30 % of Evangelicals deny Jesus is God !

mlepfitjw

May you be blessed!
Jun 23, 2020
1,620
1,093
Alabama
✟44,897.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
All of the cult books I've read teach that any who reject the Ecumenical Creeds are cults of Christendom and not actually the Church.

Dave would you say all that stuff is just doctrine of men?

So none of that matters really to me to try to fit in to a group.

So I’m done talking about it on this topic.

people believe what they desire to believe mainly based on what men have taught who had sin just like everyone else and needed Jesus because they had made mistakes and I’m okay and understand that.

So I just shrug my shoulder at the point, cause God sees people heart were men wanna hear it from their mouth.
 
Upvote 0

hedrick

Senior Veteran
Supporter
Feb 8, 2009
20,250
10,565
New Jersey
✟1,147,348.00
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Single
Other interesting answers
  • "God created male and female." What does this mean? If it's intended to be about transsexuality, I don't think it quite captures the issue.
  • "Jesus is the first and greatest being created by God." Most evangelicals agreed. Technically this statement is either Arian or absurd (depending upon whether "Jesus" is intended to refer to a human or is a synonym for Christ), but I doubt that most Evangelicals are Arian. I suspect they interpreted this as asserting Christ's preexistence. How did the folks at Lifeway intend it? There are no other trick questions in the list. Did someone not realize that this is a classic Arian statement?
  • "Jesus Christ is the only person who never sinned." Unfortunately this combines two different questions. Jesus never sinned. Everyone else sins. Evangelicals almost all accepted this, so the distinction doesn't matter for them. But some other Christians disagreed (23%) If you disagree it's hard to be sure which of the two assertions you disagree with.
  • "Even the smallest sin deserves eternal damnation." 56% of evangelicals disagreed. 73% of non-Evangelical Christians disagreed.
  • "God will always reward true faith with material blessings in this life." 41% of evangelicals, 43% of other Christians agreed. Ugh.
  • "Worshiping alone or with one’s family is a valid replacement for regularly attending church." 45% of evangelicals agreed
  • "Gender identity is a matter of choice." 66% of evangelicals DISagreed. I wonder what they thought they were disagreeing with.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

bekkilyn

Contemplative Christian
Supporter
Apr 27, 2017
7,612
8,475
USA
✟677,608.00
Country
United States
Faith
Methodist
Marital Status
Celibate
Politics
US-Others
Jesus claimed the authority to forgive sins, which is something that ONLY God can do and a big reason why many of the religious authorities took issue with him. So regardless of whether or not Jesus made an outright statement to be God, he did make the claim to be God by claiming the right to that which belonged only to God.

And if you don't believe that Jesus the Christ is God, then you do not believe that Jesus had the authority to forgive sins. And if you don't believe that Jesus had the authority to forgive sins (because you don't believe he is God), then there is no victory over sin and therefore no salvation and no new covenant of grace. We are all still condemned in our state of sin.

Believing in Jesus the Christ isn't just a matter of intellectually believing that some sort of exceptional human being existed around the time he physically lived on earth, but in putting trust that Jesus has the ability and the divine authority of God.

Sure anyone who sets up a chicken statue in the middle of the field and names it Christ and gives to it sacrificial offerings can call themselves "Christian" and be technically correct, but the historical Creeds were developed for the purpose of clarifying Christian beliefs, and the fact that some evangelicals today have developed all sorts of major and minor heresies concerning the Trinity and other aspects of the faith still does not negate the fact that the Trinity who includes Jesus the Christ along with the Father and Holy Spirit is co-equal and co-eternal and fully supported by scripture.
 
Upvote 0

Tigger45

Romans 12:2…be transformed…
Supporter
Aug 24, 2012
20,713
13,149
E. Eden
✟1,264,386.00
Country
United States
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Constitution
There is also a trend where congregations are build upon pastors who are great orators. Cherry-picking their teachings from one of two scriptures and creating a rather dynamic message but that is short on depth in orthodox theology.
 
