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admitting the truth behind SOME co-vid deaths

Discussion in 'American Politics' started by dogs4thewin, Jul 11, 2020.

  1. dogs4thewin

    dogs4thewin dog lover CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    IDPH Director explains how Covid deaths are classified

    This person from my understanding a health director is basically ADMITTING that they count co-vid deaths as people who are positive at the time of death ( even if they would have died any way or died of something completely unrated. They particularly mention people on Hospice by defination those people are DYING anyway. Now, granted Hospice is not what it once was you can live on hospice for months or even in some rare cases a year or more, but to actually stay on hospice you must have a live expectency of six months or less if you beat that good on you, but you cannot just stay on hospice with a condition that you are expected to still live for years ( even if it is a condition that at some point will prove deadly if nothing else does. I would also think and this is not stated in the video that they would count if someone died in something CLEARLY unrated ( say a car accident if they tested the person and it came back positive. I have heard of at least one case where they ACUALLY tried that one.

    What do you think, after all this person is in no way saying that NO ONE dies from actual co-vid, but they are admitting that they count deaths that if anything have VERY little to do with the virus.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2020
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  2. Brightmoon

    Brightmoon Apes and humans are all in family Hominidae.

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    They’re starting to understand that Covid deaths are not just lung related . The virus damages every organ system;it’s not at all like the common cold
     
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  3. ananda

    ananda Early Buddhist

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    "A positive test result shows you may have antibodies from an infection with the virus that causes COVID-19. However, there is a chance a positive result means that you have antibodies from an infection with a virus from the same family of viruses (called coronaviruses), such as the one that causes the common cold." (cdc source)
     
  4. dogs4thewin

    dogs4thewin dog lover CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    maybe so, but the fact still is that if someone is dying anyway why would they count it as a co-vid death? For example, and he has been gone over five years, but my father was on hospice for colon cancer. I knew another woman who was on hospice last year and died in December from Parkinson now let us say that they were alive now and tested positive for co-vid shortly before their death. NEITHER my dad, nor Ms. D would have died from co-vid because they were dying co-vid or no co-vid. Now, could the co-vid mean it happened a few days faster than it otherwise might have sure, but one way or another they were going to be dying shortly even if they NEVER were even exposed to co-vid. It is not about saying what co-vid may effect Same with things ( if this is true with like car accidents or overdoses well that would have NOTHING to do with co-vid even if the person tested positive ( in fact, those cases are not even NATURL deaths at all.
     
  5. loveofourlord

    loveofourlord Newbie

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    someone dying 5 years earlier died from covid, and covid related, plus covid causing someone to die from a disease they might have is no graurantee. No one dies from hiv, and many that die from the flu don't die from the flu itself they die from complications or oportunistic diseases, it's how diseases work. If someone was on chemo but dies from covid, maybe the chemo would have saved them.
     
  6. -57

    -57 Well-Known Member

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    Because if they can get the cases and death high enough they can scare everyone back into a lockdown. People can deny it all they want to deny it but the goal is to collapse the country...world...so the globalist can take charge.

    What you have done is simply point out some of the ways they increase numbers falsely.
     
  7. -57

    -57 Well-Known Member

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    The difference is dying WITH Covid or OF Covid. The rules are if you have kidney failure..or whatever...and die from that disease and they later find out you have Covid...that's what the records show as cause of death.
     
  8. comana

    comana Senior Veteran Supporter

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    In your hospice scenario, if having COVID complicated their current illness and accelerated their death from additional damage from the virus it would be reasonable to list COVID as the immediate cause of death or at a minimum, a contributing factor.

    If this same hospice patient died from an accident while in hospice, such as a medication error, or a fall, is the cause of death the accident or their terminal illness?
     
  9. pitabread

    pitabread Well-Known Member

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    This is conspiratorial nonsense for people who are in denial of the current reality. Take it to the conspiracy theory forum.
     
