All-inclusive Object

WordSword

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More and more it becomes evident that the Lord Jesus does not have His proper place among the Children of God (though saved, yet many not adequately conformed maturely in Christ’s image, i.e. “walk as He walked” - 1Jo 2:6—NC). He is not the object of their hearts. It is either a doctrine, a dogma or an experience—something besides Himself (and this was written about 200 years ago—NC).

We seem to have much the same spirit that actuated Peter on the mount, when he said, “Let us make here three tabernacles” (so as to worship all three—NC). The Father solemnly rebukes this, “While he yet spoke, behold, a voice out of the cloud said: This is My beloved Son in Whom I am well pleased, hear ye Him. And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid; And Jesus came and touched them, and said, Arise, and be not afraid. And when they had lifted up their eyes, they saw no man, save Jesus only” (Mat 17)?

Have you ever been in the “cloud”? Have you ever heard the “voice”? Have you ever been on your “face”? Then, have you heard another voice, “Arise”? Do the eyes of your heart see “no man save Jesus only? Many perhaps, have reached the top of the mount; but few, very few, have been in the “cloud,” have heard the “voice,” have been on their “faces,” have risen to see “Jesus only.”

“Christ is all” (Col 3:11). Do we make Him this? Is it a question of my salvation? “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved” (Acts 16:31). Is it a question of relationship with God? “Ye are all children of God by faith in Jesus Christ” (Gal 3:26). Is it a question of experience? “For me to live is Christ” (Phl 1:21). Is it a question of service”? “I can do all things (that He shows us to do in His Word—NC) through Christ which strengthens me” (Phl 4:13). Is it a matter of my path? “I am the Way” (Jn 14:6). Is it a question of heaven or the place to which my path leads? He would define it as “where I am” (Jn 14:3).

Oh, let us know more of that rich blessedness which comes of making Christ all, of seeing “Jesus only.” Our cry should be, “Oh, to know Him!” (Phl 3:10). In our selfishness we cry and beg for blessings. It is the Blesser we need, Himself (“need”- consumed by Himself more than His blessings—NC). He is the joy of the Father’s heart. Let us taste with Him the delight He takes in His beloved Son. The Lord Jesus is infinitely higher than doctrine or experience. Experience we shall have, but only with Him can our heats be satisfied.

Why is it we are not changed more “from glory to glory” (e.g. in our lifestyle—NC)? The veil has been rent; the Blood has been sprinkled; the Spirit has been given. The reason is we are occupied (preoccupied—NC) with ourselves and the work of the Spirit in us, rather than with Christ alone (Heb 12:2). This is the weakness in the vast holiness movement, especially (right motive, but often wrong method—NC). Let us look more in that unveiled face, from which streams the light of the knowledge of the glory of God (Heb 12:2). All else will pale and fade if we will but linger there (2Co 3:18—NC).

The Holy Spirit never occupies me with His work in me. The Word is, “He shall not speak of Himself.” “He shall glorify Me” (Jn 16:13, 14). To go further, the work of Christ, wonderfully blessed as it is, can never be the object of my heart. It gives my conscience peace, but only His Person can satisfy my heart (fellowship with the Lord Jesus involves only Himself and not His blessings, i.e. thinking on Himself as much as possible—NC).

The Father directs our attention to Him (Mat 17:5). The Spirit would occupy us with Him (Acts 7:55, 56). The Word of God testifies of Him (Jn 6:39). He is the Object of faith; He is the Object of love: He is the Object of Hope; and the faith, love or hope that does not make Him the Object is without reality. The risen Lord Jesus must be all for my path, all for my growth, all for my service and all for my worship. “Unto you therefore which believe, He is precious” (1Pe 2:7).


—F U B




MJS online devotional excerpt for September 9

"If we go on with the Father, sweet as is the assurance that we belong to Him, yet the uppermost thought will in the long run be Himself. We shall come back to His Person. We shall in our praises weave with them what the Lord Jesus has done, suffered, and won for us; but the primary thought in our hearts is, not what we have gained, however true, but what He has been for us and what He is for us, yes, what He is in Himself." -J.B.S.

"There is usually only occupation with the Lord Jesus for the relief of the conscience, and if so, where does it stop? It stops when the relief is gained. But if He is the object of the heart, you will never be satisfied but in fellowship with Him where He is." -MJS

None But The Hungry Heart
 
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prophecy_uk

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Sword: "More and more it becomes evident that the Lord Jesus does not have His proper place among the Children of God (though saved, yet many not adequately conformed maturely in Christ’s image, i.e. “walk as He walked” - 1Jo 2:6—NC)"



Cant be saved by having the devils lying spirit, instead of the Spirit of truth in man..


1 John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.





Sword: "We seem to have much the same spirit that actuated Peter on the mount, when he said, “Let us make here three tabernacles” (so as to worship all three—NC)."





