An argument against Christian rap/rock that doesn't really make any sense.

[Sammy-San]

Some Christians say that CCM (such as christian metal/christian hip hop music) is wrong because the beat/rhythm is appealing to the flesh/feeds the flesh.

According to gotquestions.org, the term "flesh" means the sinful nature of humans. (What is the flesh?). What's sinful about the beat of rock music? Percussion instruments were used in the Bible.

So, what does it mean that CMM "appeals to the flesh", and how exactly does it make Christian rap/rock wrong?

 

[JothamDavidParker]

Yeah, it's a bad argument. I wouldn't say instrumentation and style are irrelevant. You don't want downer music with happy words for example. I think anyone would be hard-pressed to prove--Biblically or otherwise--how one beat appeals to the flesh but not another.

I think the main question is whether a certain style is appropriate for the subject matter, like I said above. I think another consideration is what the audience might associate a certain style with, but that's wandering toward the subjective and variable.

 

[SaltwaterHeart]

I can't speak for hip-hop, but rock music has a history of backmasking. Classic rock and heavy metal, in particular, have been known to contain Satanic backmasking - some of which is actually there, some of which is not. I've read that some people don't agree with CCM, because of its genre of origin.

I think that this is stupid. If you are using your music to praise God, and you're not creating subliminal messages with it, then the genre really doesn't matter.

 

[ChildOfTheLight]

I find the beat to be irrelevant to the message. As far as I am concerned you can scream the lyrics into my ear. If the message is there it's there, if it's not it's not. My opinion.

 

[WolfGate]

I've come to realize some people try to make their preferences be a matter of right or wrong. If they don't like it, it isn't proper. A form of legalistic pride, actually.

 

[Chainless]

I always thought it was funny one church is like "there will be no guitar and drum here!" then hit that organ for half an hour. I wonder how long it took for the organ to be acceptable. Then I read Psalms and facepalm.

It is good to give thanks to the Lord,
to sing praises to your name, O Most High;
to declare your steadfast love in the morning,
and your faithfulness by night,
to the music of the lute and the harp,
to the melody of the lyre.

Praise him with trumpet sound;
praise him with lute and harp!
Praise him with tambourine and dance;
praise him with strings and pipe!
Praise him with sounding cymbals;
praise him with loud clashing cymbals!
Let everything that has breath praise the Lord!
Praise the Lord!

Shout for joy in the Lord, O you righteous!
Praise befits the upright.
Give thanks to the Lord with the lyre;
make melody to him with the harp of ten strings!
Sing to him a new song;
play skillfully on the strings, with loud shouts.

 

[USCGrad90]

I think if you look back into the roots of most music, you can find that certains styles developed from others, such as metal being originally influenced by blues-rock.
I consider all music to be from God and just like anything, man can corrupt what God created. Too many Christians get hung up on this on what they consider sacred versus sacreligious. Here's a link to an article by Jon Foreman, lead singer of Switchfoot. He summarizes his thoughts well on this issue.
Why Switchfoot won’t sing Christian songs | ctkblog

 

[evanjroberts]

It appears you can only get to that observation interpreting texts, there's no direct passage against a backbeat as there is against piercing. They use texts like "make melody in your heart" and link it to the shift away from melody from hymns to rock. But ignore the Psalms where David said to make a loud noise with the cymbals etc. However, it's our job to love those who say this. We'll probably get used to Chrstian rock and criticise kids who want christian RnB in church soon haha!

 

[Sketcher]

Simply put, there is no argument that is consistent with rightly divided Scripture that tells us that any major music genre is inherently bad, and that Christians must avoid it. I can see a case against black metal as a whole, Christian artists who produce similar music do not call it black metal for a reason. But other than that, any genre of music is perfectly acceptable.

 

[jmcorn]

I agree that this a silly argument. I think it is just Legalism at its finest. They think if it doesn't have a piano and organ playing soft and slow it is not correct.

 

[Bass4Jesus]

My band recently introduced "Awake My Soul" to a Lutheran church in the area. They loved it and so did the pastor. Average age 40s-50s. But I will admit Lecrae's lyrics do make sense, as opposed to the bands that claim to be Christian but you'd need bloodhounds and metal detectors to find even a shred.

To bootstrap off what jmcorn said, piano and organ ain't gonna do it when it comes to younger folks. You have to hit 'em with what they already like, and hit 'em hard so the lyrics hook in deep and tight and they go home remembering. Give 'em Fireflight, Third Day, Kutless, Skillet. The earlier we get 'em, the less likely they are to screw up their lives.

