A possible answer to the old/new earth.

[Wolfe]

(No extensive research prior to post, just a thought I had with the research that I have done)

If God created Adam as a fully grown man, and was older physically(assuming he created him as a fully grown man), despite being seconds old.

Could he have done the same with the universe?

 

[DennisTate]

(No extensive research prior to post, just a thought I had with the research that I have done)

If God created Adam as a fully grown man, and was older physically(assuming he created him as a fully grown man), despite being seconds old.

Could he have done the same with the universe?

True.....
that is certainly possible!

But in this new era with President Donald Trump appointing a new
Secretary of Education who is herself a Christian, it is
important that we not unduly offend educated people who have many
valid reasons to be unable to believe in an earth only ten thousand or so years old.

(For example the number of layers of ice on Greenland or Antarctica that are much like the growth rings on a tree)!


NDE of Dr. Richard Eby verifies old earth and gap theory.


.....

"Jesus paused again.
"My book tells of the time when Lucifer's rebellion in heaven changed some things. He sought to usurp my Father's throne, assume his position as the most high God, and to rule the universe. For that blasphemy Lucifer was cast from heaven to Earth; in fact, I saw him fall as a bolt of lightning! In a tantrum of hate and rage over being deposed so fast he and his fallen angels disfigured our perfect Earth. It became void and uninhabitable. For punishment befitting his enemy of God, Lucifer was given a new name, Satan, since he was the self-appointed "adversary' of the Almighty. Anything that God had made, Satan would attempt to destroy from then on. As Lucifer he had been created the highest angel about the throne, one of his assignments and talents being the chief musician in charge of worship and music. In his rebellious anger he set about destroying harmony on and in the Earth from then on. That is why the Earth where he operates now is out of harmony with God's other creations. In my book we call this disharmony "sin', because it defies God's will that even the heavens declare the glory of God and the firmament show his handiwork." (Dr. Richard Eby, near-death .com)

 

[CrystalDragon]

True.....
that is certainly possible!

But in this new era with President Donald Trump appointing a new
Secretary of Education who is herself a Christian, it is
important that we not unduly offend educated people who have many
valid reasons to be unable to believe in an earth only ten thousand or so years old.

(For example the number of layers of ice on Greenland or Antarctica that are much like the growth rings on a tree)!


NDE of Dr. Richard Eby verifies old earth and gap theory.


.....

If God is supposedly not the author of confusion, then to create everything that this implies age and would cause most to conclude that as a result is deception.

 

[DennisTate]

If God is supposedly not the author of confusion, then to create everything that this implies age and would cause most to conclude that as a result is deception.

What Dr. Richard Eby reported after his near death experience is that
Lucifer had the genuine freedom of choice to deceive other angels
and make them angry with the Word / Logos in his pre-existent form,
(other ancient writings indicate that this was jealousy over how
supposedly Adam and Eve were being somehow favoured by the Word / Logos)?

So the original universe, (that could well be 13.72 or so billion years or so old),
was created perfect but then....... became "void and without form" after that
attempted coup by Lucifer / Satan and the angels who followed him.

 

[CrystalDragon]

What Dr. Richard Eby reported after his near death experience is that
Lucifer had the genuine freedom of choice to deceive other angels
and make them angry with the Word / Logos in his pre-existent form,
(other ancient writings indicate that this was jealousy over how
supposedly Adam and Eve were being somehow favoured by the Word / Logos)?

So the original universe, (that could well be 13.72 or so billion years or so old),
was created perfect but then....... became "void and without form" after that
attempted coup by Lucifer / Satan and the angels who followed him.

The problem is that Lucifer is not Satan and never was. If you actually read ALL of Isaiah 14 and not just verses 12-15 that people so endlessly quote. it's clear that "Lucifer" (which in itself is a translation of "Morning Star" a title that also was used to reference both Pharaoh and Jesus) was referring to a Babylonian king who saw himself as high-and-mighty, nothing more.

