Abortion

[OldBadfish]

Originally posted by nyj


 

Auntie Belle,

A pregnant lady without any health care can go to any myriad of pro-life organizations and they will pay out-of-pocket for the entire nine months of medical expenses for her and her child.  Additional pro-life and Christian organizations will then support that mother for years after the birth of the child (Catholic Charities for example).  My eyes ARE open to reality, it is your eyes that are open but do not see.  You can disbelieve all you want about my being in the medical field, but it amounts to a hill of beans because I am.  It also appears, as a health care professional, and a Christian, that I am more aware about the counters to abortion than you are.  You have become a victim to the spin the abortionists play on the unsuspecting populace.  Time to learn the truth.

 

And to start you on that road, take a look at but one small organization that does exactly what I just described right above:

 

http://birthchoice.org/

 

Auntie will probably beat me to this one. But I am extremely anti-abortion, but in the extreme instance I will vote for abortion.

I am not a victim of any abortionists, I am thinking of what would be best for the 9 year old.

Don't jump to conclusions and accuse me of being a victim of any pro abortion propaganda, I am OPPOSED, but still hold the belief that extreme situations could justify. I couldn't be a good Christian and condone abortion, I can be a good Christian and OPPOSE abominations.

 

[nyj]

Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um
You assume all 9 year olds are in good health before they get raped resulting in pregnancy?  Have you never heard of taking the history of the patient before you decide if the patient can withstand a full term pregnancy?  YOU ARE NO DOCTOR.

You're right.  Like I said, I'm a doctoral candidate.  Second, no one said the pregnancy had to go full-term.  Children are being born 4 months premature with maturation to normalcy in this day and age. 

And you have NO compassion OR mercy.  Your inhumane attitude toward a helpless little 9 year old speaks volumes to what kind of "doctor" you would be. 

Getting a little combative and judgemental aren't we?  Let us stick to the issue at hand, rather than you trying to speculate how good of a health care professional I am or will be.

 

[Auntie]

Originally posted by nyj


 

Auntie Belle,

A pregnant lady without any health care can go to any myriad of pro-life organizations and they will pay out-of-pocket for the entire nine months of medical expenses for her and her child.  Additional pro-life and Christian organizations will then support that mother for years after the birth of the child (Catholic Charities for example).  My eyes ARE open to reality, it is your eyes that are open but do not see.  You can disbelieve all you want about my being in the medical field, but it amounts to a hill of beans because I am.  It also appears, as a health care professional, and a Christian, that I am more aware about the counters to abortion than you are.  You have become a victim to the spin the abortionists play on the unsuspecting populace.  Time to learn the truth.

 

And to start you on that road, take a look at but one small organization that does exactly what I just described right above:

 

http://birthchoice.org/

Come back in 10 years, and tell me you still say the same thing.  You haven't lived long enough to know what you're talking about.  In my own town, a local OBGYN was on the news, BEGGING poor women to get prenatal care, because he was so frustrated seeing women/teenagers coming to the ER near death with all sorts of complications due to lack of health care.  YOU need to wake up to REALITY.  What is available and what is taken advantage of are TWO DIFFERENT THINGS. 

 

[Auntie]

Originally posted by nyj


Getting a little combative and judgemental aren't we?  Let us stick to the issue at hand, rather than you trying to speculate how good of a health care professional I am or will be.

I am not a moderator, but yes, you move me to anger at your calous attitude.  Do the world a favor, work a few months in an ER, or a trauma unit, watch women die due to LACK of health care, LEARN what real life is like, and then you will understand your ignorance about people and the way the world is, not the ideal way you pretend it to be.

And your brand of Christianity is a scarey thing to behold.   

 

[nyj]

Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um

Come back in 10 years, and tell me you still say the same thing.  You haven't lived long enough to know what you're talking about.  In my own town, a local OBGYN was on the news, BEGGING poor women to get prenatal care, because he was so frustrated seeing women/teenagers coming to the ER near death with all sorts of complications due to lack of health care.  YOU need to wake up to REALITY.  What is available and what is taken advantage of are TWO DIFFERENT THINGS. 

 

First off, I'm 30 years old.  I think I've lived plenty and I've seen plenty and I know what is available and I know what is right and what is wrong.

