40 "Smaller Heresies" of Modernism - Fr. David Nix

[Gnarwhal]

Very interesting list from Fr. David Nix which features the (increasingly common) belief in modern Catholicism versus the Apostolic truth.

Many Catholics studying the current crisis in the Church have become numb to the definition of Pope Saint Pius X that modernism is “the synthesis of all heresies.” Some may think “synthesis of all heresies” is an amorphous problem of general doctrinal malaise. Others might classify it as a paranoid papal prophesy that never really materialized for the good-willed but jumpy Pope.

But what has been astonishing to me lately is that I keep seeing that I learned everything, yes, quite literally everything, while growing up in Catholic grade school, high school and even seminary—wrong. I don’t mean just liturgical issues. I mean the seemingly-smaller issues of Catholic doctrine are all turning out to be the exact opposite of what I was taught for over 30 years of my education:​

40 'Smaller' Heresies of Modernism

DISCUSS!

 

[tz620q]

Very interesting list from Fr. David Nix which features the (increasingly common) belief in modern Catholicism versus the Apostolic truth.

Many Catholics studying the current crisis in the Church have become numb to the definition of Pope Saint Pius X that modernism is “the synthesis of all heresies.” Some may think “synthesis of all heresies” is an amorphous problem of general doctrinal malaise. Others might classify it as a paranoid papal prophesy that never really materialized for the good-willed but jumpy Pope.

But what has been astonishing to me lately is that I keep seeing that I learned everything, yes, quite literally everything, while growing up in Catholic grade school, high school and even seminary—wrong. I don’t mean just liturgical issues. I mean the seemingly-smaller issues of Catholic doctrine are all turning out to be the exact opposite of what I was taught for over 30 years of my education:​

40 'Smaller' Heresies of Modernism

DISCUSS!

Well that took a very different slant than I thought it would. When he started talking about Saint Pius X and condemnations on modernism, I thought he would bring up "PASCENDI DOMINICI GREGIS". Instead, he seems to present his own list as though it is a list from Pope Pius X. The list includes several things, like limbo, that were never dogmatically proclaimed as though a lack of belief in limbo was heretical to the Apostolic Catholic faith. I could see this list creating a lot of discussion about these topics and I hope that is what the Father is attempting to do, rather than pandering his beliefs as though they are the measure of Apostolic belief.

 

[BryanJohnMaloney]

Some of the claims on that page contradict Papal statements. Not a Catholic page, unless the "Catholic" in question is a Sedevacantist or Conclavist.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Very interesting list from Fr. David Nix which features the (increasingly common) belief in modern Catholicism versus the Apostolic truth.

Many Catholics studying the current crisis in the Church have become numb to the definition of Pope Saint Pius X that modernism is “the synthesis of all heresies.” Some may think “synthesis of all heresies” is an amorphous problem of general doctrinal malaise. Others might classify it as a paranoid papal prophesy that never really materialized for the good-willed but jumpy Pope.

But what has been astonishing to me lately is that I keep seeing that I learned everything, yes, quite literally everything, while growing up in Catholic grade school, high school and even seminary—wrong. I don’t mean just liturgical issues. I mean the seemingly-smaller issues of Catholic doctrine are all turning out to be the exact opposite of what I was taught for over 30 years of my education:​

40 'Smaller' Heresies of Modernism

DISCUSS!

Some of these, like #29, need to be unpacked more. That one is not so cut and dried.

 

[Light of the East]

4. Following your conscience is enough for pagans to be saved.

That's what St. Paul said:

Rom 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another.

11. Most people go to Purgatory. VS Most people go to hell.

But they stay in hell only long enough to satisfy the justice of God and come to repentance.

St Clement of Alexandria – “We can set no limits to the agency of the Redeemer to redeem, to rescue, to discipline in his work, and so will he continue to operate after this life.” He also said, “All men are Christ’s, some by knowing Him, the rest not yet. He is the Savior, not of some and the rest not. For how is He Savior and Lord, if not the Savior and Lord of all?”

Theodore of Mopsuestia – “The wicked who have committed evil the whole period of their lives shall be punished till they learn that, by continuing in sin, they only continue in misery. And when, by this means, they shall have been brought to fear God, and to regard Him with good will, they shall obtain the enjoyment of His grace.”

If you wish further discussion on this, I will meet you in the CONTROVERSIAL THEOLOGY ROOM and we can have at it.

22 The Bible was written by holy men of God. VS The Bible was written by God Himself in dictating to holy men.

Which to me is rather funny because the second declaration (Traditionalist Latin Catholic) is exactly what the Anabaptist Fundamentalists teach.

29 Aborted and miscarried babies go to heaven. VS Aborted and miscarried babies go to limbo (a place of bliss where they are ministered to by the angels, but these children are deprived of the beatific vision.)

