According to Dr Michael Shermer, There Is No God

[thomas_t]

In a popular youtube video by Dr Shermer, the title said "No God".
This speech was recorded in one of the most prestigious universities of this world - Oxford.

I don't agree with Dr Shermer. I'm certain there is a God (the Christian one).

Let's now turn to his line of reasoning, as I understand it.

He says that religion does make perfect sense without a God. But how does that show that there is indeed no God, I'm asking myself.
It seems very reasonable to assume that all would make sense without a God interfering. After listening to his video, you might think: "how very reasonable are these arguments!". So did I.
Yes, he is very convincing: religion without a God can make perfect sense just the way described in the video. He mentions details such as evolutionary pressure for humans to become religious, for example. I didn't know that. Sounds more than interesting.

But Christianity with a God - the God of Love - also makes perfect sense, I think. Even if there is evolutionary pressure on us humans to believe something.

So, in my opinion, you are left with two perfect options for you to decide which one is best.
Have your pick.

P.S.:that's the video:

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

Dr Shermer will one day die. Lord Jesus lives forever.

 

[Tinker Grey]

Dr Shermer will one day die. Lord Jesus lives forever.

Irrelevant to the topic.

 

[ChetSinger]

In a popular youtube video by Dr Shermer, the title said "No God".
This speech was recorded in one of the most prestigious universities of this world - Oxford.

I don't agree with Dr Shermer. I'm certain there is a God (the Christian one).

Let's now turn to his line of reasoning, as I understand it.

He says that religion does make perfect sense without a God. But how does that show that there is indeed no God, I'm asking myself.
It seems very reasonable to assume that all would make sense without a God interfering. After listening to his video, you might think: "how very reasonable are these arguments!". So did I.
Yes, he is very convincing: religion without a God can make perfect sense just the way described in the video. He mentions details such as evolutionary pressure for humans to become religious, for example. I didn't know that. Sounds more than interesting.

But Christianity with a God - the God of Love - also makes perfect sense, I think. Even if there is evolutionary pressure on us humans to believe something.

So, in my opinion, you are left with two perfect options for you to decide which one is best.
Have your pick.

P.S.:that's the video:

More than two options, I think. Without revelation from God I think the most reasonable belief is deism. Life doesn't come about naturally, so it came about supernaturally. That's deism. But because we have revelations from our loving God we can come closer to him.

 

[Pavel Mosko]

What little I know/have heard about Shermer I know in reference to him debating old earth Creationist Hugh Ross.

This seems like a given, seeing that he is a public professed atheist... or am I missing something?

 

[thomas_t]

This seems like a given, seeing that he is a public professed atheist... or am I missing something?

yes he is. At least he said in minute 8:10 that "we're all atheists about [999] gods [...], some of us just go one god/God further. " since he said that twice, I think he is a true atheist.
BTW, I think he is very well educated and informed. I appreciated listening to him.
In minute 7:40 he says that there are about 1000 gods.
He also explained there is evolutionary pressure and sociological factors that promote deism. So it shouldn't be no surprise that there are 999 other gods around, I think.

Thomas

 

[Pavel Mosko]

"we're all atheists about [999] gods [...], some of us just go one god/God further.

That is one bit of sophistry that I wish those folks would give up or at least be taken to task for it. As I've said before, Christians may not believe believe in X, god but we often do acknowledge that there is an underlying power there, that mystical experience of such followers can seem real to them etc.. We often attribute this to Satan and demons but not always as in "Imago Dei" theology discussions and work of the Holy Spirit (God seeding ideas in pagan culture, like Stoicism to pave the way for Christianity). This is much more, and quite different than what most atheists do! e.g. by often depicting these things as pure fairy tales and delusions!


But at least now a few famous atheists do acknowledge the Jungian unconscious power of myth, artistic aesthetics of religious art and music etc.

 

[thomas_t]

Without revelation from God I think the most reasonable belief is deism.

since you mention revelations from God, let me post that Bible anounces that also non-Jews and non-Christians can have them, too. This is at least my interpretation of Titus 1:12.
Interestingly - and this brings us back to the topic - Sherman says that there were religions predating Christianity that also had a redeemer-God (see minute 12:00 of the video), or some kind of virgin birth of some deity having a divine father. Or a God tranforming water into wine, or... or...
Very interesting.
To me, it seems that these peoples must have had some real prophets around who taught doctrines about a Jesus to come.
But apparently - and this is what I assume here - these peoples also listened to other teachers so their older religions became different to Christianity.

 

[Nihilist Virus]

That is one bit of sophistry that I wish those folks would give up or at least be taken to task for it. As I've said before, Christians may not believe believe in X, god but we often do acknowledge that there is an underlying power there, that mystical experience of such followers can seem real to them etc.. We often attribute this to Satan and demons but not always as in "Imago Dei" theology discussions and work of the Holy Spirit (God seeding ideas in pagan culture, like Stoicism to pave the way for Christianity). This is much more, and quite different than what most atheists do! e.g. by often depicting these things as pure fairy tales and delusions!


But at least now a few famous atheists do acknowledge the Jungian unconscious power of myth, artistic aesthetics of religious art and music etc.

It seems like you're saying that all religions except Christianity are inspired by Satan. How is Christianity exempt?

