Afterlife Alternatives

yeshuaslavejeff

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and not automatically of demonic nature.
Not automatically, by human thought or determination.

YHWH'S WORD states it is demonic, satan's nature, demons, etc.

That is part of HIS GREAT and WONDERFUL GRACE to save us in CHRIST from
those satanic deceptions, those deadly ideas,
those things completely opposed to YHWH,
those things totally opposed to JESUS.
 
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tampasteve

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This is the controversial theology forum, there is nothing wrong with disagreeing, but to outright just say it is "evil, wrong, demonic, etc." but not offer any biblical refutations, or even thought out quotes from theologians that agree with your position it is not serving the discussion.
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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This is the controversial theology forum, there is nothing wrong with disagreeing, but to outright just say it is "evil, wrong, demonic, etc." but not offer any biblical refutations, or even thought out quotes from theologians that agree with your position it is not serving the discussion.
I didn't notice if you admitted those are not-christian thoughts, ideas, etc from other religions.
As for as contrversial, from Scripture, no , there is no controversy about what was posted. The whole idea of r&&nc&rn&t&&n is demonic,*(other religion?) and certainly absolutely not godly,
as His Word says several times IN CONTEXT and IN WHOLE - no possible change in His Word, no, not at all.
 
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Anto9us

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AfterLife scenarioes portrayed as professional Sports Teams from Los Angeles...

1. "LAKERS" are the traditional "saved go to heaven, unsaved get tossed in a literal Lake of Fire"

2. "CLIPPERS" believe in "no consciousness" after death, Silver Cord of Ecclesiastes is just CLIPPED, and there is mindless nothingness -- this can be combined with Soul Sleep for an undetermined period of time and then an eventual LAKER situation; or just left in perpetuity such as the "wages of sin is DEATH" crowd -- unbelievers just wink out of existence altogether

3. "DODGERS" simply "dodge" the issue of PERPETUITY, and can include Universalists and Reincarnationists

The biblical language of afterlife is somewhat ambiguous, else there would not be position-holders of all the various "afterlifes" in this thread -- like, "Beaten with few stripes, beaten with many stripes" implies DEGREES of punishment; whereas the traditional view is an all-or-nothing endless bliss or endless torment; leaving no room for "degrees of punishment"

Add to the ambiguity that the phrase KJV has as "forever and ever" would in Greek be more literally "unto Ages of Ages"

Obviously my analogy is not PERFECT or EXHAUSTIVE, and it is unfortunate that there are two LA Basketball teams and one LA Baseball team, but it's the best I can do.

If any of the three teams ever moves its franchise from Los Angeles, well, the theological implications would be staggerring
 
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RaymondG

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If you don't know the scriptures to post in defense of your arguments, then you are just giving opinions just like everyone else. Arbitrarily saying that your opinion is better than others is not helpful.....especially when it is repeated multiple times in the same thread.
 
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spockrates

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John chapter 11 verse 25
Jesus said to her, "I am the resurrection and the life. The one who believes in me will live, even though they die;
I don't know exactly what that means, but I'll live with God and Jesus, I think.
Different Christians have different ideas. An Ecangelical might say whoever puts her faith in Christ alone to save her, though her body dies, her soul will live with Christ in heaven, and on the day of resurrection, her body will rise from the grave immortal and perfect, and it will be reunited with her soul forever to live on the new earth with Christ and other saves Christians.
 
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RaymondG

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Different Christians have different ideas. An Ecangelical might say whoever puts her faith in Christ alone to save her, though her body dies, her soul will live with Christ in heaven, and on the day of resurrection, her body will rise from the grave immortal and perfect, and it will be reunited with her soul forever to live on the new earth with Christ and other saves Christians.
The verse right after this one states that He that liveth and believe shall never die. I think this should be our goal......as oppose to waiting to die and seeing what happens.
 
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spockrates

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heavens? Just wondering how does that one work i'm not familiar with that one. Like why more than one under that concept.
It's a Mormon thing. There are seven Heavens. The Father God, Son of God and Holy Spirit live in the highest heaven. The unrepentant and evil live in the lowest heaven. The rest live in the heavens inbetween, with obedient Latter Day Saints being in the highest heavens, closest to the Godhead.
 
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spockrates

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The disciples seemed to believe in the possibility of reincarnation when giving options for why the man was born Blind.
However, reincarnation or not, the goal of Jesus seem to be to show us that we can die once a be resurrected to life now. Reincarnation doesnt help us, since the person we were essentially dies for good and we have no knowledge of that life in the next one.

Lets add another scenario......What if when we die, we just wake up in a another life with memories....just like we do when we die in a "dream" now?