Peter was not given the Spirit, until after Christ was risen and glorified..


John 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

Luke 24:49 And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.



Sword: “Christ is all” (Col 3:11). Do we make Him this? Is it a question of my salvation? “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved” (Acts 16:31). Is it a question of relationship with God? “Ye are all children of God by faith in Jesus Christ” (Gal 3:26). Is it a question of experience? “For me to live is Christ” (Phl 1:21). Is it a question of service”? “I can do all things (that He shows us to do in His Word—NC) through Christ which strengthens me” (Phl 4:13). Is it a matter of my path? “I am the Way” (Jn 14:6). Is it a question of heaven or the place to which my path leads? He would define it as “where I am” (Jn 14:3)."




Yes, Acts 16, to believe on the Lord Jesus and to be saved, then Romans 10, gives all the details.

To believe in your heart, that God raised Christ from the dead, as with the heart man believes unto righteousness..


Acts 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.




Romans 10, continuing, who calls on the name of the Lord, shall be saved, to all who call in truth..


Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

Psalm 145:18 The Lord is nigh unto all them that call upon him, to all that call upon him in truth.



Required are a righteous believing heart ( need a new heart and Spirit given by God and the stony heart taken out to believe unto righteousness it is the new covenant) and then need the Spirit of truth to call with, along with seeing eyes and hearing ears given..


John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

John 12:40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.
 
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WordSword

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Sword: "More and more it becomes evident that the Lord Jesus does not have His proper place among the Children of God (though saved, yet many not adequately conformed maturely in Christ’s image, i.e. “walk as He walked” - 1Jo 2:6—NC)"

Cant be saved by having the devils lying spirit, instead of the Spirit of truth in man..
Hi and thanks for your reply and comments! Just wanted to mention that the phrase "the Lord Jesus does not have His proper place among the Children of God" means they are not adequately matured in Christ yet.
 
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prophecy_uk

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Sword: "Hi and thanks for your reply and comments! Just wanted to mention that the phrase "the Lord Jesus does not have His proper place among the Children of God" means they are not adequately matured in Christ yet."


Matured know the difference between good and evil, and so anyone who does not know the difference has not begun at all either.

That's right, you have the wrong sword, the correct one can discern the thoughts and intentions of the heart, to discern that the natural man cannot spiritually discern anything of God ( or they can discern between good and evil/matured)


Hebrews 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
 
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WordSword

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Matured know the difference between good and evil, and so anyone who does not know the difference has not begun at all either.

That's right, you have the wrong sword, the correct one can discern the thoughts and intentions of the heart, to discern that the natural man cannot spiritually discern anything of God (or they can discern between good and evil/matured)

1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
Amen, only "the Sword of the Spirit, which is the Word of God" can bring one to the Son, and cause one to "grow up into Him in all things" (Eph 6:17; 4:15).

God bless and God be blessed!
 
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prophecy_uk

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Wordsword: Amen, only "the Sword of the Spirit, which is the Word of God" can bring one to the Son, and cause one to "grow up into Him in all things" (Eph 6:17; 4:15).

God bless and God be blessed!

Thanks for the blessing, God says something about that..


Psalm 62:4 They only consult to cast him down from his excellency: they delight in lies: they bless with their mouth, but they curse inwardly. Selah.



The whole armour is when we can stand, without the whole armour you do not stand, you do not grow the armour you put it on through faith or have no faith...


Ephesians 6:13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;
15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;
16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.
17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:


Same is said here, is it not ?

Come to the unity of faith, this is the knowledge of the Son of God, not grown in that but believing in that and all knowledge ( through the Spirit given to understand with) knows then all things freely given to us of God, as this is the fulness of God for us to know the love of Christ ( this is the knowledge of the Son of Go unto a perfect man)..


1 Corinthians 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

Ephesians 3:19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God.

Ephesians 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:





Also you should be careful saying AMEN, this is the Lords name, and they are guilty that take His name in vain..


Revelation 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

Deuteronomy 5:11 Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain: for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
 
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WordSword

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What does "MJS" stand for?

What does "NC" stand for?

Where you said "was written 200 years ago" to what are you referring? Who wrote it 200 years ago?
Hi, and appreciate your interest! MJS is Miles J Stanford, who is the one which compiled many of the Plymouth Brethren in writings and teachings in England I share which are circa 1600-1800's. NC is NetChaplain and is my ID. Yes, that's what I was referring to, to show that much immaturity has always been existent in the Body of Christ. It's also my belief that most in the Body will be immature in Christ (Eph 4:15) at His return for us. Thankfully how mature one is in Christ does not effect their salvation in Him, only their fellowship with Him in this life. The next life will bring everything to understanding for all
(1Co 13:12).
 
