4th Century St.Augustine Exposes Ape-To-Man Hoax.

[lasthero]

that is one of the most ignorant things I’ve seen on CF . The Darwin did decades of science experiments to come to the conclusions he did . OOS is a brief summary of those decades of experiments. We do have his papers you know

I also like the implication that writing two best-selling books is some small accomplishment. It’s two more best-selling books than most people write...

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

The human brain is nearly tripple the size of that of chimpanzees that would represent a giant leap in adaptive evolution without precursors.

*cough*


No precursors, ey?

It seems the evidence once more disagrees... A nice upward trend is instead found. This graph even nicely shows how starting with homo habilis, natural selection strongly favoured bigger brains in humanoids.

There is no straight line upwards here. Instead we have a gradual curve, as shown by the datapoints, that shows a gradual increase of brain size in the homo genus over the course of 2 friggin million years.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

I also like the implication that writing two best-selling books is some small accomplishment. It’s two more best-selling books than most people write...

It's even worse.
It was implied that they were they only 2 books he wrote.

How many authors write just 2 books and then sees both of them turn into best-sellers?

 

[mark kennedy]

*cough*


No precursors, ey?

View attachment 250672

It seems the evidence once more disagrees... A nice upward trend is instead found. This graph even nicely shows how starting with homo habilis, natural selection strongly favoured bigger brains in humanoids.

There is no straight line upwards here. Instead we have a gradual curve, as shown by the datapoints, that shows a gradual increase of brain size in the homo genus over the course of 2 friggin million years.

That wonderful graph is leaving out an important time before the expansion of the hominid brain size before the emergence of Homo habilis and Homo erectus,

That skull, actually I should say those skulls, represents a million years of evolution before the emergence of the hominid line. It is clearly not human and does not belong in our line. Then you have Homo habilis which is noted for tools not brain size and complexity. Then you get Homo erectus which comes up with totally human anatomy and a doubling of the brain size. That graph doesn't tell the story, it leaves holes you can drive a truck through.

 

[mark kennedy]

Mark what you just stated boggles the mind. I couldn’t even .... my jaw dropped. You actually believe your nonsense about Darwin. I was going to put up that quote about nothing in biology makes sense without evolution . but I can’t spell Dobwhatsis name

I have no idea what you are talking about, what is 'Dobwatsis'? I'm not questioning adaptive evolution as a phenomenon in science, but the unprecedented evolution of the human brain from that of apes is a myth, plain and simple.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

That wonderful graph is leaving out an important time before the expansion of the hominid brain size before the emergence of Homo habilis and Homo erectus,

How is the before time important when the topic is the expansion of cranial capacity in the homo genus?

That skull, actually I should say those skulls, represents a million years of evolution before the emergence of the hominid line. It is clearly not human and does not belong in our line. Then you have Homo habilis which is noted for tools not brain size and complexity. Then you get Homo erectus which comes up with totally human anatomy and a doubling of the brain size. That graph doesn't tell the story, it leaves holes you can drive a truck through.

So basically you are complaining that fossils are hard to find?

ps: are you aware that the fossil record, while strong, is actually the weakest line of evidence in support of evolution theory?

I always have to chuckle when creationists think they can score points by pointing out that we don't have a fossilized individual of enough generations to their liking.

 

[Brightmoon]

I can’t spell Theodosius Dobwhatsis last name but he was a famous biologist. And that quote of his is famous. You should have picked that up at least

 

[mark kennedy]

How is the before time important when the topic is the expansion of cranial capacity in the homo genus?

Because it had to happen over night 2 mya ago without precursors, that's why.

So basically you are complaining that fossils are hard to find?

No we have plenty, most of which are obviously apes.

ps: are you aware that the fossil record, while strong, is actually the weakest line of evidence in support of evolution theory?

Not the issue.

I always have to chuckle when creationists think they can score points by pointing out that we don't have a fossilized individual of enough generations to their liking.

Your mockery remains less the convincing to say the very least.

 

[mark kennedy]

I can’t spell Theodosius Dobwhatsis last name but he was a famous biologist. And that quote of his is famous. You should have picked that up at least

Oh yea, I know who you mean, he worked on the Modern Synthesis. Ok, he said the proteins of chimpanzees and humans seem almost identical, that was found to be false. You had a point here?

 

[Brightmoon]

Because it had to happen over night 2 mya ago without precursors, that's why.



No we have plenty, most of which are obviously apes.



Not the issue.



Your mockery remains less the convincing to say the very least.

