Amos 3:7, the New Testament & the Commandments

[SAAN]

Amos 3:7
7 Surely the Lord God does nothing, Unless He reveals His secret to His servants the prophets.


This verse makes it pretty clear that God does nothing that he doesn't reveal through his prophets first. There are the Messianic Prophecies Fulfilled by Jesus and other examples like sending a messenger(John the baptist), the telling of the future in Daniel and some of the other Prophets that agree with Revelations, and more.


So where in any of the prophets did God reveal to them that the 10 commandments were temporary or that he was going to abolish all of his commands in the future???

 

[Yanni depp]

Isaiah 53:5-12

But John 14:15

 

[frienden thalord]

In issiah it was foretold as in other prophets.........
God would not abolish his law, but would put it in our hearts by Christ.
And yes God does warn first before any judgment comes.
This is why I must warn us all .............a judgment is upon the land
its a judgment of great delusion. Leading the unrepentant right to the lie.
The lie that God is in all religions has began to the upmost
and will lead to the man of sin. More and more the unrepentant are buying
the desire for world peace and unity and interfaith has been born.
A lie spawned from the depths of great darkness . But more and more
are buying into it. The true GOD never said I am in all religions
in fact HE said...DO NOT WORSHP their gods. they false.
More and more they will belive the lie that all peoples will be saved
and that all religins are a way to GOD. A lie of utter darkness, but it is increasing.

 

[1John2:4]

Isaiah 53:5-12

But John 14:15

How do these verses do away with God's commandments?

5 But He was wounded for our transgressions,
He was bruised for our iniquities;
The chastisement for our peace wasupon Him,
And by His stripes we are healed.
6 All we like sheep have gone astray;
We have turned, every one, to his own way;
And the Lord has laid on Him the iniquity of us all.

7 He was oppressed and He was afflicted,
Yet He opened not His mouth;
He was led as a lamb to the slaughter,
And as a sheep before its shearers is silent,
So He opened not His mouth.
8 He was taken from prison and from judgment,
And who will declare His generation?
For He was cut off from the land of the living;
For the transgressions of My people He was stricken.
9 And they made His grave with the wicked—
But with the rich at His death,
Because He had done no violence,
Nor was any deceit in His mouth.

10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise Him;
He has put Him to grief.
When You make His soul an offering for sin,
He shall see His seed, He shall prolong His days,
And the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in His hand.
11 He shall see the labor of His soul,and be satisfied.
By His knowledge My righteous Servant shall justify many,
For He shall bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will divide Him a portion with the great,
And He shall divide the spoil with the strong,
Because He poured out His soul unto death,
And He was numbered with the transgressors,
And He bore the sin of many,
And made intercession for the transgressors.

15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments

 

[Yanni depp]

How do these verses do away with God's commandments?

Just giving some food for thought on the thread.

I thought the verses in Isaiah might be a close reference to what the OP was referring to, in that it tells of the New Covenant

And in saying "But John 14:15" im saying im not sure i would agree that the commandments were done away with.

 

[1John2:4]

Just giving some food for thought on the thread.

I thought the verses in Isaiah might be a close reference to what the OP was referring to, in that it tells of the New Covenant

And in saying "But John 14:15" im saying im not sure i would agree that the commandments were done away with.

I was just curious, I did not really understand why you posted those verses, thanks

 

[Bob S]

First of all God told Moses to tell the Israelites that Ex19:5 "if you obey me fully and keep my covenant, then out of all nations you will be my treasured possession. Although the whole earth is mine, 6 you will be for me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words you are to speak to the Israelites.”

A covenant is binding between two parties as long as the requirements are met. Israel didn't obey the covenant and God had no other choice that to scatter Jews all over the World because they failed.

The covenant was only permanent as long as both parties lived up to the agreement and Israel failed. Therefore the all of the laws of the covenant that were binding came to an end at Calvary when Jesus fulfilled Torah and declared "it is finished".

Were not the 10 commandments part of Torah? Were not the words of the Apostle Paul in 2Cor 3:7-11 declaring that the 10 commandments were transitory and doesn't that mean temporary?

7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! 10 For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. 11 And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!

Israelites were blessed with the 10 commandments, new covenant Christians are blessed with the gift of the Holy Spirit.