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Hazelelponi

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Hi, and appreciate your interest! MJS is Miles J Stanford, who is the one which compiled many of the Plymouth Brethren in writings and teachings in England I share which are circa 1600-1800's. NC is NetChaplain and is my ID. Yes, that's what I was referring to, to show that much immaturity has always been existent in the Body of Christ. It's also my belief that most in the Body will be immature in Christ (Eph 4:15) at His return for us. Thankfully how mature one is in Christ does not effect their salvation in Him, only their fellowship with Him in this life. The next life will bring everything to understanding for all
(1Co 13:12).

Okay thank you for explaining your association and meanings... :)
 
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prophecy_uk

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Sword: "Thankfully how mature one is in Christ does not effect their salvation in Him, only their fellowship with Him in this life. The next life will bring everything to understanding for all
(1Co 13:12)."


Believing that we were under the school master, now we put away childish things, we be a m,n of God, as that which is perfect came to us and into us..


Galatians 3:22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

1 Corinthians 13:10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
 
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WordSword

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Believing that we were under the school master, now we put away childish things, we be a m,n of God, as that which is perfect came to us and into us..
Amen, and it's a blessing to those in Christ to realize that the OT and the Law was a different administration than the NT. Some attempt to mix the two thinking the new covenant is an addition to the old covenant, and calling it Judeo-Christian.
 
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prophecy_uk

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Sword: "Amen, and it's a blessing to those in Christ to realize that the OT and the Law was a different administration than the NT. Some attempt to mix the two thinking the new covenant is an addition to the old covenant, and calling it Judeo-Christian."

Sure, and yet He magnified the law and made it honourable..

Isaiah 42:21 The Lord is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable.



Christ then confirms, He did not come to destroy, but to fulfil, nothing passes away until all is fulfilled..


Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.




Then Jesus gets about fulfilling the law and magnifying it into honour, and now if we are not slow to anger ( by the gift of the Holy Spirit as the Lord is slow to anger who is a Spirit) we are in danger of hell fire..


Matthew 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said of them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.





Next honour, is thou shalt not commit adultery.

As those who do, lack understanding and destroy their own soul.

Jesus tells us, how now the eye must be controlled ( by eyes that can see given, which is the new heart by the Holy Spirit)..

Proverbs 6:32 But whoso committeth adultery with a woman lacketh understanding: he that doeth it destroyeth his own soul.


Matthew 5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.



I like your thread, it is a place that explains all things clearly, and where dispute is impossible now, as nothing can be mistaken once all is magnified, understood and manifested.


Of course there are the ones who have forsaken the right way, AND THEIR EYES ARE FULL OF ADULTERY...

2 Peter 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
15 Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;


Those ones love the wages of unrighteousness.

But to the ones not condemned, the righteousness of the law ( of Christ) is fulfilled in them by the Spirit ( of Christ in them which is the new covenant of the new soft heart and the Spirit writing the law in us through belief in the risen Lord Jesus Christ)..


Romans 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
 
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WordSword

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Sword: "Amen, and it's a blessing to those in Christ to realize that the OT and the Law was a different administration than the NT. Some attempt to mix the two thinking the new covenant is an addition to the old covenant, and calling it Judeo-Christian."

Sure, and yet He magnified the law and made it honourable..

Isaiah 42:21 The Lord is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable.

Christ then confirms, He did not come to destroy, but to fulfil, nothing passes away until all is fulfilled...
On the Cross, when Jesus said it is finished, the work of salivation began in the New Covenant, and the Law of the Old Covenant was completed and removed for placement of the New Covenant (Heb 9:8; Heb 10:9).
 
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prophecy_uk

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Sword: "On the Cross, when Jesus said it is finished, the work of salivation began in the New Covenant, and the Law of the Old Covenant was completed and removed for placement of the New Covenant (Heb 9:8; Heb 10:9)."






Sorry sword, you need a few more verses to shed light on it more efficiently.





The first tabernacle standing, shows the way to the Holy Lord God ( to His glory) was not manifested yet ( the light of Christ came to earth to lighten every man)

Christ then who came to minister to us, was a minister of the true tabernacle, made without hands, and not made by man...



Hebrews 9:8 The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:

Hebrews 8:2 A minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man.




The Messiah came to earth, to do ( fulfil) the Fathers will, which is to establish the new covenant ( of making the law honourable and not destroyed but fulfilled) by the law of God in His heart...



Hebrews 10:8 Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;
9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.

Psalm 40:7 Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book it is written of me,
8 I delight to do thy will, O my God: yea, thy law is within my heart.






Perfection was not by the Levitical priesthood, ( the law is good and spiritual but not making us perfect as we are carnal in that law, as it is not of faith, but man lived in them) and we lived under a curse, as cursed is everyone who continues not in the things of the law to do them, but Christ reedemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us.