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  10. dogs4thewin

    dogs4thewin dog lover CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    The fact that they died pre-covid was not really my point. The fact that if someone is on hospice they are by DEFINATION dying that means that even if they had never had contact with co-vid they would have died from whatever it was that landed them on hospice. The fact that at the time of their death they happened to have also had co-vid should not make it counted as a co-vid death. Same with non-natural causes of death and people that test positive that is not a co-vid death as the fact they have co-vid literally has NOTHING to do with their death. Now, it would be different if say a person has a condition that he or she could have still lived with for a number of years and THEN died from co-vid with that risk factor at that point yes co-vid could be considered a major factor, but when a person has co-vid and literally was either dying anyway OR their death was not of natural causes and thus could not be co0vid related that is just inflecting the numbers.
     
  11. dogs4thewin

    dogs4thewin dog lover CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    If they could prove that, but really if the person would have died shortly with or without co-vid then did the co-vid really kill them or was it at most a SMALL factor?
     
  12. pitabread

    pitabread Well-Known Member

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    Determining actual cause of death isn't always clear cut. Especially in a case with a novel virus whose epidemiology isn't fully understood.

    As Brightmoon points out, they're learning this virus is more that just a respiratory disease and can attack various organs in the body.

    The most telling statistics of the impact of pandemic is looking at overall excess fatalities in the population. Various studies have looked at that, and in general is appears that COVID-19 fatalities may in fact be understated in aggregate.

    This means that even if there are cases where some COVID-19 fatalities may be incorrectly categorized as such, there are other COVID-19 fatalities not classified as such. The latter is particularly the case where people outside of hospitals and postmortem testing isn't performed.

    Those looking to deny the impact of the pandemic are clinging to narrative that COVID-19 fatalities are overstated and per what posters like -57 demonstrate, inventing conspiracy theories to avoid the uncomfortable truth: the pandemic is probably a lot worse than even the official death counts are indicating.
     
  13. loveofourlord

    loveofourlord Newbie

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    that non natural thing has long been debunked, it was a suggestion by ONE person that never went through that was also 3 months ago, mind keeping up with the actual data please.

    what are are finding is that covid seems to cause blood clots that can cause secondary and tertiary damage killing in not just lung related symptoms, this disease is very nasty. Plus this whole, they are overplaying the deaths is complete bunk when you realize that the number of covid releated deaths doesn't compare to the excess deaths this year, it's way higher for the longest time. The evidence is, this disease is being actually underplayed not overplayed. Thats not even counting again, the people that still can't breath well months later, or those that appear healthy have black spots on their lungs, or the rate of strokes and other deaths and complications going up.
     
  14. dogs4thewin

    dogs4thewin dog lover CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    I would winner that a million times if I could,
     
  15. dogs4thewin

    dogs4thewin dog lover CF Ambassadors Supporter

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    so why put it on there if they do not know for sure?
     
  16. loveofourlord

    loveofourlord Newbie

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    here is a good graph showing the excess deaths.

    There Has Been an Increase in Other Causes of Deaths, Not Just Coronavirus at the peak 12k deaths a week.
     
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  17. comana

    comana Senior Veteran Supporter

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    This is about the antibody test not the viral test. The viral test, such as the nasal swab test, identify the actual virus. If you test positive to the COVID viral test it means they you have contracted The COVID virus.
     
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  18. pitabread

    pitabread Well-Known Member

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    Practical logistics. There aren't enough resources to perform complete autopsies on every single deceased body.

    This is why there will never be a 100% perfect count of COVID-19 fatalities. The best we can hope for is a close estimate. That is where statistical analysis of overall fatalities in populations versus historical norms comes in. It gives us a better picture of the pandemic's true impact.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2020
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  19. Sparagmos

    Sparagmos Well-Known Member

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    I understand your concern. But we have other statistics that show that there are an unusually high number of deaths in the world, and those numbers correlate with the spikes in COVID 19. The website below has many graphs that you look at to to evaluate this data.

    Excess Deaths Associated with COVID-19
     
  20. -57

    -57 Well-Known Member

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    Dude...sometimes "conspiracies" turn out to be true. This is one of them.

    Problem is you can't connect the dots. Does Canada have CNN or do you only watch a similiar version of CNN?
     
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