Upvote 0

hedrick

Senior Veteran
Supporter
Feb 8, 2009
20,250
10,565
New Jersey
✟1,147,348.00
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Single
Jesus claimed the authority to forgive sins, which is something that ONLY God can do and a big reason why many of the religious authorities took issue with him. So regardless of whether or not Jesus made an outright statement to be God, he did make the claim to be God by claiming the right to that which belonged only to God.

And if you don't believe that Jesus the Christ is God, then you do not believe that Jesus had the authority to forgive sins. And if you don't believe that Jesus had the authority to forgive sins (because you don't believe he is God), then there is no victory over sin and therefore no salvation and no new covenant of grace. We are all still condemned in our state of sin.

Believing in Jesus the Christ isn't just a matter of intellectually believing that some sort of exceptional human being existed around the time he physically lived on earth, but in putting trust that Jesus has the ability and the divine authority of God.

Sure anyone who sets up a chicken statue in the middle of the field and names it Christ and gives to it sacrificial offerings can call themselves "Christian" and be technically correct, but the historical Creeds were developed for the purpose of clarifying Christian beliefs, and the fact that some evangelicals today have developed all sorts of major and minor heresies concerning the Trinity and other aspects of the faith still does not negate the fact that the Trinity who includes Jesus the Christ along with the Father and Holy Spirit is co-equal and co-eternal and fully supported by scripture.
Sure, but the problem with a survey like this is that you can't tell what people actually mean. Do they not believe the Gospels when they say this, or do they think that in 1st Cent Judaism it was possible for a human to share in God's authority, and that was the situation for Jesus. Or do they think he was Gods representative, pronouncing a verdict that he knew was from God. All of these are positions that people who consider themselves Christians hold.

Then there are people who follow Jesus but take all of theology with a grain of salt. I always think of the song "Taint Necessarily So." I think you’ll find that many Christians have always been like that. I very much doubt that this is new. But church history and Christian forums ignore them. We have no way to go back and survey the beliefs of medieval populations, and anyone who would show skepticism in writing got killed or at least fired until fairly recently.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

ByTheSpirit

Come Lord Jesus
May 17, 2011
11,422
4,650
Manhattan, KS
✟186,612.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
More than half of American adults, including 30% of evangelicals, say Jesus isn’t God but most agree He was a great teacher, according to results from the 2020 State of Theology survey.

Even though the Bible and traditional teachings of the Christian Church hold that Jesus truly existed as both man and God, among the key findings of the biennial State of Theology survey from Ligonier Ministries conducted with LifeWay Research, is that 52% of American adults believe that Jesus was a great teacher and nothing more.More than half of US adults, 30% of evangelicals believe Jesus isn’t God: study

That would be 1/3 of professing christians on this forum.

ASTOUNDING !
My church once did a series of lessons taught by members about the difficulties of ministry and each member selected to teach a lesson was given a country to focus on.

Most focused on other religions within their given land, and outside of the church influences. I was given the USA and instead of focusing on the outside, I explored why the church in America struggles from within and it was depressing.

Now this was years ago, but I think my research came from Pew Research and these numbers arent surprising. In fact a rather large number of church goers dont even believe Jesus was perfect.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Jesus is YHWH
Upvote 0

mlepfitjw

May you be blessed!
Jun 23, 2020
1,620
1,093
Alabama
✟44,897.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
  • What ever happened to Jesus Christ being God's Word, in the old testament?

  • Was it not the Word after God - - Spoke that created?

God had his Word, and His Spirit all together with him in the old testament.

Then in the new testament Word became flesh named, Yeshua/Jesus , and God indwelled the Lord Jesus Christ by his spirit.

  • Now we gotta all claim that Jesus Christ is God to be saved from our sins, when that is not what Paul preached.

Paul preached, the life, death, burial and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ as the Gospel.