Let's assume that it is the year 500 BC and let's also assume that Judaism is the one true religion.

Now let's consider Satan's perspective. Apparently he's been forming religions all the time. Wouldn't he be motivated to lead the Jews astray by convincing the Jews that they don't need to follow the commandments while also manipulating them into worshipping a different God than Jehovah? Would it not be within the power of Satan to manifest in the flesh and produce miracles? That is enough to create Christianity. You seem to indicate that he's done this hundreds of times. I don't understand what aspect of Christianity it is that you believe is immune from the influence of Satan. It seems like you're just saying that your religion is true and everyone else's is false. I guess you were lucky to be born in the right place and right time!

 

[ChetSinger]

since you mention revelations from God, let me post that Bible anounces that also non-Jews and non-Christians can have them, too. This is at least my interpretation of Titus 1:12.

While I believe that happens, Paul warns us to treat skeptically even revelations from our own brothers in Colossians 2:18.

Interestingly - and this brings us back to the topic - Sherman says that there were religions predating Christianity that also had a redeemer-God (see minute 12:00 of the video), or some kind of virgin birth of some deity having a divine father. Or a God tranforming water into wine, or... or...
Very interesting.

I don't know why you're following a man who has dedicated himself to destroying our faith. Regarding these particular claims, I suggest insisting on scholarly resources or ignoring them. Many of these kinds of things were debunked decades ago by scholars. Yet they continue on in the words of professional polemicists.

If you're interested in how God interacted with non-Jewish people in ancient times then I suggest following actual scholars rather than an anti-Christian debater. For example, Dr. Michael Heiser has done a vast quantity of research on the subject. I have a small collection of his books and can personally recommend them. I think one that might fit you is "Supernatural: What the Bible Teaches about the Unseen World And Why It Matters". He also has blogs and videos.

 

[thomas_t]

Now let's consider Satan's perspective. Apparently he's been forming religions all the time. Wouldn't he be motivated to lead the Jews astray by convincing the Jews that they don't need to follow the commandments while also manipulating them into worshipping a different God than Jehovah? Would it not be within the power of Satan to manifest in the flesh and produce miracles? That is enough to create Christianity.

Judaism and Christianity worship that same Jehovah.
According to the Bible Messiah died on the cross.
It makes no sense to assume a Satan to have himself crucified by man, in my opinion.

I suggest insisting on scholarly resources
[...]
actual scholars rather than an anti-Christian debater.

I assume atheists can be good scientists.

 

[Broken Fence]

yes he is. At least he said in minute 8:10 that "we're all atheists about [999] gods [...], some of us just go one god/God further. " since he said that twice, I think he is a true atheist.
BTW, I think he is very well educated and informed. I appreciated listening to him.
In minute 7:40 he says that there are about 1000 gods.
He also explained there is evolutionary pressure and sociological factors that promote deism. So it shouldn't be no surprise that there are 999 other gods around, I think.

Thomas

Well Thomas there is only one True God. The others are idol's and have no power. The supernatural behind these idol's are demons. The truth is that to not believe in God takes more faith than to believe in God. Because the evidence of God and Jesus is overwhelming.

 

[Nihilist Virus]

Judaism and Christianity worship that same Jehovah.
According to the Bible Messiah died on the cross.
It makes no sense to assume a Satan to have himself crucified by man, in my opinion.

Jehovah's witnesses worship Jehovah as well. So do Mormons. Does that mean they're going to heaven?

 

[thomas_t]

Jehovah's witnesses worship Jehovah as well. So do Mormons. Does that mean they're going to heaven?

I don't know. I suggest let Jesus decide.

 

[Moral Orel]

Jehovah's witnesses worship Jehovah as well. So do Mormons. Does that mean they're going to heaven?

Only Mormons get into Heaven. I saw it in an uncut documentary.

 

[Nihilist Virus]

Only Mormons get into Heaven. I saw it in an uncut documentary.

South Park?

 

[Nihilist Virus]

I don't know. I suggest let Jesus decide.

Why even be a Christian at all? Just do whatever you want and let Jesus decide your fate.

 

[Moral Orel]

South Park?

You got it, buddy!

 

[thomas_t]

Just do whatever you want and let Jesus decide your fate.

look around what happens: people doing harm to each other. Do you think this is nice? Everyone does what they want and then we see people harming each other.

 

[klutedavid]

It seems like you're saying that all religions except Christianity are inspired by Satan. How is Christianity exempt?

Let's assume that it is the year 500 BC and let's also assume that Judaism is the one true religion.

Now let's consider Satan's perspective. Apparently he's been forming religions all the time. Wouldn't he be motivated to lead the Jews astray by convincing the Jews that they don't need to follow the commandments while also manipulating them into worshipping a different God than Jehovah? Would it not be within the power of Satan to manifest in the flesh and produce miracles? That is enough to create Christianity. You seem to indicate that he's done this hundreds of times. I don't understand what aspect of Christianity it is that you believe is immune from the influence of Satan. It seems like you're just saying that your religion is true and everyone else's is false. I guess you were lucky to be born in the right place and right time!

I thought that the nation of Israel committed idolatry and adultery with foreign Gods.

That was the real history of Israel but correct me if I am wrong.