You said that it is two different things about what is available and what is taken advantage of.  Well, no kidding, thank you for pointing out the obvious.  Which means that as proponents of the pro-life movement, we need to make sure that our voices are AS LOUD as the abortionists (which currently they are NOT) and let women know that they do have options, that they are available, and that they are not alone.  There is no excuse, none whatsoever, in this day and age, that lends itself to be a credible excuse for the advocacy of abortion under ANY circumstances.  Badfish thinks it would be better to subject his child to an abortion (never mind how traumatic such a procedure is, not to mention the after effects such as a higher risk for uterine cancer, depression and all other myriad of health related problems) than subject himself to the idea of his daughter carrying a life within her.  All life, no matter under what condition it was created, is sacred.  God looks upon all life with compassion, it is His creation, and while the circumstance under which it was formed may be brutal, it still is a life.  Only God can create, and if we gush and glow about a planned pregnancy and what a miracle it is, how can we look upon any life, under any circumstances with a jaded eye?

 

[Auntie]

Originally posted by Badfish


 

Auntie will probably beat me to this one. But I am extremely anti-abortion, but in the extreme instance I will vote for abortion.

I am not a victim of any abortionists, I am thinking of what would be best for the 9 year old.

Don't jump to conclusions and accuse me of being a victim of any pro abortion propaganda, I am OPPOSED, but still hold the belief that extreme situations could justify. I couldn't be a good Christian and condone abortion, I can be a good Christian and OPPOSE abominations.

Thank you, Badfish, I agree completely.  As Christians, we are called to LOVE, COMPASSION, and MERCY.  If not for a little 9 year old child, then who?  I am completely against abortion, and yet wise enough to know there are RARE ocassions when they are the most merciful thing to do. 

 

[nyj]

Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um

And your brand of Christianity is a scarey thing to behold. 

 


Luke 6:22 Blessed are you when men&nbsp;hate you, and ostracize you, and insult you, and scorn your name as evil, for the sake of the Son of Man.<RT>

 

[OldBadfish]

Maybe we should just leave it at this: nyj is opposed and has expressed his opinion, he says its ok for a 9 year old to give birth to a rapists baby. A valid opinion, but not one I in good conscience can agree with.

 

[nyj]

Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um


Thank you, Badfish, I agree completely.&nbsp; As Christians, we are called to LOVE, COMPASSION, and MERCY.&nbsp; If not&nbsp;for a little 9 year old child, then who?&nbsp; I am completely against abortion, and yet wise enough to know there are RARE ocassions when&nbsp;they are the most merciful thing to do.&nbsp;

&nbsp;

If you want to play God, be my guest.&nbsp; Just don't ask me to applaud you for your courageous stance.

&nbsp;

Nevermind though, it's 1:30am, time I got my beauty sleep.&nbsp; It's definitely better than sitting here watching someone spout off in ignorance about my faith, my career and my values.

 

[Auntie]

Originally posted by nyj


&nbsp;


<DT>Luke 6:22 Blessed are you when men&nbsp;hate you, and ostracize you, and insult you, and scorn your name as evil, for the sake of the Son of Man.<RT>

&nbsp;

<DT>&nbsp;
<DT>I don't hate you, but you need to learn compassion.&nbsp; 30 years old?&nbsp; You are younger than&nbsp;my son.&nbsp;</DT>

 

[nyj]

Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um


<DT>&nbsp;
<DT>I don't hate you, but you need to learn compassion.&nbsp; 30 years old?&nbsp; You are younger than&nbsp;my son.&nbsp;

</DT>Who else besides me is showing any compassion for that unborn life?&nbsp; You seem to think that I would just tell the nine year to "shut up and deal", which is far from the truth as one could get.&nbsp; Getting the abortion itself could have just as damaging results as you seem to think allowing the pregnancy to go until the child could be delivered safely would have.

Nevermind I've debated this issue ad nauseum with fellow students, co-workers, friends and family.

Nevermind that I was on the very side of the issue that you and Badfish now occupy about five/six years ago.&nbsp; Nevermind that one of the first times I discussed this issue with my wife, I was appalled when she said that she would carry&nbsp;the pregnancy full-term if she were raped, regardless of the consequences to her own health.&nbsp; That simply infuriated me.

It took a lot of examination of the issue, it took a lot of prayer, and it took some understanding on my part (with no small touch of divine guidance) to realize that God does and allows things for a reason.&nbsp; If an abortion is wrong, it is wrong in all instances.&nbsp; Christians should not choose the "lesser of two evils" because if we choose an evil, Satan wins.&nbsp; The Christian travels the road less traveled, the difficult road, the road that forces us to put aside our own selfish needs/desires and to place confidence in God, His mercy and His guidance.