  • 1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave Himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time,

  • 1 Corinthians 8:6 But for us, There is one God, the Father, by whom all things were created, and for whom we live. And there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things were created, and through whom we live.

  • Ephesians 4:4-6 For there is one body and one Spirit, just as you have been called to one glorious hope for the future.

  • 5 There is one Lord, one faith, one baptism,
  • 6 one God and Father of all,
  • who is over all, in all, and living through all.

  • 1 Corinthians 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

My agenda is not to fight.

  • And if people see them self as superior because of their belief and their claims to be right, for the sake of being right with no lee way for anyone to have any freedom is something that just crawls under my skin.

People have the freedom to go to God directly through the belief in the Lord Jesus Christ because of his life, death, burial, resurrection, and that is as simple as a person can make it for others out of love, grace, and mercy.

Okay, it is tiring to get the point across.

God bless all of you and your families, and may the grace and mercy of God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ be with you.
 
Upvote 0

Dave L

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jun 28, 2018
15,549
5,875
USA
✟580,110.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Dave would you say all that stuff is just doctrine of men?

So none of that matters really to me to try to fit in to a group.

So I’m done talking about it on this topic.

people believe what they desire to believe mainly based on what men have taught who had sin just like everyone else and needed Jesus because they had made mistakes and I’m okay and understand that.

So I just shrug my shoulder at the point, cause God sees people heart were men wanna hear it from their mouth.
“Now I want to remind you, although you once fully knew it, that Jesus, who saved a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe.” Jude 5 (ESV)

and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they were all drinking from the spiritual rock that followed them, and the rock was Christ.” (1 Corinthians 10:4
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jesus is YHWH
Upvote 0

Maria Billingsley

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Oct 7, 2018
9,583
7,777
63
Martinez
✟894,354.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
More than half of American adults, including 30% of evangelicals, say Jesus isn’t God but most agree He was a great teacher, according to results from the 2020 State of Theology survey.

Even though the Bible and traditional teachings of the Christian Church hold that Jesus truly existed as both man and God, among the key findings of the biennial State of Theology survey from Ligonier Ministries conducted with LifeWay Research, is that 52% of American adults believe that Jesus was a great teacher and nothing more.More than half of US adults, 30% of evangelicals believe Jesus isn’t God: study

That would be 1/3 of professing christians on this forum.

ASTOUNDING !
If we do not understand that God came in the Flesh as Jesus Christ of Nazareth, then how are we to understand scriptures that tell us so ?
Lets take this one:
Isaiah 9:6
For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder, and his name shall be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
 
Upvote 0

Maria Billingsley

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Oct 7, 2018
9,583
7,777
63
Martinez
✟894,354.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
  • What ever happened to Jesus Christ being God's Word, in the old testament?

  • Was it not the Word after God - - Spoke that created?
God had his Word, and His Spirit all together with him in the old testament.

Then in the new testament Word became flesh named, Yeshua/Jesus , and God indwelled the Lord Jesus Christ by his spirit.

  • Now we gotta all claim that Jesus Christ is God to be saved from our sins, when that is not what Paul preached.

Paul preached, the life, death, burial and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ as the Gospel.

  • 1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave Himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time,

  • 1 Corinthians 8:6 But for us, There is one God, the Father, by whom all things were created, and for whom we live. And there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things were created, and through whom we live.

  • Ephesians 4:4-6 For there is one body and one Spirit, just as you have been called to one glorious hope for the future.

  • 5 There is one Lord, one faith, one baptism,
  • 6 one God and Father of all,
  • who is over all, in all, and living through all.

  • 1 Corinthians 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

My agenda is not to fight.

  • And if people see them self as superior because of their belief and their claims to be right, for the sake of being right with no lee way for anyone to have any freedom is something that just crawls under my skin.

People have the freedom to go to God directly through the belief in the Lord Jesus Christ because of his life, death, burial, resurrection, and that is as simple as a person can make it for others out of love, grace, and mercy.

