of days, not years. If God sees fit the week will be split, and Satan takes over. You will have to take that up with Satan, who is actually in charge. Don't trust someone's imagination from a book or movie. Which verse in Revelation does John even give pointing to an "AC"? The closest thing I see is the image that is the AoD, as the only beast mentioned as this "AC". The other two characters are Satan and the FP. Seems like they agree without killing each other over the throne for those 42 months.

I'm not seeing an answer here. Who is ruling during the Great Tribulation? Where does he or it rule from?

 

[Timtofly]

Summer here is when Christ returns. There are signs of a coming summer in the spring, just after winter has ended. Winter is the dark time of the Great Tribulation. Spring is the ending of winter, the ending of the Great Tribulation. There are certain events that will tell us that Christ's return is near, like when the two prophets are killed and 3.5 days later resurrect. The second coming happens the day they ascend into heaven.

The battle of Armageddon happens that Sunday between 5pm and 6pm. That is not the Second Coming. That is the 3.5 days left in the week, that Satan's 42 months split in half. The Second Coming was at the 6th Seal. John gives the sign of the Second Coming. The only sign is the actual Second Coming.

Winter = the main time of the Great Tribulation
Spring = trees start to blossom, Summer is near, the Great Tribulation will soon end.
Summer = the second coming happens and the thousand years/Millennium

This is just symbolism on top of symbolism. The literal part of the symbolic fig tree blooming is Israel became a Nation. Many trees became a Nation after World War 2.

 

[Servant78]

I'm not seeing an answer here. Who is ruling during the Great Tribulation? Where does he or it rule from?

Antichrist will rule Israel and the world from Jerusalem.

 

[Timtofly]

I'm not seeing an answer here. Who is ruling during the Great Tribulation? Where does he or it rule from?

Matthew 25:31-32 Jesus is in charge all the way to the end of the 1,000 years.

Satan's 42 months is not a given. It will only happen if necessary.

At the end of the 1,000 years this reality passes away. That is the end of the spoken Words given in Genesis 1. Back to the verses:

"Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only."

This fulfills even the passing away by Fire in 2 Peter 3. Creation will not pass away at the Second Coming. That passing away will not happen until after the 1,000 years.

There will be a new heaven and earth at the 6th Seal. Revelation 6:13-14

"And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places."

This scene is the creation of a new heavens and earth by fire. Yet many other changes happen during the Trumpets and Thunders. It will not be completed. Because Satan's 42 months come last. Satan does not get a "perfect earth". Satan gets a "renovation in progress."

 

[Sorn]

The Gog Magog war will turn out to be the Syrian conflict of the last decade as all those countries mentioned have already been fighting and dying in the promised land given to Abraham. It will end when Jerusalem itself is threatened. We think of a full blown war like the world wars, but that is not necessarily the case.

How many times will all those nations be involved together in a conflict for it to fulfill a prophecy? Once? Twice? So far, all those countries have already been in conflict. The missing point is that this conflict effects the over all well being of the Israelites themselves. Since Jesus steps in to protect Jerusalem, how many times can Jerusalem actually be threatened before Christ the Prince steps in?

"how many times can Jerusalem actually be threatened before Christ the Prince steps in?"
I think i read somewhere thats its exactly 5 1/2 times

 

[Douggg]

The Gog Magog war will turn out to be the Syrian conflict of the last decade as all those countries mentioned have already been fighting and dying in the promised land given to Abraham.

In Gog/Magog, Gog's army comes up against Israel. The prophecy has to take place in Israel because Gog's army is destroyed in the mountains of Israel.

Ezekiel 39:2 And I will turn thee back, and leave but the sixth part of thee, and will cause thee to come up from the north parts, and will bring thee upon the mountains of Israel:

3 And I will smite thy bow out of thy left hand, and will cause thine arrows to fall out of thy right hand.

4 Thou shalt fall upon the mountains of Israel, thou, and all thy bands, and the people that is with thee: I will give thee unto the ravenous birds of every sort, and to the beasts of the field to be devoured.

 

[ewq1938]

In Gog/Magog, Gog's army comes up against Israel. The prophecy has to take place in Israel because Gog's army is destroyed in the mountains of Israel.

