America's Poor Live Better Than Most Of Humanity

[SolomonVII]

What's great about capitalism is that, unlike communism, it works in the real world. Nothing is more dangerous than a utopianism that attempts to redefine human nature. Capitalism needs to be tapered with social justice, but the seizure of private ownership by a centralized government has proved disastrous time and again. I attended one of the most radically leftist colleges in the country and I am disgusted by how many kids and professors trash the United States while taking for granted their privileged American lifestyle.

As long as communism stays in the ivory halls, out of sight and out of mind, then it is a perfect system, bringing untold pleasures and enjoyment for those who live in their heads.
Sadly though, the professors are bound to enter the classrooms every now and again, and those airy ideas have real live consequences when the proselytzed do-gooders enter into the real world with communist solutions.

 

[Yoder777]

This is very interesting:

Notice how the entire line for the United States resides in the top portion of the graph? That’s because the entire country is relatively rich. In fact, America’s bottom ventile is still richer than most of the world: That is, the typical person in the bottom 5 percent of the American income distribution is still richer than 68 percent of the world’s inhabitants.

That deserves a replay for those whining on Wall Street and the ignoramuses supporting them: “the typical person in the bottom 5 percent of the American income distribution is still richer than 68 percent of the world’s inhabitants.”

Rampell further observed in her January book review:

The typical person in the top 5 percent of the Indian population, for example, makes the same as or less than the typical person in the bottom 5 percent of the American population. That’s right: America’s poorest are, on average, richer than India’s richest — extravagant Mumbai mansions notwithstanding.

But there’s more:

At a very basic, agrarian level of development, Milanovic explains, people’s incomes are relatively equal; everyone is living at or close to subsistence level. But as more advanced technologies become available and enable workers to differentiate their skills, a gulf between rich and poor becomes possible.

‘Income Inequality’ Not Exactly What OWS And Mainstream Media Claim | the American Journal

 

[OldWiseGuy]

This is very interesting:

The population equation must also be included by dividing the nations income by their population:

USA-income / 350 million population

Brazil-income / 192 million population

China-income / 1.4 Billion population

India- income / 1.2 Billion population

 

[dies-l]

This is very interesting:

One thing to keep in mind is that conditions in the U.S. are such that functioning on very little is perhaps somewhat more difficult than it is in other countries. For example, in a previous post I mentioned a Nicaraguan woman who built her home out of tree branches and industrial plastic wrap. I know of nowhere in the U.S. where that would be a feasible option.

First, temperatures in many parts of the US are such that such a home would cause its residents to freeze to death.

Second, in most communities, such a home would be promptly characterized as blight and the neighbors would demand that it be torn down less the property values in the neighborhood plummet.

Third, child protective services would never allow a parent to raise her children in such a makeshift home.

And, I am sure I could go on with reasons that our relatively privileged lifestyle makes it such that the cost of living, at even a basic poverty level, is considerably more expensive in the U.S. than in developing countries.

How much that accounts for the relative wealth of our poor, I couldn't say. But, I do think that that is something that needs to be considered in any discussion comparing the U.S. poor to the global poor.

 

[Yoder777]

There are several indicators for the standard of living within a particular country, one of them being average levels of individual consumption. According to OECD data, look at how much higher the United States ranks for AIC compared to other member nations. Economic equality doesn't help so much when the average person is extremely poor and those who are "rich" are poor compared to American standards. I'd rather live in a society of great economic inequality due to specialized skills causing a differentiation of income levels but where even the poor are rich compared to a vast majority of the world's people.

International Data on Living Standards Show that the United States Should Not Become More Like Europe | International Liberty

 

[dies-l]

There are several indicators for the standard of living within a particular country, one of them being average levels of individual consumption. According to OECD data, look at how much higher the United States ranks for AIC compared to other member nations. Economic equality doesn't help so much when the average person is extremely poor and those who are "rich" are poor compared to American standards. I'd rather live in a society of great economic inequality due to specialized skills causing a differentiation of income levels but where even the poor are rich compared to a vast majority of the world's people.

International Data on Living Standards Show that the United States Should Not Become More Like Europe | International Liberty

I probably would too, but I cannot know for sure, because I have never really been poor by either standard. I tend to think that some of the strain of poverty are side effects of not having basic needs met: hunger pains, illness, etc. However, there is a very real aspect of poverty that comes in the form of the big green monster: when I see others driving around in fancy cars, while I am riding the bus or walking, or I am being consistently inundated with advertising telling me what I "need", it can become very easy to confuse wants and legitimate needs. This latter response is where I think that poor in the U.S. might actually struggle more than the poor in developing countries.

 

[Yoder777]

As long as I have my basic needs met, I don't covet others who have more wealth than me.