Okay, it is tiring to get the point across.

God bless all of you and your families, and may the grace and mercy of God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ be with you.
Isaiah 9:6
For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder, and his name shall be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dave L
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Maria Billingsley

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Oct 7, 2018
9,583
7,777
63
Martinez
✟894,354.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Hello brother,@Jesus is YHWH

To you, why does that matter?

Just because someone doesn't say Jesus is God but is the Lord Jesus Christ?

Would you say if someone just believes that Jesus Christ is not God, that they are lesser than someone who says Jesus Christ is God?
It matters to all who want to be in the Body of Christ to understand who Jesus Christ of Nazareth is.
Isaiah 9:6
For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder, and his name shall be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Be blessed
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Jesus is YHWH
Upvote 0

1watchman

Overseer
Supporter
Oct 9, 2010
6,039
1,226
Washington State
✟358,358.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
More than half of American adults, including 30% of evangelicals, say Jesus isn’t God but most agree He was a great teacher, according to results from the 2020 State of Theology survey.

Even though the Bible and traditional teachings of the Christian Church hold that Jesus truly existed as both man and God, among the key findings of the biennial State of Theology survey from Ligonier Ministries conducted with LifeWay Research, is that 52% of American adults believe that Jesus was a great teacher and nothing more.More than half of US adults, 30% of evangelicals believe Jesus isn’t God: study

That would be 1/3 of professing christians on this forum.

ASTOUNDING !

Yes, and the national PEW RESEARCH confirms that ---saying they find only 20 % of professing Christians are truly worshipping Jesus as the Christ. A seeker needs to read such as John 14; John 3:16; Romans 8; and the Epistle: 1 Jn. 5:10-12. That makes the need for us quite plain. The Lord Jesus in not the Father, but is God manifested in the flesh: "...if you have seen Me you have seen the Father", He tells us.
 
Upvote 0

Jesus is YHWH

my Lord and my God !
Supporter
Dec 15, 2011
3,496
1,726
✟389,967.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
  • What ever happened to Jesus Christ being God's Word, in the old testament?

  • Was it not the Word after God - - Spoke that created?
God had his Word, and His Spirit all together with him in the old testament.

Then in the new testament Word became flesh named, Yeshua/Jesus , and God indwelled the Lord Jesus Christ by his spirit.

  • Now we gotta all claim that Jesus Christ is God to be saved from our sins, when that is not what Paul preached.

Paul preached, the life, death, burial and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ as the Gospel.

  • 1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave Himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time,

  • 1 Corinthians 8:6 But for us, There is one God, the Father, by whom all things were created, and for whom we live. And there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things were created, and through whom we live.

  • Ephesians 4:4-6 For there is one body and one Spirit, just as you have been called to one glorious hope for the future.

  • 5 There is one Lord, one faith, one baptism,
  • 6 one God and Father of all,
  • who is over all, in all, and living through all.

  • 1 Corinthians 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

My agenda is not to fight.

  • And if people see them self as superior because of their belief and their claims to be right, for the sake of being right with no lee way for anyone to have any freedom is something that just crawls under my skin.

People have the freedom to go to God directly through the belief in the Lord Jesus Christ because of his life, death, burial, resurrection, and that is as simple as a person can make it for others out of love, grace, and mercy.

Okay, it is tiring to get the point across.

God bless all of you and your families, and may the grace and mercy of God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ be with you.
You should learn how the OT is used in the NT especially with who Jesus is as LORD ( YHWH) in the OT. The NT translated YHWH in the OT as Kurios( Lord) in the NT.

If you do not accept what I'm saying accept the KJV bible translators below !

Here from the KJV bible online :

" Whenever Jesus quoted Old Testament passages that have the Tetragrammaton, he translated the Hebrew "יהוה (YHWH)" as "kurios," which is the Greek word for "Lord." Thus Jesus used either an Aramaic or Greek word for "Lord" to translate "יהוה." At the very least, the New Testament writers used "kurios" to refer to the Tetragrammaton. "

So when a person is calling Jesus their Lord they are confessing He is YHWH( God).