Looks like the Gog Magog army is burned to death outside of Jerusalem not in the mountains:

Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

 

[Douggg]

Looks like the Gog Magog army is burned to death outside of Jerusalem not in the mountains:

Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Well, you are providing a good reason that Gog and Magog in Revelation 20:8 at the end of the thousand years is not the same Gog/Magog coming up very shortly.

 

[Sorn]

Gog / magog could also happen in a period of time between a rapture and the start of the tribulation

 

[Skye1300]

In my opinion I think the antichrist will be an alien being claiming to be benevolent, claiming to lead mankind into peace. A being having greater technology and claiming that his existence proves that God is not real. He will claim religion is "primitive" and abolish all religion to get at Christianity. People will follow him because they will think he is above politics and race and can be unbiased in all things since he's not of the human race. People will worship him and he will usher in a new world order. He will have all kind of advanced medicine for healing all diseases. Christians who oppose him will be treated as enemies of progress and persecuted and that's where the mark will come in for people to show their solidarity with that alien being.
I can't see a regular human pulling off something like that. People will not follow a man so blindly but they will follow a supposed good alien that way.

 

[JulieB67]

I can't see a regular human pulling off something like that.

A regular human won't be pulling it off.

Isaiah 14:12 "How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!"

Isaiah 14:13 "For thou hast said in thine heart, `I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:"

Isaiah 14:14 "I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the MOST HIGH."

These verses completely mirror what Paul taught,

II Thessalonians 2:3 "Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come , except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition

II Thessalonians 2:4 "Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God."

Only a supernatural entity who can perform miracles, etc pretending to be savior to the world will be able to pull it off.

 

[parousia70]

Your presupposition is based on a cursed fig tree. Jesus based His point on a blooming fig tree.

Rather Jesus based his point on ALL trees Blooming.
Luke 21:29

Jesus did not answer what they asked about. Jesus answered what they needed to know.

Jesus told THEM what THEY should watch for and what THEY would see and hear:

6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.

9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.

15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place,

20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

25 Behold, I have told you before.

26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; [and ALL trees cf: Luke 21:29] When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

Was He lying to THEM about that?

 

[Sorn]

In my opinion I think the antichrist will be an alien being claiming to be benevolent, claiming to lead mankind into peace. A being having greater technology and claiming that his existence proves that God is not real. He will claim religion is "primitive" and abolish all religion to get at Christianity. People will follow him because they will think he is above politics and race and can be unbiased in all things since he's not of the human race. People will worship him and he will usher in a new world order. He will have all kind of advanced medicine for healing all diseases. Christians who oppose him will be treated as enemies of progress and persecuted and that's where the mark will come in for people to show their solidarity with that alien being.
I can't see a regular human pulling off something like that. People will not follow a man so blindly but they will follow a supposed good alien that way.

The antichrist will be worshiped as a god & as God, thats what so angers God. An alien claiming there is no god could hardly then expect to be worshiped as one. Whatever technology he brings once its shared, then will allow us to do the same. So he won't be an alien.

 

[Zao is life]

"how many times can Jerusalem actually be threatened before Christ the Prince steps in?"
I think i read somewhere thats its exactly 5 1/2 times

What if the only holy city God is interested in, is the only city the Revelation calls the holy city?

 

[Timtofly]

Looks like the Gog Magog army is burned to death outside of Jerusalem not in the mountains:

Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

We are not talking about that Gog confrontation. We are talking about the one in the 6th Seal. At least, I am. Certainly not the army in Revelation 19 at Armageddon. John was specific in Revelation 20, yet did not mention Gog in the 6th Seal, because the Seals are concerning the church, and from the church's perspective, not Israel's.

 

[Timtofly]

In Gog/Magog, Gog's army comes up against Israel. The prophecy has to take place in Israel because Gog's army is destroyed in the mountains of Israel.

Ezekiel 39:2 And I will turn thee back, and leave but the sixth part of thee, and will cause thee to come up from the north parts, and will bring thee upon the mountains of Israel:

3 And I will smite thy bow out of thy left hand, and will cause thine arrows to fall out of thy right hand.

4 Thou shalt fall upon the mountains of Israel, thou, and all thy bands, and the people that is with thee: I will give thee unto the ravenous birds of every sort, and to the beasts of the field to be devoured.

Israel promised to Abraham? Or the Israel recognized by today's UN?

Some don't even think Israel should control the Golan Heights.