A question to the Christian Trump supporters.

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Palmfever

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The more I've thought about it, the more I think this is false, and a bad attempt at "whataboutism."

I'm sure many Republicans will disagree, but I believe Pres. Obama was a man of faith. I do think he tended to be a more private man, so wasn't as open about his beliefs and some Christians would like; not to mention being a Democrat he didn't wish to make them a huge issue.

I believe both Pres. Bush's were strong Christians. You saw Pres. G. W. Bush openly talk about his faith and beliefs, about praying when he had important decisions, while governing. Pres. G. H. W. Bush did not seem to openly talk about his faith (in that way he was more like Pres. Obama) but, particularly in the years since his Presidency ended, he was known to be a man of faith and active in his church.

That isn't to say that these men were perfect, that they didn't make mistakes. Nor does it mean that all Christians must agree with those things these former Presidents believed were right. I do believe, at least by and large, they largely attempted to govern according to their beliefs; just as I have friends who I disagree with politically but can see they are sincere people who try to do right.

Unfortunately, I think too many of us can't get past the politics, not to mention the tendency to see the worst in people and ascribe nefarious motives to those things we disagree with (particularly with political operatives pushing us to see things through those lenses).
Reasonable post. We may have different perspectives. Our experiences and response to them has colored our lens. Hopefully the closer we draw unto God, the more able we are to see through His lens and love those we perceive as opposed to our views.
On wolves; There is said to be two wolves within us.One good and one evil. The one we feed the most becomes the strongest.
In Christ
 
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ViaCrucis

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I voted for President Trump on his stance being pro-life. Also for his stance on christian morals and Israel.

Let's see then.

1) Being pro-life -- in order to be accepted as part of the Republican establishment this was something he would have to be, at least on paper. And this totally ignores the whole ineptitude of the conservative "pro-life" schtick; I'm sure there are conservative politicians who earnestly are pro-life and actually hold to a pro-life ethic. But they are clearly over crowded by the anti-abortionists. No, I don't consider anti-abortionism to be pro-life; because pro-life to be pro-life requires being in favor of life even after the pregnancy comes to full term.

2) His stance on Christian morals? What Christian morals? You mean humility, mercy, forgiveness, justice for the poor and the oppressed, loving one's neighbor, loving one's enemies? Those are Christian morals. The only stance on Christian morals I see from Trump is that he is firmly, vocally, and publicly against Christian morals.

3) Israel? Right, because we can't forget about the fringe minority of Christians who have been deceived into believing the false doctrines of Dispensationalism, and the liars who teach that modern Israel is somehow prophetically significant.

As I see it, the only way for any of this to "work" is if I were to pretend Jesus doesn't matter, burn my Bible, forget two thousand years of Christian theology and moral teaching, and abandon the Christian religion altogether. But, I suppose that's kind of the point of apostasy.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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ViaCrucis

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Sure, he just attended church like clockwork for decades and referenced god constantly. Like non-Christians do all the time..

Wait, you think attending church, reading the Bible, believing in Jesus, and practicing Christianity makes one a Christian? Silly guy, the real mark of a Christian is using tear gas on peaceful protestors to drive them away from a church in order to hold up a Bible and stand in front of a church for a photo-op.

It's right there in the Bible, in 2 Hesitations 4:8, "And they shall know you are my disciples by your smug sense of entitlement and making a spectacle of yourself."

-CryptoLutheran
 
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MarkBerela

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Put simply, what qualities of Christ do you see in Trump?

Please think about this a few moments before answering, as this is a question I have been wanting to ask for the past four years and have not.

Well, I guess I would ask: Why are you looking for qualities of Christ in Trump? I do not believe he is a Christian, otherwise we would indeed some clear work of sanctification in his life.
 
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Paidiske

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None. I see a warrior in Trump.

We needed a warrior, not a saint, if we are to keep our way of life - our freedom.

Hmm.

Since Christ chose the way of the cross rather than the way of the warrior, should we as his followers not be willing to do likewise?

Should we not be willing to relinquish our "way of life" if called to do so?
 
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Allandavid

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None. I see a warrior in Trump.

We needed a warrior, not a saint, if we are to keep our way of life - our freedom.

Really...??

The “warrior” that had daddy ‘bone-spur’ him out of duty to his country?

The “warrior” that thinks that avoiding STDs was ‘his Vietnam’...?

The “warrior” that hides in a bunker and erects a ‘baby gate’ around his house when people shout at him...?

The “warrior” that bends his knee to the Putins of this world...?

I tell you what...if I ever need a “warrior” to protect my security, you can keep your first picks...
 
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Palmfever

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President Obama did much to try to undermine rights of believers and those holding to biblical morality, and especially those concerned about abortion!
I did a search on that subject. There are many sites that clearly take issue with the presidency of Barrack, I went to this one. It appears to have incidents of anti Christian verbiage by Obama, however when I read the transcript it seemed that what he was referring to was more inclusive of all religions than Christian bashing. There are many transcripts. Just checked out one. You may sort them out if you choose. Perhaps you'll find something to substantiate your claim. Personally I didn't like the turkey at all, however, I have found it best in these forums to have a reference for our opinions. Lotta feeling and easy redundant talking points here on both sides of the aisle. Some can't seem to remember if it isn't simple and short enough to fit on a placard. America’s Most Biblically-Hostile U. S. President - WallBuilders
Posting that link may cause some to spew their coffee given the title. Meh. Let's seek truth.
 