This is Exactly what Paul is saying in Romans 10:9-13 when he specifically quotes Joel 2:32 (YHWH) and declares Jesus is that same Lord ( YHWH)one must confess to be saved, that one must call upon to be saved.

I can supply many other passages in the NT where the OT is quoted about YHWH and in the NT applied to Christ at that Lord(YHWH)

hope this helps !!!
 
Upvote 0

Jesus is YHWH

my Lord and my God !
Supporter
Dec 15, 2011
3,496
1,726
✟389,967.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
You're reading to much into the scripture. Salvation is not that difficult.

The fact that Jesus is God is not in the Gospel of salvation, the Gospel is that a Saviour came and delivered us from our sins.

You are not reading the truth into Scripture and understanding who the Lord ( YHWH) is in the OT and NT.

Paul says in Romans 10 that if you confess Jesus is LORD and believe God raised Him from the dead you shall be saved. What does it mean to confess Jesus is Lord? Let’s examine just a couple of passages from Paul and John.


Isa 6:1-5
I saw the Lord sitting on a throne, lofty and exalted, with the train of His robe filling the temple. 2Seraphim stood above Him, each having six wings: with two he covered his face, and with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. And one called out to another and said,
"Holy, Holy, Holy, is the Lord of hosts,
The whole earth is full of His glory."
4And the foundations of the thresholds trembled at the voice of him who called out, while the temple was filling with smoke. 5Then I said,
"Woe is me, for I am ruined!
Because I am a man of unclean lips,
And I live among a people of unclean lips;
For my eyes have seen the King, the Lord of hosts."


John 12:41
These things Isaiah said because he saw His glory, and he spoke of Him.

We see that the Apostle John said that Isaiah saw the glory of Jesus in Isaiah 6 for this was the one and only time Isaiah was in the presence of Yahweh.

In Romans 10:9-10, we see that Christians will confess that Jesus is Lord. The context through verse 13 clearly shows that Jesus is the Lord which all men must call on in order to be saved. Paul quotes from Joel 2:32 to make his point.Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved (verse 13). If you read Joel 2:32 one can see that Paul quoted from this verse.

When we look at the OT passage salvation comes to those who call on the name of YHWH ie...the Divine name of Israel for God. Paul declares it is Jesus upon whom we must call on in order to be saved.

In Philippians 2:9-11, we read that Jesus has a name that is above every name that at His name every knee should bow and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord. Paul bases his statements on Isaiah 45:23, where we read (By myself I have sworn, my mouth has uttered in all integrity a word that will not be revoked: Before Me every knee will bow; by Me every tongue will swear .

In the context this is clearly YHWH speaking of Himself. He is the Lord who says there is no God apart from Me in verse 21.Paul does not hesitate in saying that every knee will bow to Jesus and every tongue will confess Jesus is YHWH( LORD).

It is an indisputable fact that Paul said God bestowed the Name “Yahweh” on Jesus because in Philippians 2: 9-11 he was quoting Isaiah 45: 21-24.

This is what Yahweh told Isaiah:
“And there is no other God besides Me, a righteous God and a Savior; there is none except Me. Turn to Me, and be saved, all the ends of the earth; for I am God, and there is no other. I have sworn by Myself, the Word has gone forth from My mouth in righteousness and will not turn back, that to Me every knee will bow, every tongue will swear allegiance, they will say of Me, ‘Only in Yahweh are righteousness and strength.’ Men will come to Him and all who were angry with Him shall be put to shame.”

Isaiah 43: 11- Yahweh said that He is our only Savior- Even I Am Yahweh and there is no other Savior besides Me. This verse is very clear as to its meaning.