 

[BobRyan]

Amos 3:7
7 Surely the Lord God does nothing, Unless He reveals His secret to His servants the prophets.


This verse makes it pretty clear that God does nothing that he doesn't reveal through his prophets first. There are the Messianic Prophecies Fulfilled by Jesus and other examples like sending a messenger(John the baptist), the telling of the future in Daniel and some of the other Prophets that agree with Revelations, and more.


So where in any of the prophets did God reveal to them that the 10 commandments were temporary or that he was going to abolish all of his commands in the future???

In Matt 5 Jesus rejects the suggestion that his mission is to dismiss or downsize God's Commandments. He even condemns those who teach against God's Commandments.


Rev 14:12 "the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus"
Notice how Jesus Himself claims that this means KEEPING the "Father's Commandment"

John 14
9 Jesus *said to him, “Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father is in Me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on My own initiative, but the Father abiding in Me does His works.

John 12
49 For I did not speak on My own initiative, but the Father Himself who sent Me has given Me commandment as to what to say and what to speak. 50 I know that His commandment is eternal life; therefore the things I speak, I speak just as the Father has told Me.”

Matt 19
17 And He said to him, “Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.” 18 Then he *said to Him, “Which ones?” And Jesus said, “You shall not commit murder; You shall not commit adultery; You shall not steal; You shall not bear false witness; 19 Honor your father and mother; and You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 20 The young man *said to Him, “All these things I have kept; what am I still lacking?” 21 Jesus said to him, “If you wish to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”

Jesus is the one speaking the TEN Commandments - AND - the New Covenant

Hebrews 8:6-10
1 Now the main point in what has been said is this: we have such a high priest, who has taken His seat at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, 2 a minister in the sanctuary and in the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, not man.

6 But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, by as much as He is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises.
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, there would have been no occasion sought for a second. 8 For finding fault with them, He says,
“Behold, days are coming, says the Lord,
When I will effect a new covenant
With the house of Israel and with the house of Judah;
9 Not like the covenant which I made with their fathers
On the day when I took them by the hand
To lead them out of the land of Egypt;
For they did not continue in My covenant,
And I did not care for them, says the Lord.
10 “For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel
After those days, says the Lord:
I will put My laws into their minds,
And I will write them on their hearts.
And I will be their God,
And they shall be My people.

And since as we see in Heb 8 - Jesus is the one giving the TEN Commandments - speaking at Sinai... "If you Love ME KEEP My Commandments" John 14:15 as a direct quote of "Love Me and KEEP My Commandments" Exodus 20:6 is perfectly explained for all to see - even the majority of pro-Sunday Scholarship agrees to this Bible detail.

Jesus said "God's Commandment" and "Moses said" and "Word of God" are terms that all apply to the Ten Commandments.

Mark 7
6 He answered and said to them, “Well did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:
‘This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
7 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’
8 For laying aside the commandment of God, you hold the tradition of men —the washing of pitchers and cups, and many other such things you do.”
9 He said to them, “All too well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition. 10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 11 But you say, ‘If a man says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is Corban”—’ (that is, a gift to God), 12 then you no longer let him do anything for his father or his mother, 13 making the Word of God of no effect through your tradition which you have handed down. And many such things you do.”

the majority of pro-sunday scholars affirm that the "Commandments of God" include God's TEN Commandments.

A Bible detail so incredibly obvious - BOTH sides admit to it. "It just does not GET any easier than this!"

 

[1John2:4]

First of all God told Moses to tell the Israelites that Ex19:5 "if you obey me fully and keep my covenant, then out of all nations you will be my treasured possession. Although the whole earth is mine, 6 you will be for me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words you are to speak to the Israelites.”

A covenant is binding between two parties as long as the requirements are met. Israel didn't obey the covenant and God had no other choice that to scatter Jews all over the World because they failed.

The covenant was only permanent as long as both parties lived up to the agreement and Israel failed. Therefore the all of the laws of the covenant that were binding came to an end at Calvary when Jesus fulfilled Torah and declared "it is finished".

Were not the 10 commandments part of Torah? Were not the words of the Apostle Paul in 2Cor 3:7-11 declaring that the 10 commandments were transitory and doesn't that mean temporary?

7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! 10 For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. 11 And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!

Israelites were blessed with the 10 commandments, new covenant Christians are blessed with the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Is the spirit contrary to the law? I thought the law was spiritual according to Paul?

