a thought

[StillGods]

Another thought occurred to me. What if i wanted to be elect and did all the right things outwardly as well as inwardly really wanted to do what was right, could i become one if i wasnt? would God let me become an elect if i wasnt. would i be forever searching and wanting to fill the God shaped hole we all have but not be able to?

 

[Mountainmanbob]

I believe if one wishes (prays) deeply to be elect they probably are or will be.

There are two fathers one being God and one being the devil.

Those who have the devil as their father usually have no desire for anything much of God or the Bible or church.

An excellent simple prayer oh God please have mercy on me a sinner.

M-Bob

 

[Hazelelponi]

Another thought occurred to me. What if i wanted to be elect and did all the right things outwardly as well as inwardly really wanted to do what was right, could i become one if i wasnt? would God let me become an elect if i wasnt. would i be forever searching and wanting to fill the God shaped hole we all have but not be able to?

I would normally say if you feel drawn to God that means God us doing the drawing.

There are some who "follow" Christianity yet when they die find out they weren't following Christ at all. (Lord Lord did I not prophesy in your name, speaking of false prophets, and other verses)

So, if your elect then you'll never be taken from God's Hand (power), but if your not among the elect then no amount of following biblical edicts can make you God's in truth.

However, the Bible tells us to test the Spirits, to prove all things and to work out our salvation. I think this goes to always making certain it's the God of all creation we are following, being sure that we aren't following false prophets (teachers) and that we are doing as Christ would have us do which is how we do that working out our salvation etc.

If we stay on that narrow path we will be saved. It is through His power we are able to.

We do all these things by the power of the Holy Spirit who is the guarantor of our salvation - we are sealed when we are saved and this is how we know we are saved.

 

[Tolworth John]

Another thought occurred to me. What if i wanted to be elect and did all the right things outwardly as well as inwardly really wanted to do what was right, could i become one if i wasnt? would God let me become an elect if i wasnt. would i be forever searching and wanting to fill the God shaped hole we all have but not be able to?

There are several promises by Jesus that those who seek will find him.

The theology of calvenism is just that theology, ideas men have to try and explain God and how he works.

The theology does not dictate how God opperates any more than a childs book on how things work dictates how things in the world work.
There is a basic explanation, but would yopu trust a doctor who kept referring to a childs book on how the body works?

Seek God and seek to serve him is all that matters.

 

[StillGods]

so how do you know for sure if you're elect or not?

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Short answer but solid.

 

[StillGods]

so its based on your feelings?

 

[StillGods]

if it is about having positive feelings about Jesus being an indicator of being elect (as RC Sproul says in that clip)...my relatives who arent believers like Jesus but as far as I know are not saved. One of them even cried when they visited the Garden of Gethsemene. They do exhibit more Christian behavior than some Christians I know, they are good people but they dont have an interest in becoming believers. so hmm dunno if having positive feelings about Jesus really is what i would go by to be honest.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

It's not about how I feel it's about what I think.
M-Bob

 

[StillGods]

It's not about how I feel it's about what I think.
M-Bob

forgive me if this is too personal and dont feel you have to answer, what is it that you think that would make you sure you are one of the elect?

other people can answer that question if they want to

 

[StillGods]

duplicate post

 

[StillGods]

duplicate post

 

[Mountainmanbob]

forgive me if this is too personal and dont feel you have to answer, what is it that you think that would make you sure you are one of the elect?

other people can answer that question if they want to

This is an excellent sermon which I have heard many times -- well worth the time spent to listen.

M-Bob

 

[Hazelelponi]

so its based on your feelings?

While i totally respect that teacher Pastor RC Sproul,, I think in trying for a short answer he missed the mark in explaining. Here is thorough answer from the book of John for assurance.

 

[Hazelelponi]

forgive me if this is too personal and dont feel you have to answer, what is it that you think that would make you sure you are one of the elect?

other people can answer that question if they want to

What makes me sure is the Holy Spirit testifies in my spirit that I am Gods.

I have love for my fellow believers and for the disciples and people of God, as well as for God.

I feel sad/sorrow for those who are lost. (Its a sorrow born in love for them, which for me is a foreign feeling but it's something that since ive been saved i have)

I am growing in my life as a Christian. While there are many areas of my life I can see I need improvement in, there are areas I can see have changed, where salvation changed me. A look at how far I've come shows me something positive.

All that said, there have been times I've struggled, struggled with doing what God asked of me, struggled with knowing if I belonged to Him during particularly difficult challenges, and during those times, and under those specific spiritual attacks, I remembered that God will let none of us go, that all of His people will never be anything but His and nothing can take us from His hand, and that I know I am His because I believed in truth on the Lord's life, death, and resurrection...(and as the Bible says: believe in your heart and confess with your tongue and you will be saved)

Sometimes you just hang on to that initial salvation moment and the Truth you know it is/was to remember that you belong to God during a spiritual attack. The enemy wants to take our assurance so sometimes you hang on to what you know..