We see that Yahweh is the Name God bestowed on Jesus and it is Yahweh which is the Name that is above every name and it is Yahweh to which every knee will bow. There is no mistaking that Paul declares in his epistles that Jesus is the Yahweh of the Hebrew Scriptures. Jesus is our Lord Yahweh in the New Testament as well as our Savior. These were the specific names that were Gods alone in the Old Testament.

hope this helps !!!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dave L
Upvote 0

Charlie24

Newbie
Oct 17, 2014
2,306
963
✟103,731.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Single
You are not reading the truth into Scripture and understanding who the Lord ( YHWH) is in the OT and NT.

Paul says in Romans 10 that if you confess Jesus is LORD and believe God raised Him from the dead you shall be saved. What does it mean to confess Jesus is Lord? Let’s examine just a couple of passages from Paul and John.


Isa 6:1-5
I saw the Lord sitting on a throne, lofty and exalted, with the train of His robe filling the temple. 2Seraphim stood above Him, each having six wings: with two he covered his face, and with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. And one called out to another and said,
"Holy, Holy, Holy, is the Lord of hosts,
The whole earth is full of His glory."
4And the foundations of the thresholds trembled at the voice of him who called out, while the temple was filling with smoke. 5Then I said,
"Woe is me, for I am ruined!
Because I am a man of unclean lips,
And I live among a people of unclean lips;
For my eyes have seen the King, the Lord of hosts."


John 12:41
These things Isaiah said because he saw His glory, and he spoke of Him.

We see that the Apostle John said that Isaiah saw the glory of Jesus in Isaiah 6 for this was the one and only time Isaiah was in the presence of Yahweh.

In Romans 10:9-10, we see that Christians will confess that Jesus is Lord. The context through verse 13 clearly shows that Jesus is the Lord which all men must call on in order to be saved. Paul quotes from Joel 2:32 to make his point.Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved (verse 13). If you read Joel 2:32 one can see that Paul quoted from this verse.

When we look at the OT passage salvation comes to those who call on the name of YHWH ie...the Divine name of Israel for God. Paul declares it is Jesus upon whom we must call on in order to be saved.

In Philippians 2:9-11, we read that Jesus has a name that is above every name that at His name every knee should bow and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord. Paul bases his statements on Isaiah 45:23, where we read (By myself I have sworn, my mouth has uttered in all integrity a word that will not be revoked: Before Me every knee will bow; by Me every tongue will swear .

In the context this is clearly YHWH speaking of Himself. He is the Lord who says there is no God apart from Me in verse 21.Paul does not hesitate in saying that every knee will bow to Jesus and every tongue will confess Jesus is YHWH( LORD).

It is an indisputable fact that Paul said God bestowed the Name “Yahweh” on Jesus because in Philippians 2: 9-11 he was quoting Isaiah 45: 21-24.

This is what Yahweh told Isaiah:
“And there is no other God besides Me, a righteous God and a Savior; there is none except Me. Turn to Me, and be saved, all the ends of the earth; for I am God, and there is no other. I have sworn by Myself, the Word has gone forth from My mouth in righteousness and will not turn back, that to Me every knee will bow, every tongue will swear allegiance, they will say of Me, ‘Only in Yahweh are righteousness and strength.’ Men will come to Him and all who were angry with Him shall be put to shame.”

Isaiah 43: 11- Yahweh said that He is our only Savior- Even I Am Yahweh and there is no other Savior besides Me. This verse is very clear as to its meaning.

We see that Yahweh is the Name God bestowed on Jesus and it is Yahweh which is the Name that is above every name and it is Yahweh to which every knee will bow. There is no mistaking that Paul declares in his epistles that Jesus is the Yahweh of the Hebrew Scriptures. Jesus is our Lord Yahweh in the New Testament as well as our Savior. These were the specific names that were Gods alone in the Old Testament.

hope this helps !!!
You are not reading the truth into Scripture and understanding who the Lord ( YHWH) is in the OT and NT.