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. (Law defines sin)

Roman 7:13 Has then what is good become death to me? Certainly not! But sin, that it might appear sin, was producing death in me through what is good, so that sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful. 14 For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold under sin. 15 For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do. 16 If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. 17 But now, it isno longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. 18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find. 19 For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice. 20 Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me.

21 I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good. 22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man. 23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. 24 O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? 25 I thank God—through Jesus Christ our Lord!

So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin. (The inward man is of good spirit serving the law but the flesh does not keep the law)

Romans 8:6 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

 

[bugkiller]

My apologies here are in order. I think I responded to the wrong part of a post which sometimes happens.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

In Matt 5 Jesus rejects the suggestion that his mission is to dismiss or downsize God's Commandments. He even condemns those who teach against God's Commandments.

Jesus covers Himself in LK 24:44. The rest of your post is off topic.

bugkiller

 

[BobRyan]

Jesus covers Himself in LK 24:44. The rest of your post is off topic.

bugkiller

Until you read the actual texts and notice 'the details" showing that the Ten Commandments are in fact clearly included...

 

[Bob S]

Is the spirit contrary to the law? I thought the law was spiritual according to Paul?

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. (Law defines sin)

Roman 7:13 Has then what is good become death to me? Certainly not! But sin, that it might appear sin, was producing death in me through what is good, so that sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful. 14 For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold under sin. 15 For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do. 16 If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. 17 But now, it isno longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. 18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find. 19 For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice. 20 Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me.

21 I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good. 22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man. 23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. 24 O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? 25 I thank God—through Jesus Christ our Lord!

So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin. (The inward man is of good spirit serving the law but the flesh does not keep the law)

Romans 8:6 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

Hi 1Jn, Is Paul then giving us double talk? Paul also told us that the law was until Jesus Gal3:19 which supports what I wrote and believe.

Answer the following. God gave very specific laws only to Israel and were meant for Israel. Are Gentiles sinning because we do not observe those specific laws? Let get serious about what sin is concerning Christians.

There are many ways to sin that are not mentioned in Torah. Take for instance fraud, slander, arrogance, pride, anger, egotism, extravagance to name a few. If we commit these things against our fellow man are we not accountable because they are not listed in Torah? Anything I do that is displeasing to my fellow man is sin. If Paul was referring to the ritual parts of the law then we should be wearing tassels, not cutting our sideburns, and doing all the peculiar things given only to Israel.

Jesus gave me the Holy Spirit as my guide. Paul's guide before becoming a Christian was the law. He was schooled in the law and the law gave him knowledge of sin through the law.

 

[bugkiller]

Until you read the actual texts and notice 'the details" showing that the Ten Commandments are in fact clearly included...

I noticed the details Bob. Why don't you?

bugkiller

 

[1John2:4]

Hi 1Jn, Is Paul then giving us double talk? Paul also told us that the law was until Jesus Gal3:19 which supports what I wrote and believe.

Answer the following. God gave very specific laws only to Israel and were meant for Israel. Are Gentiles sinning because we do not observe those specific laws? Let get serious about what sin is concerning Christians.

There are many ways to sin that are not mentioned in Torah. Take for instance fraud, slander, arrogance, pride, anger, egotism, extravagance to name a few. If we commit these things against our fellow man are we not accountable because they are not listed in Torah? Anything I do that is displeasing to my fellow man is sin. If Paul was referring to the ritual parts of the law then we should be wearing tassels, not cutting our sideburns, and doing all the peculiar things given only to Israel.

Jesus gave me the Holy Spirit as my guide. Paul's guide before becoming a Christian was the law. He was schooled in the law and the law gave him knowledge of sin through the law.

Bob- if you have been lead to believe that Paul is anti law that is how you will choose to read Him. Paul is not anti law we have a warning in second Peter that warns us not to misunderstand Paul and be lead away by the lawless. Paul is however against the idea that we attain our own rightousness by keeping the law apart from Christ. God never intended us to be so prideful and believing it is by our own rightousness that we are given His promises he mentioned that to the Isrealites in Dueteronomy 9 as well.

The law is from God therefore it is spiritual and the flesh is contrary to it, this is the stuggle, or as my teenager likes to say "the struggle is real"

Through Christ we are given a new Spirit one that desires the things of God, now we desire to draw close to Him by desiring to do the things that He declares as rightous. We are grieved by the things we do that are not of God because of the new Spirit within us.


Rightousness is rightousness and lawlessness is lawlessness. It is not our place to define sin. If we try to define sin we are being lead by the dictates of our own heart, God is the only one who difines sin by His law. If God says it's sin it is sin and the Bible says He changes not.

 

[listed]

Amos 3:7
7 Surely the Lord God does nothing, Unless He reveals His secret to His servants the prophets.


This verse makes it pretty clear that God does nothing that he doesn't reveal through his prophets first. There are the Messianic Prophecies Fulfilled by Jesus and other examples like sending a messenger(John the baptist), the telling of the future in Daniel and some of the other Prophets that agree with Revelations, and more.


So where in any of the prophets did God reveal to them that the 10 commandments were temporary or that he was going to abolish all of his commands in the future???

You've been told and refuse to listen or believe.

 

[BobRyan]

Amos 3:7
7 Surely the Lord God does nothing, Unless He reveals His secret to His servants the prophets.


This verse makes it pretty clear that God does nothing that he doesn't reveal through his prophets first. There are the Messianic Prophecies Fulfilled by Jesus and other examples like sending a messenger(John the baptist), the telling of the future in Daniel and some of the other Prophets that agree with Revelations, and more.


So where in any of the prophets did God reveal to them that the 10 commandments were temporary or that he was going to abolish all of his commands in the future???

Excellent post.

 

[BobRyan]

Is the spirit contrary to the law? I thought the law was spiritual according to Paul?

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. (Law defines sin)

Roman 7:13 Has then what is good become death to me? Certainly not! But sin, that it might appear sin, was producing death in me through what is good, so that sin through the commandment might become exceedingly sinful. 14 For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold under sin. 15 For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do. 16 If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. 17 But now, it isno longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. 18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find. 19 For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice. 20 Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me.

21 I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good. 22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man. 23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. 24 O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? 25 I thank God—through Jesus Christ our Lord!

So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin. (The inward man is of good spirit serving the law but the flesh does not keep the law)

Romans 8:6 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

Amen!

Perfectly clear!

 

[listed]

In issiah it was foretold as in other prophets.........
God would not abolish his law, but would put it in our hearts by Christ.
And yes God does warn first before any judgment comes.
This is why I must warn us all .............a judgment is upon the land
its a judgment of great delusion. Leading the unrepentant right to the lie.
The lie that God is in all religions has began to the upmost
and will lead to the man of sin. More and more the unrepentant are buying
the desire for world peace and unity and interfaith has been born.
A lie spawned from the depths of great darkness . But more and more
are buying into it. The true GOD never said I am in all religions
in fact HE said...DO NOT WORSHP their gods. they false.
More and more they will belive the lie that all peoples will be saved
and that all religins are a way to GOD. A lie of utter darkness, but it is increasing.

What in your post relates to the OP?

 

[listed]

How do these verses do away with God's commandments?

5 But He was wounded for our transgressions,
He was bruised for our iniquities;
The chastisement for our peace wasupon Him,
And by His stripes we are healed.
6 All we like sheep have gone astray;
We have turned, every one, to his own way;
And the Lord has laid on Him the iniquity of us all.

7 He was oppressed and He was afflicted,
Yet He opened not His mouth;
He was led as a lamb to the slaughter,
And as a sheep before its shearers is silent,
So He opened not His mouth.
8 He was taken from prison and from judgment,
And who will declare His generation?
For He was cut off from the land of the living;
For the transgressions of My people He was stricken.
9 And they made His grave with the wicked—
But with the rich at His death,
Because He had done no violence,
Nor was any deceit in His mouth.

10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise Him;
He has put Him to grief.
When You make His soul an offering for sin,
He shall see His seed, He shall prolong His days,
And the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in His hand.
11 He shall see the labor of His soul,and be satisfied.
By His knowledge My righteous Servant shall justify many,
For He shall bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will divide Him a portion with the great,
And He shall divide the spoil with the strong,
Because He poured out His soul unto death,
And He was numbered with the transgressors,
And He bore the sin of many,
And made intercession for the transgressors.

15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments

What commandments are "My commandments" in your quote from John?