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JIMINZ

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Let's see then.

1) Being pro-life -- in order to be accepted as part of the Republican establishment this was something he would have to be, at least on paper. And this totally ignores the whole ineptitude of the conservative "pro-life" schtick; I'm sure there are conservative politicians who earnestly are pro-life and actually hold to a pro-life ethic. But they are clearly over crowded by the anti-abortionists. No, I don't consider anti-abortionism to be pro-life; because pro-life to be pro-life requires being in favor of life even after the pregnancy comes to full term.

2) His stance on Christian morals? What Christian morals? You mean humility, mercy, forgiveness, justice for the poor and the oppressed, loving one's neighbor, loving one's enemies? Those are Christian morals. The only stance on Christian morals I see from Trump is that he is firmly, vocally, and publicly against Christian morals.

3) Israel? Right, because we can't forget about the fringe minority of Christians who have been deceived into believing the false doctrines of Dispensationalism, and the liars who teach that modern Israel is somehow prophetically significant.

As I see it, the only way for any of this to "work" is if I were to pretend Jesus doesn't matter, burn my Bible, forget two thousand years of Christian theology and moral teaching, and abandon the Christian religion altogether. But, I suppose that's kind of the point of apostasy.

-CryptoLutheran

You should at least give it a try, you'll never know unless you give it a shot.
 
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ViaCrucis

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You should at least give it a try, you'll never know unless you give it a shot.

Give what a try? Profaning the holy and blessed name of Jesus Christ before men? No thanks.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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Speedwell

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I did a search on that subject. There are many sites that clearly take issue with the presidency of Barrack, I went to this one. It appears to have incidents of anti Christian verbiage by Obama, however when I read the transcript it seemed that what he was referring to was more inclusive of all religions than Christian bashing. There are many transcripts. Just checked out one. You may sort them out if you choose. Perhaps you'll find something to substantiate your claim. Personally I didn't like the turkey at all, however, I have found it best in these forums to have a reference for our opinions. Lotta feeling and easy redundant talking points here on both sides of the aisle. Some can't seem to remember if it isn't simple and short enough to fit on a placard. America’s Most Biblically-Hostile U. S. President - WallBuilders
Posting that link may cause some to spew their coffee given the title. Meh. Let's seek truth.
In truth, I see a lot of work in support of the First Amendment.
 
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FireDragon76

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Doesn’t seem much of a reason . Disemboweled the EPA . Ignored repeated warnings about a serious pandemic . Encouraged racist and misogynistic activity . Lies repeatedly about everything.etc etc etc Is this what Christian trump supporters really want?

Not a bug, a feature. If anything, that endears him more to his supporters.
 
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FireDragon76

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None. I see a warrior in Trump.

I see Christ in Ben Carson.

We needed a warrior, not a saint, if we are to keep our way of life - our freedom.

Umm... nobody is trying to take away "your way of life". The problem is you guys want to make your wife of life my way of life.
 
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FireDragon76

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most of what you call morality is just over control of people who don’t share your opinions and beliefs

Exactly.

Some people are highly authoritarian and insecure and need that sort of thing. The problem is, many of the rest of us don't. We don't need the moral equivalent of training wheels- we know what is best for us based on our lived experience. Training wheels might be comforting for some, but they ultimately limit our freedom.
 
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FireDragon76

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And yet his policies work better for the body of Christ who have a mandate to hold forth the Word of Life in sharing the gospel without hindrance Philp 2:15 which is the only thing that can change men's hearts for the better. When it came to the Apostle Paul you won't find a lot of what he says to pray for government leaders BUT....that's one thing. That the gospel would be able to go forth without being hindered. 2 Thess 3:1 The gospel....man's only hope for true LIFE and PEACE. Even if Trump is the chief of sinners how is he not better than voting for another who stands in the way of the salvation message being shared?

I find Trump and his supporters alienating, not affirming me in Christian faith.
 
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FireDragon76

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Interestingly, the liberal left says exactly the same thing about conservative Christians; their point of view is that when they resist conservative tyranny they get accused of trying to impose it. Kinda of like a bully complaining that the little kid wouldn't stand still.
Now, before going off on an argument against that complaint, I challenge you to try to see the situation through another person's eyes, and see what it looks like to them. I did, and it made things look a lot different to me.

Feeling naturally entitled makes it difficult for some people to see other points of view. And yet entitlement and humility don't go together at all. Christians usually consider humility to be a virtue.
 
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Palmfever

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In truth, I see a lot of work in support of the First Amendment.
Seemed like a lotta stuff. I didn't put in the effort. I do see that as a leader of a country such as the US, one must be diplomatic and inclusive. While Christ died for all, and the invitation extends to all, it is in essence opposed to the concept that there are many paths to salvation. "I am the way, the truth and the light. No man comes to the Father but by Me." For the sake of peace with other nations tolerance is essential.

John, 8:44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. 45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me. 46 Which of you convicts Me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe Me? 47 He who is of God hears God’s words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.”
Christ's mission was not that of a politician.
 
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