Paul says in Romans 10 that if you confess Jesus is LORD and believe God raised Him from the dead you shall be saved. What does it mean to confess Jesus is Lord? Let’s examine just a couple of passages from Paul and John.


Isa 6:1-5
I saw the Lord sitting on a throne, lofty and exalted, with the train of His robe filling the temple. 2Seraphim stood above Him, each having six wings: with two he covered his face, and with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. And one called out to another and said,
"Holy, Holy, Holy, is the Lord of hosts,
The whole earth is full of His glory."
4And the foundations of the thresholds trembled at the voice of him who called out, while the temple was filling with smoke. 5Then I said,
"Woe is me, for I am ruined!
Because I am a man of unclean lips,
And I live among a people of unclean lips;
For my eyes have seen the King, the Lord of hosts."


John 12:41
These things Isaiah said because he saw His glory, and he spoke of Him.

We see that the Apostle John said that Isaiah saw the glory of Jesus in Isaiah 6 for this was the one and only time Isaiah was in the presence of Yahweh.

In Romans 10:9-10, we see that Christians will confess that Jesus is Lord. The context through verse 13 clearly shows that Jesus is the Lord which all men must call on in order to be saved. Paul quotes from Joel 2:32 to make his point.Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved (verse 13). If you read Joel 2:32 one can see that Paul quoted from this verse.

When we look at the OT passage salvation comes to those who call on the name of YHWH ie...the Divine name of Israel for God. Paul declares it is Jesus upon whom we must call on in order to be saved.

In Philippians 2:9-11, we read that Jesus has a name that is above every name that at His name every knee should bow and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord. Paul bases his statements on Isaiah 45:23, where we read (By myself I have sworn, my mouth has uttered in all integrity a word that will not be revoked: Before Me every knee will bow; by Me every tongue will swear .

In the context this is clearly YHWH speaking of Himself. He is the Lord who says there is no God apart from Me in verse 21.Paul does not hesitate in saying that every knee will bow to Jesus and every tongue will confess Jesus is YHWH( LORD).

It is an indisputable fact that Paul said God bestowed the Name “Yahweh” on Jesus because in Philippians 2: 9-11 he was quoting Isaiah 45: 21-24.

This is what Yahweh told Isaiah:
“And there is no other God besides Me, a righteous God and a Savior; there is none except Me. Turn to Me, and be saved, all the ends of the earth; for I am God, and there is no other. I have sworn by Myself, the Word has gone forth from My mouth in righteousness and will not turn back, that to Me every knee will bow, every tongue will swear allegiance, they will say of Me, ‘Only in Yahweh are righteousness and strength.’ Men will come to Him and all who were angry with Him shall be put to shame.”

Isaiah 43: 11- Yahweh said that He is our only Savior- Even I Am Yahweh and there is no other Savior besides Me. This verse is very clear as to its meaning.

We see that Yahweh is the Name God bestowed on Jesus and it is Yahweh which is the Name that is above every name and it is Yahweh to which every knee will bow. There is no mistaking that Paul declares in his epistles that Jesus is the Yahweh of the Hebrew Scriptures. Jesus is our Lord Yahweh in the New Testament as well as our Savior. These were the specific names that were Gods alone in the Old Testament.

hope this helps !!!

Maybe you're not understanding me, I hope that's the case.

Jesus Christ is God and every Christian should acknowledge that. If they don't, I'm wondering if they are truly saved, that is, after they have had time to study and understand the scripture.

My point is that one does NOT have to know that Jesus Christ is God to be adopted into the family of God. Nowhere in scripture will you find this as mandatory for initial salvation.

What one must know concerning Jesus Christ is that He is the Son of God and He came to be the sacrifice for our sins. That God raised Christ from the dead and He is alive as our Saviour. (in a nutshell)

It is not necessary for one to know that Christ is God for salvation. That will come later along with many other things essential to living the Christian life.