There is no such place as Limbo. It is a faux invention of the Roman Catholic Church when the Church became embarrassed over the idea that unbaptized babies, who had done no sin, would wind up in an eternal fire of torment.

You might prefer many of the above points of Modernist “Catholicism” to Apostolic Catholicism. That is to be expected, as we all have a temptation to want Jesus without the cross. But Modernist “Catholicism” is really only Protestantism that has infiltrated the Church to the point that 99% of every Catholic (clergy and lay) in the West believes it. But it is not a religion that will last. Msgr. Bux said a few years ago in Rome: “The Church cannot change the faith and at the same time ask believers to remain faithful to it.”

Yet the Roman Catholic Church did exactly that. The faith expounded by the Early Fathers has no reference at all to the following:

1. Purgatory as a place
2. The Immaculate Conception
3. Indulgences
4. The Filioque Clause in the Creed.
5. Dead (Leavened) Bread in the Eucharist.
6. Withholding the Eucharist from children till some imaginary "age of reason."
7. Baptism by sprinkling.
8. Papal Supremacy
9. Papal Infallibility.

And many others: Fr. Thomas Hopko -- Roman Presidency and Christian Unity in our Time

 

[tz620q]

11. Most people go to Purgatory. VS Most people go to hell.

But they stay in hell only long enough to satisfy the justice of God and come to repentance.

St Clement of Alexandria – “We can set no limits to the agency of the Redeemer to redeem, to rescue, to discipline in his work, and so will he continue to operate after this life.” He also said, “All men are Christ’s, some by knowing Him, the rest not yet. He is the Savior, not of some and the rest not. For how is He Savior and Lord, if not the Savior and Lord of all?”

Theodore of Mopsuestia – “The wicked who have committed evil the whole period of their lives shall be punished till they learn that, by continuing in sin, they only continue in misery. And when, by this means, they shall have been brought to fear God, and to regard Him with good will, they shall obtain the enjoyment of His grace.”


You might prefer many of the above points of Modernist “Catholicism” to Apostolic Catholicism. That is to be expected, as we all have a temptation to want Jesus without the cross. But Modernist “Catholicism” is really only Protestantism that has infiltrated the Church to the point that 99% of every Catholic (clergy and lay) in the West believes it. But it is not a religion that will last. Msgr. Bux said a few years ago in Rome: “The Church cannot change the faith and at the same time ask believers to remain faithful to it.”

Yet the Roman Catholic Church did exactly that. The faith expounded by the Early Fathers has no reference at all to the following:

1. Purgatory as a place
2. The Immaculate Conception
3. Indulgences
4. The Filioque Clause in the Creed.
5. Dead (Leavened) Bread in the Eucharist.
6. Withholding the Eucharist from children till some imaginary "age of reason."
7. Baptism by sprinkling.
8. Papal Supremacy
9. Papal Infallibility.

And many others: Fr. Thomas Hopko -- Roman Presidency and Christian Unity in our Time

Yet the quotes from Clement of Alexandria and Theodore of Mopsuestia seem to indicate a belief in a period of purgation followed by God's grace. So it seems that the ECF at least saw a process of purgation, even if they did not define a location. This seems very close to the current Catholic Catechism which defines Purgatory as a “purification, so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven,” which is experienced by those “who die in God’s grace and friendship, but still imperfectly purified” (CCC 1030). It notes that “this final purification of the elect . . . is entirely different from the punishment of the damned” (CCC 1031).

So the only controversial thing to discuss seems to be this form of universal salvation that is implied above. How would you state your stance on this?

 

[dzheremi]

Careful, Light of the East. OBOB has a debate subforum, but this is not it.

Also, Theodore of Mopsuestia?

 

[Light of the East]

Yet the quotes from Clement of Alexandria and Theodore of Mopsuestia seem to indicate a belief in a period of purgation followed by God's grace. So it seems that the ECF at least saw a process of purgation, even if they did not define a location. This seems very close to the current Catholic Catechism which defines Purgatory as a “purification, so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven,” which is experienced by those “who die in God’s grace and friendship, but still imperfectly purified” (CCC 1030). It notes that “this final purification of the elect . . . is entirely different from the punishment of the damned” (CCC 1031).

So the only controversial thing to discuss seems to be this form of universal salvation that is implied above. How would you state your stance on this?

I find the arguments for Patristic Universalism to be reasonable and worthy of belief. If you wish to go into the details of this, I suggest we go to the debate room for OBOB

 

[tz620q]

I find the arguments for Patristic Universalism to be reasonable and worthy of belief. If you wish to go into the details of this, I suggest we go to the debate room for OBOB

I don't know of a debate forum on OBOB. I don't think the OP article advocates universalism, so to keep this on topic, I would like to move on.

 

[Markie Boy]

Yes - #29 is really something that's not so clear as that little box it's listed in.