Someone mentioned the appealing to the flesh concern. That ain't necessarily bad when it comes to fishing for souls. Jesus appealed to the flesh to get things started, yeah? (Eyes opened, ears opened, lamenesses gone, skin conditions gone.) Passing out tracts can go only so far. Lotsa people forget tracts or use them for toothpicks. No one forgets a Christian Metal concert.

 

[holyrokker]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5QifC5koSA

 

[WannaWitness]

Those arguments make absolutely no sense to me. I remember growing up during the time when many legalistic church leaders were raising a big stink over the Christian rock/CCM. There were all kinds of goofy ideas, including "it sounds worldly" and "the even-numbered beats are demonic", and such. But what some of these people fail to realize is that the "traditional" or "grass-roots" music they prefer was considered popular at one time, and that many classic hymns were said to have been set to the tunes of the popular folk and barroom music of the time. This shows that this reasoning is flawed because they are enjoying the more traditional music in the same way that the CCM fans enjoy music. And "enjoying" something doesn't mean it's "of the flesh", as long as there is something positive and pure to be gained from it, and as long as one can be thankful to God for providing it. Entertainment, in itself, is not wrong, as long as God has first place and the things we choose to take into our minds doesn't go against what the Word of God really says.

Of course, I realize that this (along with other things) can be an honest conviction of some Christians. I mean, anyone who is uncomfortable listening to a certain kind of music should in fact follow their convictions and stay away from it. But we should also realize that convictions can be different, and according to Romans 14, Christians should respect one another despite that.

Here is a link I have followed for quite a while in which the author analyzes the various arguments against CCM and its artists and listeners. It is pretty interesting, but long, so it's best read in sections.

CCM Controversy

 

[WeakSaint]

I think that this is stupid. If you are using your music to praise God, and you're not creating subliminal messages with it, then the genre really doesn't matter.

Exactly!

 

[djsciple]

Hi SuperheroSam. This is a tough debate. From what I've studied on this subject what makes the debate difficult is what was the originally intended purpose of the style of music has become. For example, Rock and Roll was named that for what it implies. Rap too has gone the opposite direction of its origins and roots. Trance for example is usually created in minor keys, which is a depressing key since the songs are usually about loss or sadness.

That begs the question then, should it be associated with Christian music. Well, in the Bible we know David danced and God was glorified. It should always be about glorifying God. We were designed to worship God. Jews took the extreme after they were almost annihilated, they banned all musical instruments except the shofar for its visceral sound.

Listen, we live in a world where the prince of this world is not Jesus, it's Satan. If I can reach out to people to listen to music and praise God, Amen. But I might be more cautious driving down the street listening to a Christian rap song that has the same beat and chords as a song by a glorified popular rap artist. Even thought the lyrics are Christian, the people hearing it are actually singing the original song in their head and probably questioning you as a Christian as well. My thoughts on the subject.

 

[Willing Spirit]

For example, Rock and Roll was named that for what it implies.

What does it imply?

 

[djsciple]

Hi Willing Spirit, unfortunate "rock and roll" is a sexual anology. The original phrase I think was "rocking and rolling of a ship on the ocean. Which is a pity because the original rock and roll music had African American roots and was equated with the blues usually accompanied by a beat.

 

[WannaWitness]

Check out another interesting link regarding some of the arguments in Christian music.

Three Strikes in the Attack On Christian Music

 

[Willing Spirit]

Hi Willing Spirit, unfortunate "rock and roll" is a sexual anology.

Hi djsciple, I thought that was what you meant. But was rock and roll named after sex? The term "rock and roll" never did have an exclusively sexual meaning. It was a term often used to describe sex, but it also was a term that often referred to dancing (something that early rock music tended to inspire). It also had other meanings. This article describes what I'm saying in more detail:

Morgan Wright's HoyHoy.com: The Dawn of Rock 'n Roll

Allan Freed is credited with coining the term for the music. According to him he applied this term because "it seemed to suggest the rolling, surging beat of the music." What does this have to do with sex? My own mother made the comment that a lot of my music has a rolling quality. Related to this, it should be remembered that boogie woogie (an earlier style that strongly influenced rock and roll) was known by names such as "rolling western blues" and "the rocks".

The original phrase I think was "rocking and rolling of a ship on the ocean.

Yes that is correct.