 

[DennisTate]

The problem is that Lucifer is not Satan and never was. If you actually read ALL of Isaiah 14 and not just verses 12-15 that people so endlessly quote. it's clear that "Lucifer" (which in itself is a translation of "Morning Star" a title that also was used to reference both Pharaoh and Jesus) was referring to a Babylonian king who saw himself as high-and-mighty, nothing more.

Perhaps.....
or was King Nebuchadnezzar for a time practically possessed by that same
fallen angel who once may well have been a Covering Cherub?

I admit that this raises many questions.

For one, how would this fit with King Nebuchadnezzar somehow being a "head of gold?"


Daniel 2:37

"Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for the God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory.

And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold."

 

[CrystalDragon]

Perhaps.....
or was King Nebuchadnezzar for a time practically possessed by that same
fallen angel who once may well have been a Covering Cherub?

I admit that this raises many questions.

For one, how would this fit with King Nebuchadnezzar somehow being a "head of gold?"


Daniel 2:37

"Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for the God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory.

And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold."

"Head of gold" was likely a metaphor. When someone says that they know someone with a "heart of gold", is that person's heart actually made of gold? Of course not, it's saying that they have strong attributes of the heart, like caring and empathy.

Gold is often used as a symbol of wealth, so it's simply saying that the king had great wealth and power over the land he ruled, though maybe not with the arrogance that the King of Babylon did.

 

[Paul of Eugene OR]

(No extensive research prior to post, just a thought I had with the research that I have done)

If God created Adam as a fully grown man, and was older physically(assuming he created him as a fully grown man), despite being seconds old.

Could he have done the same with the universe?

I have a philosophical problem with such a "solution".

For if God created the whole universe as if it were 13+ billion years old . . . but actually only created it 6000 years ago . . . then He would have had to, in His omniscient mind, recreated in detail the whole existance of that universe anyway, in order to get the part right about "as if it were 13+".

But the whole universe is, in any case, nothing but a great thought in the mind of God.

So it would be an impossible point as to how come one doesn't consider the 13+ billion years of history to be real.

 

[DennisTate]

"Head of gold" was likely a metaphor. When someone says that they know someone with a "heart of gold", is that person's heart actually made of gold? Of course not, it's saying that they have strong attributes of the heart, like caring and empathy.

Gold is often used as a symbol of wealth, so it's simply saying that the king had great wealth and power over the land he ruled, though maybe not with the arrogance that the King of Babylon did.

Could be.....
and we are also living in a fascinating time period when
this statement about an obviously terribly flawed ancient King of Babylon
can help us to understand the role that Messiah Yeshua - Jesus has in mind
for President Donald Trump?

And for America.... and for the Bride of Messiah Yeshua - Jesus at this time?

I believe that Messiah Yeshua - Jesus wishes to restore vastly better education for Americas young people.........


President Donald Trump = modern Cyrus prophecy?

 

[-57]

Gravitational time dialation is an explanation.
Time runs slower at sea level than on the International Space Station.

Cosmologist Dr. Russ Humphreys has a model where the earth was in a high gravitional field when God spread out the stars...time ran normal in outer space but was pretty much stopped on earth if viewed from outer space.
I'd have to dig into it, but I believe earth was below the event horizon on part of day 1, day 2 and part of day 3.
The first 20 min of this video explains it.

 

[SkyWriting]

Gravitational time dialation is an explanation.
Time runs slower at sea level than on the International Space Station.

Cosmologist Dr. Russ Humphreys has a model where the earth was in a high gravitional field when God spread out the stars...time ran normal in outer space but was pretty much stopped on earth if viewed from outer space.
I'd have to dig into it, but I believe earth was below the event horizon on part of day 1, day 2 and part of day 3.
The first 20 min of this video explains it.

So if one was creating mass out of nothing, early creation would run
at a much faster speed, relatively speaking.

 

[SkyWriting]

(No extensive research prior to post, just a thought I had with the research that I have done)
If God created Adam as a fully grown man, and was older physically(assuming he created him as a fully grown man), despite being seconds old.
Could he have done the same with the universe?