Then the priesthood is changed, then of necessity there is a change of the law.

It as said, the law is not after Christ, but after men, but, though it be but a man's covenant, it was confirmed, before of God in Christ, the first covenant of the law, cannot be disannulled, or added to...




Romans 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

Romans 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

Galatians 3:10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.

Galatians 3:12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Galatians 3:15 Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto.

Galatians 3:17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.


Hebrews 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?
12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.



Christ then is not after the law of a carnal commandment,, but after the power of an endless life ( a change of the priesthood)

The disannulling is of the commandment before that was weakness, and profitable for ( curse and death for us) nothing perfect, but the bringing in of the better hope ( we are saved by the hope of Christ) did make us perfect, and is how we draw near to God ( the Father through the Son).

The commandment was ordained to life,, but man found it to be unto death ( cursed and not able to continue in the commandments of God, and die in sins then without faith given by Christ).

This then is the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus, to make us free form the law of sin and death. ( free from sin)

The law was weak through the flesh ( of man) God sent the Son to condemn sin in the flesh, by the righteousness of the law being fulfilled in us, walking after the Spirit, and not as previous in the law, after the flesh ( it;'s weakness, failure, sinning and death).

Jesus knows the commandment of the Father is life everlasting, so the Son tells us what to believe in to have that life ( in His Son)



Hebrews 7:16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.

Hebrews 7:18 For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.

Romans 7:10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.

Romans 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

John 12:50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

1 John 5:11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.




Then in the flesh of Christ, the law of commandments contained in ordinances is abolished, now not written with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God, not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart. The letter killed, now the Spirit gives life..



Ephesians 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

2 Corinthians 3:3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.


2 Corinthians 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.




Example of the righteousness of the law continuing ?

Yes, obedience commanded, as also says the law.

To fulfil the royal law ( of Christ the King) to love our neighbour as ourselves, to not be convinced of the law as transgressors, to keep the whole law ( the righteousness of the law of Christ) and not offend in any point.

We shall be judged by the law of liberty, and God shall have judgment without mercy, on those who showed no mercy ( at any time) and mercy ( in all times) rejoices against that judgment..



1 Corinthians 14:34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.

James 2:8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.
13 For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.
 
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WordSword

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Sword: "Hi and thanks for your reply and comments! Just wanted to mention that the phrase "the Lord Jesus does not have His proper place among the Children of God" means they are not adequately matured in Christ yet."

Matured know the difference between good and evil, and so anyone who does not know the difference has not begun at all either.

That's right, you have the wrong sword, the correct one can discern the thoughts and intentions of the heart, to discern that the natural man cannot spiritually discern anything of God ( or they can discern between good and evil/matured).
Maturing in Christ is well beyond knowing good and evil, which I believe designs the intention of God revealing to the believer the seriousness and depth of good and evil. When unregenerate one cannot differentiate between good and evil and right and wrong, being without the Spirit and His Word. They are seen as the same thing in such a state, which answers to the deeper understanding manifested after the first sin, when "the eyes of them both were opened" (Gen 3:7). They didn't know holiness, which derives only from God and Him revealing it; and this was His intention and plan!
 
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prophecy_uk

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"They are seen as the same thing in such a state, which answers to the deeper understanding manifested after the first sin, when "the eyes of them both were opened" (Gen 3:7). They didn't know holiness, which derives only from God and Him revealing it; and this was His intention and plan"


Vain talk, why do you even try.

Their eyes opened to see they are naked, is as much eyes open as you have.

But if God gives the Spirit, their eyes are enlightened, it is in wisdom and revelation in knowing Christ, there is no growing and maturing in knowing Him, there is only in the ones who do not know Him at all, who also it is witnessed, do not know the hope of His calling and riches of the glory of His inheritance in the saints..


Ephesians 1:17 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,
 
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WordSword

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Their eyes opened to see they are naked, is as much eyes open as you have.
The point here is that the innocence of no shame would have been passed down if they had not sinned
(Gen 2:25). I think we are discussing different issues Wishing you well!
 
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prophecy_uk

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The point here is that the innocence of no shame would have been passed down if they had not sinned
(Gen 2:25). I think we are discussing different issues Wishing you well!



You are having your own discussion.

How would unawareness be passed down, unless you think it is good to be as the hypocritical Pharisees who are unaware and make others be unaware of their wickedness..


Luke 11:44 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are as graves which appear not, and the men that walk over them are not aware of them.
 
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WordSword

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You are having your own discussion.

How would unawareness be passed down, unless you think it is good to be as the hypocritical Pharisees who are unaware and make others be unaware of their wickedness..


Luke 11:44 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are as graves which appear not, and the men that walk over them are not aware of them.
It appears that our understandings of Biblical doctrine differ too much to discuss it. Wish you well and God's blessings to your Family!
 
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