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An Apology to Seraphim and TAW

Discussion in 'The Ancient Way - Eastern Orthodox' started by Light of the East, Dec 2, 2020.

  1. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    First of all, I ask forgiveness for my offense. What I said was not intended in the manner in which you received it, and perhaps that is because of a clumsy presentation. What I was trying to state was that there is truth to what Gurney said. Eastern Catholics do not know who or what they are. I think that the men who signed the Union of Brest would be horrified at how watered down the Orthodox of the Eastern Catholics has become and how the people in Eastern Catholic churches have no clue as to what it means to be Orthodox.

    The Unia (which simply means "union") was supposed to be to allow the Orthodox in that region to continue to be distinctly Orthodox while enjoying the protection of Rome from nearby pagan invaders. The 35 canons of the Union of Brest give clear statements to this effect. Unfortunately, Rome slowly allowed those to erode over the years, culminating in what happened here in the USA where the Irish bishops trampled on the theological and eclessiastical rights of the Ruthenians and Ukrainians who came to settle here. Bishop Basil Tachak was called to Rome and told point blank there would be no married priests in America. Does the name Bishop Ireland ring a bell? It was a sad time in the 20th century.

    YOU SAID: 3) You have it backwards. Byzantine Catholics and other Easterners have perfectly valid Catholic theology that is very close to what the Orthodox believe. Eastern Catholics are not Orthodox, and the kind folks here in TAW will be the first to tell you that.

    But you have it backwards. When I was looking at converting from Protestantism, I was told that I could be "Orthodox in Communion with Rome." I was uninformed and did not realize that that this is simply impossible for the same reason that we do not allow Protestants to partake of the Eucharist. To be "in communion" means that accept and beleive in the same doctrines, and it should be obvious that this just ain't so. Orthodoxy has serious issues with certain Western teachings. To be Orthodox means that you adhere to Orthodox theology, eschatology, soteriology - all the panopoly of beliefs which are distinctly Orthodox. After three years in seminary, where for the first time I was really confronted with the differences between East and West, I have struggled for years to find a happy medium in which to operate, but I have found it impossible. I am not Roman Catholic, my beliefs coincide with Orthodox, my Prayer Rule follows Orthodoxy, and I follow the Orthodox horologion. The only thing left to do is to get my body into an Orthodox parish, and I am having fits doing that.

    I did not mean this as a knock against individuals in the Roman Catholic Church. I say without qualification that there are many people in that body whose love for Christ is more pure than mine and whose Christian lives shine much better than mine. I was simply trying to make a point that the Eastern Catholic Church is a very confused body, and as Pope Francis stated, really should make the decision to be either Orthodox or Roman Catholic.

    In 2001 I joined the Ruthenians, thinking that I could be Orthodox and in Communion with Rome. I wish the Orthodox priest I knew had sat me down and discussed things with me. I was told that he assumed I was going to join his parish, and as a Protestant coming into the apostolic faith, I didn't know Jack Squat about any of this. I was just happy to find the beauty of the Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom and the ancient faith which honored the Eucharist as the Body and Blood of Christ and not some bare memorial meal. It was the culmination of two years of study, but that study was colored by associations with devout Roman Catholics who directed me towards the Eastern Catholic faith.

    I hope you will read this, Seraphim, and I again ask your forgiveness for the offense. If you are reading this, please do return.

    (I went to post this and the thread has been closed. I will try to find Seraphim and personally offer my apoloies. I hope he will reconsider. I am dismayed that this has happened.)
     
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  2. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    I don't think you said anything offensive. I just think you were speaking of your own intellectual wrangling.

    but I agree that I hope he comes back.
     
  3. Light of the East

    Light of the East Orthodox Inquirer Supporter

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    Thank you for those kind words of encouragement. I have felt bad about this since it happened. I really don't want to offend people, but at the same time, I don't want to whitewash what I experienced or have discovered from my studies. I just wish that dear Fr. Dan had sat me down 20 years ago before I made my commitment to the East and had a long, catechetical talk with me about what I knew and where I was going. Would have saved me a bunch of heartache and confusion.

    (FYI - Fr. Dan was Orthodox priest at a parish I was attending on Saturday nights for Vespers)
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2020
  4. ArmyMatt

    ArmyMatt Regular Member Supporter

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    God knows what He's doing with us, and He knows when to bring us home to the Church.
     
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