The scripture says that the Word became flesh and dwelt among us. This is not expected to be understood right away by the new convert.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pioneer3mm
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Jesus is YHWH

my Lord and my God !
Supporter
Dec 15, 2011
3,496
1,726
✟389,967.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Maybe you're not understanding me, I hope that's the case.

Jesus Christ is God and every Christian should acknowledge that. If they don't, I'm wondering if they are truly saved, that is, after they have had time to study and understand the scripture.

My point is that one does NOT have to know that Jesus Christ is God to be adopted into the family of God. Nowhere in scripture will you find this as mandatory for initial salvation.

What one must know concerning Jesus Christ is that He is the Son of God and He came to be the sacrifice for our sins. That God raised Christ from the dead and He is alive as our Saviour. (in a nutshell)

It is not necessary for one to know that Christ is God for salvation. That will come later along with many other things essential to living the Christian life.

The scripture says that the Word became flesh and dwelt among us. This is not expected to be understood right away by the new convert.
Are you aware that " the Son of God" is God and means having the nature of God ?

The same with the son of man- is human with a human nature ?
 
Upvote 0

Oseas

Well-Known Member
Jun 23, 2017
1,891
176
87
Joinville
✟111,860.00
Country
Brazil
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
More than half of American adults, including 30% of evangelicals, say Jesus isn’t God but most agree He was a great teacher, according to results from the 2020 State of Theology survey.

Even though the Bible and traditional teachings of the Christian Church hold that Jesus truly existed as both man and God, among the key findings of the biennial State of Theology survey from Ligonier Ministries conducted with LifeWay Research, is that 52% of American adults believe that Jesus was a great teacher and nothing more.More than half of US adults, 30% of evangelicals believe Jesus isn’t God: study
That would be 1/3 of professing christians on this forum.

ASTOUNDING !

ASTOUNDING? No, not astounding, do not you know? The number 30 is the number of the betrayers.

By the way,
the great red Dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads, he drew-dragged for him- the third part of the believers/Christians of the heavenly environment in Christ(Ephesians 1:v.3), and did cast them to the earth with his TAIL. Revelation 12:v.3-4

But there will be a battle against the Dragon; Revelation 12:v.7-12. Check it out. Get ready.
 
Upvote 0

Charlie24

Newbie
Oct 17, 2014
2,306
963
✟103,731.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Single
Are you aware that " the Son of God" is God and means having the nature of God ?

The same with the son of man- is human with a human nature ?

I know it and you know, but do you think the new convert who hears the Gospel and cries out "Jesus I'm sorry for my sins have mercy on me" understands it at that time.

Will God say, NO, not until you believe and understand that my Son is God?
 
Upvote 0

Jesus is YHWH

my Lord and my God !
Supporter
Dec 15, 2011
3,496
1,726
✟389,967.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
I know it and you know, but do you think the new convert who hears the Gospel and cries out "Jesus I'm sorry for my sins have mercy on me" understands it at that time.

Will God say, NO, not until you believe and understand that my Son is God?
So my question is how can a person place their faith in Jesus if they have no clue who He is ?

Jesus cannot be your savior without being your Lord.

How can you trust someone with your salvation when you do not know Him, who He really is ?

Thats the problem with America and the church in general is easy believism with no commitment, no understanding about who their faith is being placed in, He is LORD. That is not an option its who He is in Scripture.

Jesus turned many away from Him when it came to counting the cost of being His disciple. Being a disciple is the beginning of following Christ, not an option or something down the road.

The Great Commission is evidence below. There is a cost with being His disciple.

Matthew 28:19-20- Go into all the world and MAKE DISCIPLES baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit teaching them to OBEY all I have commanded.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Oseas

Well-Known Member
Jun 23, 2017
1,891
176
87
Joinville
✟111,860.00
Country
Brazil
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The people must be woken up, it's time screem loudly; it's midniiiiiiiight.!!!

The bridegroom comes; they that are ready will go in with Him to the marriage: and the door will be shut. