Andrea Yates Guilty- God

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MyJhongFist

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A jury of eight women and four men found Andrea Pia Yates, the Houston mom who admitted to drowning her five children, guilty of capital murder Tuesday after deliberating for less than four hours.


State District Judge Belinda Hill, who read the verdict, initially said jurors would begin hearing testimony Wednesday in the punishment phase of the case, then gave lawyers an additional day to prepare. Court was reset for Thursday morning.

Yates, 37, who pleaded innocent by reason of insanity to two capital murder charges, faces life in prison or the death penalty for the drownings of 7-year-old Noah, 5-year-old John and 6-month-old Mary. Charges later could be filed in the deaths of Paul, 3, and Luke, 2.

The jury had heard testimony from 38 witnesses over more than three weeks in reaching its guilty verdict.

There was no apparent reaction from Yates, who stood between her attorneys as the verdict was read. The arm of one of them was around her.

Yates' husband, Russell, muttered: "Oh, God," as Hill read the verdict. Then he buried his head in his clasped hands and remained seated silently even as the spectators stood while the jury exited.

Dora Yates wrapped her right arm around her son and held him. Russell Yates' brother Randy, sitting on the other side of their mother, shook his head after the verdict was read.

Defense psychiatric expert Lucy Puryear hugged Jutta Kennedy, Andrea Yates' mother, as they left the courtroom. Some Yates relatives cried.

Prosecutors left the courthouse without comment.

"I'm not critiquing or criticizing the verdict," George Parnham, one of Yates' lawyers, said. "But it seems to me we are still back in the days of the Salem witch trials."

He described Andrea Yates as "very upset" and said her reaction to the verdict was "not good, as you can imagine."



"I thought we laid out a strong case," he said. "As you can imagine, it's devastating and extremely disappointing."

Both the state and the defense agreed Yates suffered from a severe mental disease and that she killed her five children last June 20 by holding them under water in their own bathtub until they stopped breathing.

What expert witnesses during the trial disagreed on, however, was whether Yates knew killing her children was wrong.

In Texas, a defendant is presumed sane. To prove insanity, defense attorneys had to convince jurors Yates suffered from a severe mental disease or defect, specifically postpartum depression with severe psychosis, which prevented her from knowing her actions were wrong.

"If drowning five children by a loving mother isn't a gross psychosis, there isn't any such thing as gross psychosis," defense lawyer Wendell Odom said in his closing arguments to the jury earlier Tuesday.

In the closing arguments, defense attorneys said Yates loved her children so much she killed them.

"We can't permit objective logic to be imposed on the actions of Andrea Yates," Parnham said. "She was so psychotic on June 20 that she absolutely believed what she was doing was the right thing to do."

Defense expert Phillip Resnick, among witnesses during more than three weeks of testimony, said while Yates knew drowning her children was illegal, in her psychotic delusional mind she thought it was the only way to save her children from eternal damnation.

Resnick said Yates thought Satan lived within her and the state would execute her for her children's killings, thus eliminating evil from the world.

Prosecutor Kaylynn Williford said Yates must be held accountable for cutting her children's lives short. Yates didn't start claiming Satan lived within her or referring to a prophecy until the day after her arrest when she realized she had killed her five children and found herself naked in a jail cell, Williford argued.

She said Yates, a former nurse, had thought about harming her children for years and ignored a doctor's orders in 1999 to refrain from having any more by getting pregnant with her youngest child, Mary.



FNC
Russell Yates reacts to the verdict.
"Andrea Yates knew right from wrong and she made a choice on June 20 to kill her children," Williford said. "She made that choice to have Mary. She made that choice to fill the tub."

About 2 hours into their discussions, jurors passed a note to State District Judge Belinda Hill asking for a definition of insanity. Hill replied with the Texas legal definition, describing it as a severe mental disease or defect that keeps someone from recognizing their conduct was wrong.

While expert witnesses had testified about Yates' mental defects and whether she knew her actions were wrong, the specific legal determination of insanity should be left to jurors to decide, experts had said. During questioning before they were selected, jurors also were instructed by lawyers about the definition.

Thirty minutes later, jurors asked for a cassette player, which was provided. Among items in evidence are audio tapes of Yates' confession and her 911 telephone call to police the day of the drownings.

Williford pointed to Yates' statements to police on the day of the drownings and how the stay-at-home mother told police Sgt. Eric Mehl during her confession that when Noah tried to run from her, "I got him."

"She got him and the loving act of this mother was to leave his body in the tub ... floating in the vomit and the feces and the urine that had been expelled in that water by the four who had gone before him," Williford said. "She never told any of those officers that she killed those children to save them."

Yates sobbed quietly as Williford described the condition police found her children. Her husband, Russell, his arms crossed, sat a few rows back in the courtroom spectator section. Yates' mother and brothers sat on the opposite side of the courtroom.

Defense attorneys urged jurors to remember Yates' actions were those of a diagnosed schizophrenic suffering from psychosis.

"I implore you to please, please, not allow that horrific set of circumstances -- Noah, John, Paul, Luke, and precious Mary -- to take your eye off the prize, to deflect your attention from the very issue that you must come to grips with in this case," Parnham said.

"She killed those children out of love because a loving mother will do anything to save her children from danger," said Odom, Parnham's defense partner.

Neither the state nor the defense contested that she suffered from a severe mental disease or that she killed her five children.

"She may have believed it was in the best interest of the children to drown them one after the other, but that's not the law in Texas," prosecutor Joe Owmby said.

"It's not that I am without sympathy or that you are without sympathy," he added. "You have to decide this case based on the facts of the law. ... Find her guilty as charged because that's what she is."
 

ZiSunka

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>>"If drowning five children by a loving mother isn't a gross psychosis, there isn't any such thing as gross psychosis," defense lawyer Wendell Odom said in his closing arguments to the jury earlier Tuesday.<<

That's circular reasoning if ever I heard it! We know she's sick because she killed her children? Wouldn't that be a reasonable defense for anyone committing any murder? "But Judge! I must have been crazy, because I killed my children! You have to be crazy to kill children, right?"

From what I heard, the jury thought the clincher was the testimony that Andrea Yates have seen a TV show in which and unhappy mother was acquitted of murder in the drowning death of her child by reason of insanity. She watched the program a few days before she first attempted the murders. A few days after that, she carried out the murders. It apparently seemed to the jury that Yates, to some extent, was rational enough to plot the murders to be identical to the one she saw someone else get away with.
 
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Didymus

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I don t know whether Mrs yates was insane or not I ll leave that up to god. But I do know having to live with the knowledge that you killed you children for the rest of your life and knowing that most people think you are a monster woould be more af a punishment then killing her.
I feel such pity for this woman--I hate what she did-it makes me sick- but oh oh what terriable torture she must have been under to even think of doing such a thing.
 
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Debbie

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It is a myth to believe that someone has to be a tortured soul to commit such a crime as this. This reasoning by previous jurors, has caused the evil murders to be set free, such as one juror in another case said, "Well a person would have to be insane to kill their children".
The fact is, that evil people also kill their children, for their own selfish reasons. Does that mean they are tortured souls? No, they sleep very well at night. The only reason they cry is when things don't go their way.
Those few who do manage to get an intelligent, street wise jury & get convicted, only cry when their fellow inmates mistreat them, or when they are frustrated by being locked up.
Most insane people have a sense of fear, and recognize it in other people, including children. Very few people in this world are so insane that they don't know right from wrong in a situation of forcible murder. Those people usually are not sane enough to carry out 5 murders in a row in one day, then come to their senses & call 911. Give me a break.
I also question Mr. Yates' love for his children. No one can convince me he didnt live in the same house & not see his children's lives were in danger. He obviously cared more about his wife than his children. I can tell you that there are parents in this world who do not care about the lives of their children, who both murder their children & hide the bodies together & lie to the police together, while simultaneously professing their love for each other. This is a similar case. He was just hoping she would get away with it.
 
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jrmorganjr

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We may not know what she was thinking, but we do know the following. Whatever she was thinking must never be allowed to see the light of society again. It's tantamount to saying she can go out and murder again - just make sure you claim to be insane when you do it so we can let you go again.

I feel compassion for this woman, even as God had mercy on Cain. But she should not be allowed to ever enter society again. She confessed she knew it was wrong, therefore not insane, and therefore culpable.

Do not these children's blood call from the ground? Compassion must be balanced with justice and visca versa. Focusing on compassion for her is to be lacking in compassion for the slain, and destroys justice.
 
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ZiSunka

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>>NONE OF US knows what either of the Yates were thinking.<<

That's why it is vital that we pray that justice will prevail. She'll go through appeals, and anything could yet happen.

Without justice, there is no mercy, and without mercy, there is no justice. The thing is to find the appropriate balance.
 
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VOW

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Originally posted by lambslove
Without justice, there is no mercy, and without mercy, there is no justice. The thing is to find the appropriate balance.

Exactly. People need to be educated on how to become more involved in their own medical care. If Mr Yates had confronted the administration of the psychiatric hospital and DEMANDED that his wife be cared for, then perhaps the children would still be alive.

Go back one step further: both the Yateses needed to be conherently educated as to what caused post-partum psychosis, and that she should not have undergone another pregnancy.

When she stopped taking her prescribed medication, Child Welfare should have been notified, and the children removed from the home. The State has the authority to take children from a parent who does not pass a drug screening exam; it should also have the authority to remove a child from a home where a parent refuses to take psychoactive drugs.

The shame of Andrea Yates belongs to us all.


Peace be with you,
~VOW
 
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Debbie

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The shame of Andrea Yates does not belong to me in anyway. I'm sure you meant something else.
People used to be able to lock up their family members in institutions very easily. This system was abused by evildoers & well intentioned people. This was recognized & most mental institutions began dissolvement by the states about 30 yrs ago. Very few remain in each state. It was determined that people were forced mental treatment, labotomies, etc. Many of the incarcerated insane could do well on their own with severe mental problems, thus began out patient mental health clinics, and section 8 housing which every major city now has.
But now we have gone to the other extreme & can only change this by law. A middle ground is enacted by law in my state, which includes 2 family members, not one, going to a judge who will order mental treatment against the will of the patient, who will immediately be housed by the signature of the judge. Mr Yates may or may not have known this.
ANd unless you believe in forcible, court ordered sterilization, we cannot stop these child murderers from repeatedly having children & murdering them. It has happened before that a parent has served time for killing one child, gets released from prison & kills another child.
 
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VOW

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To Debbie:

In many states, a mentally ill person must exhibit behavior that indicates he or she is a threat to himself or others, and even then can only be held for 72 hours unless the physician can prove that the individual will continue this threat. Lawsuits filed by special interest groups have burdened the legal system so that many times police and social workers will NOT initiate the 72 hour hold, because of the repercussions of "denying a person their civil rights."

The push to end institutionalization began in the late '60s to early '70s. The availability of psychoactive drugs which controlled the major symptoms of mental illness created a strange hydra-type creature, consisting of social workers, civil libertarians, and politicians interested in saving money. Long-term mental patients were packed off to halfway houses with prescriptions and very little follow up care. There were even instances where midwestern States emptied their mental hospitals by giving the inmates a one-way bus ticket to California.

After the civil libertarians triumphed in "saving the people," and the politicians made their sweeping budget cuts, the halfway houses closed down, and these mentally ill people were placed in boarding houses under the supervision of extremely overburdened social workers. The 72-hour hold laws were enacted. And the minimum age for consent to mental treatment was placed at 16. The mentally ill stopped taking the psychoactive drugs, and then the symptoms returned. They may have stopped personal hygeine, even paying their bills, and forgot to buy food. Many, MANY of the homeless in major cities are these "forgotten people."

The age of consent at 16 means if you have a teen living at home who is acting out, exhibiting signs of mental illness, is abusing drugs and alcohol, quite simply, as a parent, YOU cannot take this child to a hospital and say, "The kid needs help." The CHILD must sign in him or herself.

Should the child do so, you could very well receive a call the next day from the hospital saying your insurance will not cover inpatient care.

As members of society, YES, the abysmal state of mental health care IS our shame. If you pay taxes, if you vote, the burden is on you.


Peace be with you,
~VOW
 
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ZiSunka

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Exactly. People need to be educated on how to become more involved in their own medical care. If Mr Yates had confronted the administration of the psychiatric hospital and DEMANDED that his wife be cared for, then perhaps the children would still be alive.

Oh, I think that the husband and doctor must share the culpability...
 
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JohnR7

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>>The mentally ill stopped taking the psychoactive drugs, and then the symptoms returned.

The "symptons" never went away, they just became more controlable. Jesus did not tell people to go to the witch doctor and take mind controling drugs so that they would become managable and easy for society to deal with. He cast demons out of them and He healed them.

To many people claim to be Christian and have none of the power of God in them. If people want to call themselves Christians, then they should do the works Jesus did.

Mark 5:15 Then they came to Jesus, and saw the one who had been demon-possessed and had the legion, sitting and clothed and in his right mind. And they were afraid.
 
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To JohnR7:

The parents of an infant with meningitis put their "trust in God" to heal their child, and the baby died. They are being prosecuted for child neglect.

Psychiatrists, reputable psychiatrists, are not "witch doctors." Many mental illnesses are caused by an imbalance of the neurotransmitter chemicals in the brain, and medication CAN and often DOES control or eliminate the manifestations of the mental disease.

God gave us marvelous, inventive, imaginative brains, and we have incredible wonders at our disposal today because of the things those wonderful brains have created. Modern medicine is one of them. I don't put 100% of my trust in medicine, that would be foolish. But then, I'm not going to avoid getting an antibiotic prescription the next time I have a sinus infection.


Peace be with you,
~VOW
 
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