That's likely what RC Sproul was talking about when he said you hang on to your love of Jesus.. that's likely what helped him during a particular spiritual attack, for me, I held onto my initial salvation and the fact I knew my belief was pure and true and therefore truly saved according to the Bible.

There is always going to be something the enemy can never take from you; know what it is and hang onto that during the darkest times. My suggestion is just to make sure it's a biblical standing because we answer Satan the same way Jesus did, using scripture.

Read Ephesians 6:11-12

 

[twin1954]

There are several promises by Jesus that those who seek will find him.

The theology of calvenism is just that theology, ideas men have to try and explain God and how he works.

The theology does not dictate how God opperates any more than a childs book on how things work dictates how things in the world work.
There is a basic explanation, but would yopu trust a doctor who kept referring to a childs book on how the body works?

Seek God and seek to serve him is all that matters.

This is the Ask a Calvinist forum. You are neither allowed or wanted to answer in this forum. Please refrain from commenting here so that you do not get reported.

 

[twin1954]

forgive me if this is too personal and dont feel you have to answer, what is it that you think that would make you sure you are one of the elect?

other people can answer that question if they want to

Faith in the one true God and Jesus Christ whom He has sent. See John 17:3.

Assurance does' come from feelings for they will deceive you. Assurance doesn't come from doing things because you can never do enough. Assurance comes from simply resting in Him and His accomplished salvation by His life and death as the sinner's substitute.

Look to Him, not to or even at yourself for assurance. He has promised and will never go back on His promise.

If you can come to Him, the Sovereign God who rules all things and will not give His glory to another (which includes you and your precious free will) it is because He has already done something in you and for you in sovereign mercy.

He is your assurance that you are one of the elect.

Not one of the elect will be lost and all the others left in their sin only get what they deserve. What is amazing is the He would set His sovereign love and mercy on any of us sinners. He chose the weak and foolish things to set at nought the great things of the earth. It is of Him the you are in Christ Jesus so that none may glory but in the Lord. Salvation is of God. 1Cor. 1:31.

 

[StillGods]

This is the Ask a Calvinist forum. You are neither allowed or wanted to answer in this forum. Please refrain from commenting here so that you do not get reported.

I dont mind if any person posts.
I agree with the verse those who seek Him with all their heart will find Him, that was certainly true in my life. i know God isnt cruel if someone is searching for meaning in their life and cries out God is not going to turn away. God is Merciful.


you mentioned the phrase 'if you can come to Him' - why wouldnt a person be able to?

 

[StillGods]

in Calvinism is it possible to want to be elect but not be? and so even if you want to be, you cant be one, you never will be because youre just not one of the elect. How would you know if this was yourself?

 

[twin1954]

I dont mind if any person posts.
I agree with the verse those who seek Him with all their heart will find Him, that was certainly true in my life. i know God isnt cruel if someone is searching for meaning in their life and cries out God is not going to turn away. God is Merciful.


you mentioned the phrase 'if you can come to Him' - why wouldnt a person be able to?

There are rules in these forums that are ignored often. One of them is that those not of the faith which belongs to the forum are not allowed to post in forums teaching against the doctrines or beliefs of that forum. It would be like me, a Calvinist, going into the Free Will forum and begin to teach them against their beliefs.

To the second part: man is spiritually dead in sin and simply cannot do anything with respect to spiritual things. See 1Cor. 2:13-14. Moreover Christ told that high Jew that we cannot even see the kingdom of heaven apart from being born again ( from above, born of God).

The command to come in no way implies that the ability exists. Please read Matt. 11:25-30 with special attention on verses25-27.

 

[twin1954]

in Calvinism is it possible to want to be elect but not be? and so even if you want to be, you cant be one, you never will be because youre just not one of the elect. How would you know if this was yourself?

The simple answer is no it is not possible. If you desire to bow before the Sovereign God who can do with you as He will then you are one of the elect.

If you come to a Jesus that wants what he cannot have and wishes for what he cannot bring to pass, a Pygmy figment of man's depraved imagination, then you are not saved.

You must come seeking mercy not seeking love or salvation but mercy knowing what sin is and agreeing with God against yourself that you are worthy of all that eternal damnation is. You can't come with your will, you can't come with your good works, you can't come with any of the baggage of religion. The only thing that qualifies you as a soul needing mercy is your sin.

Come like that leper in Matt. 8:1-4. He braved that great crowd who could have rightfully stoned him to death. He came because he had a great need. He came humbly worshipping Him. He came knowing that his life was in the hands of the Lord Jesus. He didn't say Lord I will let you make me whole, that is how most come today, but said Lord if you will you can make me whole. There was never a sinner turned away from the Lord that came seeking sovereign mercy.