 

[PreachersWife2004]

As long as I have my basic needs met, I don't covet others who have more wealth than me.

I don't covet per se but I do sometimes wonder how a friend or family member can afford something when I know their general financial situation. And then I think "gee it would be nice to have something like that."

 

[dies-l]

As long as I have my basic needs met, I don't covet others who have more wealth than me.

I don't know you personally, and I certainly don't know your heart, but I have a hard time believing that that is true of anyone.

 

[wintermile]

I don't know you personally, and I certainly don't know your heart, but I have a hard time believing that that is true of anyone.

I am content. I strive. I do not want what others own.

I am aware that people from all walks of life have suffered in some way: loss of a loved one, rejection from a hard sought after goal, etc. I am also aware there are plenty of wealthy individuals who are not conent or who are malicious.

Everday possessions in these times are taboo and stained with human trafficking blood as well as exploitive labor practices. A home is an excellent place of comfort and shelter. Still recall the U2 lyric-"A house does not make a home".

I do not covet individuals. I pray they keep what they have. I also pray that I make purchases that honor Him.

Doesn't it feel Dirty to want another person's possessions? I want no part of that.

I also have confidence in my own ability to gain all that is possible to gain!

 

[dies-l]

I am content. I strive. I do not want what others own.

I am aware that people from all walks of life have suffered in some way: loss of a loved one, rejection from a hard sought after goal, etc. I am also aware there are plenty of wealthy individuals who are not conent or who are malicious.

Everday possessions in these times are taboo and stained with human trafficking blood as well as exploitive labor practices. A home is an excellent place of comfort and shelter. Still recall the U2 lyric-"A house does not make a home".

I do not covet individuals. I pray they keep what they have. I also pray that I make purchases that honor Him.

Doesn't it feel Dirty to want another person's possessions? I want no part of that.

I also have confidence in my own ability to gain all that is possible to gain!

I don't want to be covetous, but the truth is that I am sometimes. I have yet to meet anyone who isn't from time to time. It's part of the sin problem we all have. So, I remain somewhat skeptical of anyone who claims to be completely without envy.

 

[PreachersWife2004]

I don't want to be covetous, but the truth is that I am sometimes. I have yet to meet anyone who isn't from time to time. It's part of the sin problem we all have. So, I remain somewhat skeptical of anyone who claims to be completely without envy.

I agree wholeheartedly with you. I think there's a difference between thinking "wow, I really like my neighbor's car. Wish I had one" versus "I can't believe my stinkin neighbor gets to own that car and I don't. Life's not fair"!

I'm content with what I have, but it doesn't mean I can't want more!

 

[wintermile]

I don't want to be covetous, but the truth is that I am sometimes. I have yet to meet anyone who isn't from time to time. It's part of the sin problem we all have. So, I remain somewhat skeptical of anyone who claims to be completely without envy.

A dictionary entry for envy as I understand the word:

1. 1 Painful or resentful awareness of an advantage enjoyed by another joined with a desire to possess the same advantage. 2 Malice 3 An object of envious notice or feeling

2. 1 To feel envy toward or on account of. 2 Begrudge to feel or show envy.

I do not want harm to come to others. To envy someone means you want harm to come to them.

Back to the post you replied to by yoder777, he might have thrown that post out there as others have in other ways as to suggest do not respond politically to disparity, which is a sloppy tactic to use. I have often read posts that claim people are envious, which is not true. What is true remains others' abilities to communicate political objectives.

Actions to debate from a great mind I admire are added. Imagine to get rid of the "kings, warlords, and theocrats" currently in power of the U.S. today using aggressive political recourse, major actions can occur. Enforce inheritance tax on great wealth. Take away tax exempt statuses for mega churches that preach prosperity theology. Shut down Washington's revolving door to get rid of the out of control military complex. And, enforce the Sherman Anti-trust Act.

 

[Yoder777]

The most important thing to remember about American history is that it was founded by two opposing forces, Christianity and Freemasonry. The pilgrim fathers came to this land to flee religious persecution and pattern a society along Christian principles. The signers of the Declaration of Independence, who came later, were by and large either Masons or influenced by Masonic principles. America is a great land that God has blessed as the shining city on a hill. But we should always be mindful that our government, for reasons often secret, serves a different higher power.

 

[jgarden]

Professors Richard Wilkinson and Kate Pickett, "The Spirit Level; Why More Equal Societies Almost Always Do Better," (Penguin, March 2009)

..... compelling evidence is presented by the two professors that once nations are industrialized, more equal societies almost always do better in terms of health, well-being and social cohesion and that large income inequalities within societies destroys the social fabric and quality of life for everyone:

As they note in a presentation of their findings:
*********************************************************
•Health is related to income differences within rich societies, not between them
•Health and social problems are worse in more unequal countries
•Health and social problems are not related to average income in rich countries
•Child well-being is better in more equal rich countries
•Child well-being is unrelated to average incomes in rich countries
•Levels of trust are higher in more equal rich countries
•The prevalence of mental illness is higher in more unequal rich countries
•Drug use is more common in more unequal countries
•Life expectancy is longer in more equal rich countries
•Infant mortality rates are higher in more unequal countries
•More adults are obese in more unequal rich countries
•Educational scores are higher in more equal rich countries
•Teenage birth rates are higher in more unequal rich countries
•Homicide rates are higher in more unequal rich countries
•Children experience more conflict in more unequal societies
•Rates of imprisonment are higher in more unequal societies
•Social mobility is higher in more equal rich countries
•More equal societies are more innovative
•More equal countries rank better on recycling

Poverty Around The World — Global Issues

While poverty around the world is a relative term, studies have shown that the degree of "inequality" that exists within any modern industrialized nation has a direct impact on its "social fabric and quality of life."

- US for a long time has had the largest gap and inequality between rich and poor compared to all the other industrialized nations

- top 1% received more money than the bottom 40% with the gap widest in 70 years

- while the share of income going to the top 1% has increased, it has decreased for the poorest 40%

- 1 in 7 people in the US are in poverty. In 2009, 43.6 million people — 14.6 percent of the population — were living in poverty in the U.S

Then chairman of the Federal Reserve, Allan Greenspan, revealed concerns in mid-2005 that the increasing and widening income gap might eventually threaten the stability of democratic capitalism itself in the US.

http://www.globalissues.org/article/4/poverty-around-the-world

 

[wintermile]

I don't want to be covetous, but the truth is that I am sometimes. I have yet to meet anyone who isn't from time to time. It's part of the sin problem we all have. So, I remain somewhat skeptical of anyone who claims to be completely without envy.

To add a few more thoughts, I am guilty of envy (not of others' possessions) a few times in the past. I grew out of that. I am working on maturing in all areas where I have faults.

I am constantly aware of how others suffer (needlessly as Chompsky states). I have no desire to feel envy. I want no part of it. And if sometime in the future I resent another for an advantage I desire, the guilt associated with my poor choice of behavior will be a hundred times worse, because I will not feel as if I were in my own skin, and because I know strictly how wrong it is to envy.

There are so many interesting people out there whose originality is more worthwhile investigating, then pitying oneself for not having some possession/advantage others value. (And this includes ordinary people.)

If you've seen one car, you've seen them all.

 

[jgarden]

It may be surprising to see the US at the low end of social mobility when it is touted as the land of dreams and possibilities for anyone, no matter who they are. The UK is also surprisingly at the low end.

Interestingly, the US and UK are the biggest proponents of neoliberal economic ideology, which has often played down concerns about inequality and instead focused more on raising the lot for everyone.

It looks as if the American Dream is far more likely to remain a dream for Americans than it is for people living in Scandinavian countries. Greater inequalities of outcome seem to make it easier for rich parents to pass on their advantages. While income differences have widened in Britain and the USA, social mobility has slowed. Bigger income differences may make it harder to achieve equality of opportunity because they increase social class differentiation and perhaps prejudice.

— Evidence: Social Mobility, The Equality Trust, accessed December 7, 2009

Poverty Around The World — Global Issues

The "American Dream" is based on upward social/economic mobility - and yet the empirical evidence indicates that its the citizens in the modern socialist countries that are much more likely to experience their own version of the "American Dream!"

Rather than addressing these "inequalities," the poor in the US are "demonized" as too lazy and unmotivated to experience the "American Dream" - because they don't conform to a "myth" that has little basis in "fact."

 

[Yoder777]

I believe the United States is a great country that has gone astray. During the Depression and World War II, Americans came together for a common cause, regardless of their party affiliation. Now, it's socially acceptable to express outright hatred toward your president, whether it's Bush or Obama, simply because you disagree with his policies.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

While poverty around the world is a relative term, studies have shown that the degree of "inequality" that exists within any modern industrialized nation has a direct impact on its "social fabric and quality of life."

- US for a long time has had the largest gap and inequality between rich and poor compared to all the other industrialized nations

- top 1% received more money than the bottom 40% with the gap widest in 70 years

- while the share of income going to the top 1% has increased, it has decreased for the poorest 40%

- 1 in 7 people in the US are in poverty. In 2009, 43.6 million people — 14.6 percent of the population — were living in poverty in the U.S

Then chairman of the Federal Reserve, Allan Greenspan, revealed concerns in mid-2005 that the increasing and widening income gap might eventually threaten the stability of democratic capitalism itself in the US.

Poverty Around The World — Global Issues

And yet they keep coming.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Duplicate post.