If life is sacred, it must be sacred under all conditions.&nbsp; A child born of the tragedy of rape is still a child, is it not?&nbsp; Does it not deserve a chance at life like all other children?&nbsp; If not, why not?&nbsp; What did that child do to not warrant a chance at life?

 

[MyJhongFist]

Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um
&nbsp;

your brand of Christianity is a scarey thing to behold.&nbsp; &nbsp;

Judging someone else's Christianity is a scary thing to behold, as well.

 

[Auntie]

nyj, do you have any idea how LITTLE a 9 year old girl is???&nbsp; My little niece spent the weekend with me, and SHE IS LITTLE!!!

Tell you what, since you have access to the med field, show me medical history of a 9 year old giving birth without DIEING.&nbsp; IF you can do this, I might change my mind.

NO, nevermind.&nbsp; I just saw the eyes of my little niece, NO WAY would I submit her to that.&nbsp; IT IS CHILD ABUSE to expect a 9 year old to carry a child.

 

[OldBadfish]

IT IS CHILD ABUSE to expect a 9 year old to carry a child.

Especially&nbsp;as a result of a&nbsp;rape! IMHO

 

[MyJhongFist]

Originally posted by Project 86
Abortion is NEVER ok. If the wife dies is that bad? She goes to heaven. If God chooses she may survive.&nbsp;

YES THAT'S BAD !!!!!&nbsp; So if my wife dies, nothing is wrong with that?&nbsp; How cold hearted can a 'Christian' be?&nbsp; I am suprised.

If the respect for LIFE is the objective, then if the mother dies and the child lives, guess what?&nbsp; It's still only one life that goes on....

Whereas, if the child is sacrificed and the mother ( who is capable of producing other, healthy children )&nbsp;lives, it is STILL only one life that goes on...&nbsp;

The whole 'black and white' thing is one problem that I have always had on the abortion issue.

 

[MyJhongFist]

Originally posted by nyj
A child born of the tragedy of rape is still a child, is it not?&nbsp; Does it not deserve a chance at life like all other children?&nbsp; If not, why not?&nbsp;&nbsp;

&nbsp;

As the child of a 12 year old rape victim (who had me when she was 13).&nbsp; Yes, it is still a child.&nbsp;&nbsp;

I just had my first child and if someone told me that if he was not a real child because he was not born yet, they would have gotten a punch in the snoz.

&nbsp;

 

[MyJhongFist]

Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um
&nbsp; IT IS CHILD ABUSE to expect a 9 year old to carry a child.

&nbsp;

Agreed.

 

[MyJhongFist]

Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um


<DT>

<DT>I don't hate you, but you need to learn compassion.&nbsp; 30 years old?&nbsp; You are younger than&nbsp;my son.&nbsp;

</DT>So what Auntie?&nbsp; If someone is under 30, then they don't know anything at all????

You would get along great with my mom.&nbsp; LOL !!!!!!!

 

[Auntie]

Originally posted by nyj

It took a lot of examination of the issue, it took a lot of prayer, and it took some understanding on my part (with no small touch of divine guidance) to realize that God does and allows things for a reason.

Well then, don't go into surgery.&nbsp; After all, if God allows disease, then it must be God's will for the person to be sick.

If life is sacred, it must be sacred under all conditions.&nbsp; A child born of the tragedy of rape is still a child, is it not?&nbsp; Does it not deserve a chance at life like all other children?&nbsp; If not, why not?&nbsp; What did that child do to not warrant a chance at life? [/B]

And what did the 9 year old do to not deserve to live?&nbsp;

Yes, every life is sacred.&nbsp; But there are RARE ocassions when both lives cannot be saved.

I HATE Row vs Wade and partial birth abortions.&nbsp; But we MUST use common sense and have compassion and mercy on people, especially when someones life is at stake.&nbsp; &nbsp;

 

[Auntie]

Originally posted by MyJhongFist
So what Auntie?&nbsp; If someone is under 30, then they don't know anything at all????

You would get along great with my mom.&nbsp; LOL !!!!!!!

nyj seems to think&nbsp;his age somehow qualified his remarks, so I upped him one.

btw, I also thought I knew alot at 30 years old too.&nbsp; But the older I get, the more I know I don't know all there is to know.&nbsp;&nbsp;