All the descriptions of the Garden and the Earth are of a fully
formed (and aged) environment. That much can be researched.

 

[-57]

So if one was creating mass out of nothing, early creation would run
at a much faster speed, relatively speaking.

Humphreys model says as the mass of the universe was being created and spread out earth was pushed deeper into the gravitational well....slowing down time on earth relative to the rest of the universe.

Did you watch the video?

 

[Paul of Eugene OR]

Gravitational time dialation is an explanation.
Time runs slower at sea level than on the International Space Station.

Cosmologist Dr. Russ Humphreys has a model where the earth was in a high gravitional field when God spread out the stars...time ran normal in outer space but was pretty much stopped on earth if viewed from outer space.
I'd have to dig into it, but I believe earth was below the event horizon on part of day 1, day 2 and part of day 3.
The first 20 min of this video explains it.

It is contrary to all we know about the universe. It would mean we would see all the rest of the universe highly blue shifted during that time, so much so as to fry the earth. It ignores the evidence we have on earth of vast periods of time that have passed, without regard to seeing the distance of the stars and the time that must have passed for their light to come to us.

 

[-57]

It is contrary to all we know about the universe. It would mean we would see all the rest of the universe highly blue shifted during that time, so much so as to fry the earth. It ignores the evidence we have on earth of vast periods of time that have passed, without regard to seeing the distance of the stars and the time that must have passed for their light to come to us.

You're going to need to post a reference for that hogwash.

 

[DennisTate]

It is contrary to all we know about the universe. It would mean we would see all the rest of the universe highly blue shifted during that time, so much so as to fry the earth. It ignores the evidence we have on earth of vast periods of time that have passed, without regard to seeing the distance of the stars and the time that must have passed for their light to come to us.

Well said!

And why would the G-d of Abraham and/or the Word / Logos in H-s
preexistent form make it look like the ice on Antarctica and Greenland
has been building up for over 600,000 years in layers that look like the rings of trees?

If that was done by G-d.....
it would almost appear like a deception????/

 

[mark kennedy]

(No extensive research prior to post, just a thought I had with the research that I have done)

If God created Adam as a fully grown man, and was older physically(assuming he created him as a fully grown man), despite being seconds old.

Could he have done the same with the universe?

A better explanation might be that God created the universe, the 'heavens and the earth' billions of years ago and created life during creation week about six thousand years ago. That could actually explain a lot of the problems reconciling age, and apparent old age to the literal reading of Genesis one. I don't see a single wrinkle with it.

Grace and peace,
Mark

 

[Paul of Eugene OR]

You're going to need to post a reference for that hogwash.

Its like asking for a reference that two plus two equals four. Those facts are common knowledge, the result of a normal education in science.

 

[Calminian]

What Dr. Richard Eby reported after his near death experience is that
Lucifer had the genuine freedom of choice to deceive other angels
and make them angry with the Word / Logos in his pre-existent form,
(other ancient writings indicate that this was jealousy over how
supposedly Adam and Eve were being somehow favoured by the Word / Logos)?

So the original universe, (that could well be 13.72 or so billion years or so old),
was created perfect but then....... became "void and without form" after that
attempted coup by Lucifer / Satan and the angels who followed him.

According to Ezekiel 28, Satan was walking blameless in the Garden of Eden. And according to Genesis 3 he fell about the time Adam fell and was cursed just before Adam was cursed. That effectively wipes out the above theory.

 

[Calminian]

A better explanation might be that God created the universe, the 'heavens and the earth' billions of years ago and created life during creation week about six thousand years ago. That could actually explain a lot of the problems reconciling age, and apparent old age to the literal reading of Genesis one. I don't see a single wrinkle with it.

Grace and peace,
Mark

Except that it contradicts that Text. In the Beginning God created the heavens and the earth, followed by the six days, followed by the heavens and earth were completed (Gen. 2:1). It's a seamless creation story.

Then you have Exodus 20:11.

"For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day."

Notice it doesn't say He only filled the earth in six days. Notice it says heavens, earth, sea and all in them in six days.

There's no gap.