. If you could read high school French the bottom skull translated as anthropoid ape. So that graph doesnt have just genus Homo

 

[mark kennedy]

. If you could read high school French the bottom skull translated as anthropoid ape. So that graph doesnt have just genus Homo

I'm finally completely lost, do you mean this graph?

 

[Brightmoon]

I'm finally completely lost, do you mean this graph?

yes, I forgot about the Australopithecus genus when I typed that. And Dobzhansky is the name I couldn’t think of .

 

[lasthero]

I can’t spell Theodosius Dobwhatsis last name but he was a famous biologist. And that quote of his is famous. You should have picked that up at least

Theodosius Dobzhansky.

 

[mark kennedy]

yes, I forgot about the Australopithecus genus when I typed that. And Dobzhansky is the name I couldn’t think of .

Ok, we now know who you mean what what you mean, look at that curve and ask yourself what is the genetic basis? Ok what is the oldest Australopithecus skull available, and the most current? More importantly, what is the cranial capacity?

 

[Brightmoon]

Ok, we now know who you mean what what you mean, look at that curve and ask yourself what is the genetic basis? Ok what is the oldest Australopithecus skull available, and the most current? More importantly, what is the cranial capacity?

. there are about 23-25 protohuman human species that are not chimps . genetics says that we share ancestry and the fossils are additional confirmation . The big difference between chimps and humans ( aside from cranial capacity) is the ability to walk upright and that will show as changes in where the spine inserts into the skull. Even if they only have a skull scientists can tell if it’s a protohuman or not. Genus Australopithecus walked upright, not like a chimp . The outlier on that graph is the unnamed ape skull and even that shows the difference in cranial capacity between it, an Australopithecus, and some members of genus Homo

 

[mark kennedy]

. there are about 23-25 protohuman human species that are not chimps . genetics says that we share ancestry and the fossils are additional confirmation . The big difference between chimps and humans ( aside from cranial capacity) is the ability to walk upright and that will show as changes in where the spine inserts into the skull. Even if they only have a skull scientists can tell if it’s a protohuman or not

Did you see the curve?

About two million years ago it spikes, there has to be a cause. Brain related genes are not open to mutations or changes of any kind, other traits, not so much. Dismissing the cranial capacity is a mistake and keep in mind, the Neanderthals had a cranial capacity larger then our own. BTW, Homo habilis existed, supposedly, two million years ago so the chart is misleading at best, that spike is much sharper then depicted.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Ever since I was a kid in school I was taught that Darwin was the first man who discovered our alleged ape to man origin. This is something that is drilled into our minds since our youth. But what would happen if it were historically presented that Darwin's philosophy which teaches that monkeys, apes and humans belong to the same pedigree existed long before Darwin?

It would suggest that your teachers were a bit lazy in presenting the history of evolutionary thought.

Would that not prove that evolution is ancient pantheist religion?

No, the modern theory of evolution is a scientific theory. Aristarchus believed the earth went around the sun, and presumably worshipped the sun-god Apollo. This does not mean the modern theory of heliocentrism is ancient religion.

 

[pitabread]

Brain related genes are not open to mutations or changes of any kind

Wut?

 

[mark kennedy]

It would suggest that your teachers were a bit lazy in presenting the history of evolutionary thought.



No, the modern theory of evolution is a scientific theory. Aristarchus believed the earth went around the sun, and presumably worshipped the sun-god Apollo. This does not mean the modern theory of heliocentrism is ancient religion.

Don't confuse the theory of evolution with Darwinism because they are not the same thing. Evolution is a phenomenon in nature while the Darwinian tree of life is a mythology, plain and simple. The two have little to do with one another.

 

[Brightmoon]

Did you see the curve?

About two million years ago it spikes, there has to be a cause. Brain related genes are not open to mutations or changes of any kind, other traits, not so much. Dismissing the cranial capacity is a mistake and keep in mind, the Neanderthals had a cranial capacity larger then our own. BTW, Homo habilis existed, supposedly, two million years ago so the chart is misleading at best, that spike is much sharper the depicted.

Neanderthals also had a different brain shape from us . They were a different species of Homo after all. Brain related genes are certainly open to mutations . I don’t know where you got the nonsense from that they aren’t . there were also changes to jaw muscle genes that allowed for the expansion of the skull roof to keep that larger brain from being damaged by the hard skull . There were genetic changes to allow human babies to survive at an earlier gestational age to prevent that larger head from killing the mother during labor. It’s not just changes to cranial capacity. That large skull and changed spine insertion are just the more obvious physical ones that you’d find in a fossil .

Genetics fills in the gaps in the fossil record! And of course you’re going to beat that fossils-only dead horse until you’re left with powdered bones