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All the world still "Under the Law" according to Paul Romans 3:19-20

Discussion in 'Sabbath and The Law' started by BobRyan, Jan 28, 2018.

  1. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member

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    According to Paul the phrase "under the Law" is defined as "under the condemnation of the Law" for all have sinned and so "every mouth" shut and all the world condemned -- in need of a Savior.

    Romans 3
    19 Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God; 20 because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.

    21 But now apart from the Law the righteousness of God has been manifested, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe; for there is no distinction; 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

    31 Do we then nullify the Law through faith? May it never be! On the contrary, we establish the Law.'

    No wonder then that as New Covenant Christians the "Law is written on heart and mind" Jer 31:31-33

    Because the Gospel solves the problem for those who are lost "Under the Law" -- by providing forgiveness of sins and the LAW now written on the heart.

    1 Cor 7:19 "what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God"
    Rev 14:12 "the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus"

    "Love Me and KEEP My Commandments" Exodus 20:6
    "If you Love Me KEEP My Commandments" John 14:15
    "this is the Love of God that we KEEP His Commandments" 1 John 5:2-3

    hence even in the NT for Christians it is "still a sin" - to take God's name in vain.

    For even in the New Testament "Sin IS transgression of the LAW" 1 John 3:4
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2018
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  2. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    Romans 3
    28 For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law. 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is He not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, 30 since indeed God who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through faith is one.
     
  3. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member

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    both-and
     
  4. Cat Loaf You

    Cat Loaf You Active Member

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    Yes because people think that trying to keep Law will somehow make up for breaking the Law in the past...
     
  5. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member

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    Turns out "taking God's name in vain" is a bad idea no matter how long you have been a Christian or how much of a non-Christian that you used to be.

    I think everyone sees that point clearly
     
  6. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    Non Christians take the name of Jesus in vain.

    Christians are usually offended when they hear people, take the name of Jesus in vain.

    The law, not to take God's name in vain is for people, that don't believe in and worship Jesus.
     
  7. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member

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    Sadly.

    Sin is found a lot of places even among a few here that claim they don't sin.

    "Sin IS transgression of the LAW" 1 John 3:4

    thus taking God's name in vain - "a sin" even when a Christian does it.
     
  8. DavidFirth

    DavidFirth Saved by the blood of the Lamb Supporter

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    I heard a guy take the Lord's name in vain twice last night and it really bothered me. It is like it pricked me and I said a prayer for him.
     
  9. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member

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    Indeed - Christians can freely admit -- it is a sin.
     
  10. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    Hello Bob.

    When I go to church I never hear people taking the Lord's name in vain.

    What's it like in your church?
     
  11. EastCoastRemnant

    EastCoastRemnant I Must Decrease That He May Increase Supporter

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    I hear people all the time claiming the name of Christ that aren't obedient to His Commands. If you choose to not understand the varied nature of the Commandments (spirit, letter, etc.), I guess your ignorance on the importance of keeping them is cold comfort.
     
  12. EastCoastRemnant

    EastCoastRemnant I Must Decrease That He May Increase Supporter

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    Christ's Righteousness alone covers our past sins, that's Justification. Obedience to His Word is the act of Sanctification, of which we play a part.
     
  13. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    Do you obey His commandment?

    1 John 3:23
    23 This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ.
     
  14. EastCoastRemnant

    EastCoastRemnant I Must Decrease That He May Increase Supporter

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    Absolutely!
    Matthew 12:8
    For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

    It was Jesus at creation that blessed and Sanctified the 7th day. This was done for all mankind, from Adam to the new earth. It is to remind us of creation and our Creator. This is what the seventh day Sabbath has ever been for... to worship the God of creation on His Holy day.

    Can't you see the pattern of the enemy in instituting the day that has always been about worshiping the god of this world since the fall... the day of the sun... sun worship. Pagans since the earliest times and all throughout the OT and even into the NT worshiped Lucifer as the bright morning star... the sun god was revered among all heathen nations around the world. And remember that God hated that vain worship and rebuked and chastened His people when they strayed into those pagan ways. Sunday as a day of worship, is as much those pagan ways as it was in times past. God does not change.

    Time is short brother, don't be on the wrong side of this. Jesus never changed the day He created and Hallowed. God does not change.
     
  15. HARK!

    HARK! Well-Known Member

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    (CLV) Ex 20:7
    You shall not take up Name of Yahweh your Elohim for futility, for Yahweh shall not hold innocent him who takes up His Name for futility.

    This commandment is about Yahweh. It doesn't even mention jesus.
     
  16. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    YHWH is Jesus.
     
  17. HARK!

    HARK! Well-Known Member

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    That is completely a fabrication. What would possess you to propagate false testimony against both Yahshua and Yahweh?

    I Timothy 2:5 KJV

    5 For there is one God, and one mediator BETWEEN God and men, the MAN Christ Jesus
     
  18. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member

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    God's Word
    John 12:49 49 For I did not speak on My own initiative, but the Father Himself who sent Me has given Me a commandment as to what to say and what to speak.

    Matthew 19 - Jesus is asked "Which ones"
    And the list He gives is very close to the same one Paul gives in Romans 13 -- for man's duty to man - as stated in "His Commandments"

    if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.” 18 Then he *said to Him, “Which ones?” And Jesus said,
    You shall not commit murder; Ex 20
    You shall not commit adultery; Ex 20
    You shall not steal; Ex 20
    You shall not bear false witness; Ex 20
    19 Honor your father and mother; Ex 20
    and You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” Lev 19:18

    But He did NOT quote "do not take the Lord's name in vain" Ex 20:7 nor "Love God with all your heart" Deut 6:5 in that Matthew 19 list (which of course is the "greatest commandment" according to Christ). So then nothing from the "first four" commandments dealing with our duty to God. Just the ones for our duty toward our neighbor.

    Notice Romans 13 -- they are unchanged

    Rom 13
    he who loves his neighbor has fulfilled the law. 9 For this,
    You shall not commit adultery, Ex 20
    You shall not murder, Ex 20
    You shall not steal, Ex 20
    You shall not covet,” Ex 20
    and if there is any other commandment, it is summed up in this saying,
    You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” Lev 19:18
    10 Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.


    But He did NOT quote "do not take the Lord's name in vain" Ex 20:7 nor "Love God with all your heart" Deut 6:5 in that Matthew 19 list (which of course is the "greatest commandment" according to Christ). So then nothing from the "first four" commandments dealing with our duty to God. Just the ones for our duty toward our neighbor.

    Not because our duty toward God is deleted -- obviously.
     
  19. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    God does not change, how could God change?

    The way that God deals with mankind certainly changes.

    God abolished laws governing the priesthood.

    The priesthood laws are no longer valid.

    That is proof that the way that God deals with mankind does indeed change!
     
  20. HARK!

    HARK! Well-Known Member

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    (CLV) Mt 5:18
    For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from the law till all should be occurring.

    I'll just take my High Priest, Yahshua, at his word.
     
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