I find dreams fascinating. Having one is like living in an alternate reality where the norms of physics and behavior are turned upside down. For me, what seems absolutely normal when I dream it, I find laughably absurd when I wake. I wonder if God has some lesson in that for us?
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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It's an afterlife alternative, I think.
Yes, I think you (or others) said that - along with what ? - a billion Hindu or Buddhist or whatever ?
It is however never authorized nor approved by YHWH,
rather r&&nc&rn&t&&n is always and fully directly opposed to YHWH'S WORD, thus Christians following YHWH do not believe in it at all.
 
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tampasteve

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Yes, I think you (or others) said that - along with what ? - a billion Hindu or Buddhist or whatever ?
It is however never authorized nor approved by YHWH,
rather r&&nc&rn&t&&n is always and fully directly opposed to YHWH'S WORD, thus Christians following YHWH do not believe in it at all.
I am curious, how come you always write reincarnation as "r&&nc&rn&t&&n"? It has piqued my interest. :)
Also, what of Matthew 16:14 "And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets."
It seems to imply that there was some idea of rebirth or reincarnation? Jesus refutes that he is one of those people, of course as all Christians would agree He is not.
 
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spockrates

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What is the point of reincarnation? What purpose would it serve in a Christian universe?
Well, let's say God, being merciful, would like to see hell as empty as possible. Giving each person merely one chance to get it right, with no reset option, would be counterproductive to this goal. Too many would fail to repent and believe, and so receive eternal damnation. But take a soul destined for hell and put it in the body of a newborn infant, so it's incapable of remembering it's past experiences and choices and gets a whole new start on life, well that soul has greater odds of getting it right the second time around. The more rebirths of this kind, the greater the odds of success, and the fewer damned. Don't you think?
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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I am curious, how come you always write reincarnation as "r&&nc&rn&t&&n"?
It is such a horrid , unbiblical concept.... used by the enemy to deceive multitudes, to their destruction if they do not repent.

Jesus refutes that he is one of those people, of course as all Christians would agree He is not.
Jesus Word (All Scripture) condemns
any idea of r&&nc&rn&t&&n ,
as He thwarted those who made those claims >>
It seems to imply that there was some idea of rebirth or reincarnation?

That was simply what those who did not know Jesus believed. Just as ALL SCRIPTURE is opposed to the idea, He(Jesus) always corrects those who come to Him, so they no longer believe
in that totally pagan idea.

It is as demonic/ devilish origin as the idea of p&rg&t&r& - and always opposed to YHWH and likewise always contrary to ALL HIS WORD.

The TRUTH does not accept those evil doctrines/ practices/ ideas.

Jesus rejected thos ideas always, exposed them as false.
 
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Anto9us

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I see.

So both Purgatory and Reincarnation are dismissed as "evil doctrines" -- "opposed to YHWH"...

yikes.

Catholic Christians and Reincarnationist Christians had better run for the hills...

btw, Reincarnationist Christians easily dismantle the one "clobber verse" usually thrown against them (Heb 9:27)

as it is appointed a man to die once, and judgement (krisis) afterwards

they certainly believe there is KRISIS following a mortal life,
which in part determines the next state,
whether a corporeal incarnation again, or a sojourn in an unseen realm

it helps NOT to read "after that THE JUDGEMENT" as if it said
"THE GREAT WHITE THRONE JUDGEMENT"
which is how the reincarnation-clobberers make it out to be...

I personally do not believe in Purgatory, but would not dare to poo-poo a doctrine
that was around 15 centuries before Protestantism - obviously millions of Christians have believed in it for the last 2000 years

who sinned -- his parents -- or this man himself -- THAT HE WAS BORN BLIND?

AT THE VERY LEAST -- THAT DENOTES THAT REINCARNATION WAS A VIABLE OPTION TO THOSE PEOPLE AT THE TIME
 
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yeshuaslavejeff

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Catholic Christians and Reincarnationist Christians had better run for the hills...
Did Jesus tell the scribes, pharisees, saducees and others who Jesus met to "run for the hills"? No.

He told them to turn to YHWH, for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand.
i.e.
"repent" of their sinfulness, their wickednesses, their lives apart from YHWH, their lives serving the flesh or the devil or the world (take your pick), but not serving YHWH.

Simple.

YHWH'S WORD is SIMPLE, PURE, CLEAN, and CLEAR.

Today Jesus' Message, His GOOD NEWS ,

is still the same "Repent" - Turn to YHWH.....
 
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Anto9us

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The whole idea of r&&nc&rn&t&&n is demonic,*(other religion?) and certainly absolutely not godly,
as His Word says several times IN CONTEXT and IN WHOLE

Please provide ch and verse references
to these "several times"
that His Word denounces reincarnation.
 
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ronandcarol

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Afterlife Alternatives
Out of the five choices that you listed, the first two are the only options. Heaven or hell! And the beauty about it is that the choice is ours to make.
I guess you could say that soul sleep is somewhat a choice, but that only lasts until Jesus comes back for His church. So we are back to 'eternity' choices which again are either heaven or hell.
The Bible is loaded with many verses that support both heaven and hell. Choose wisely.
ronandcarol
 
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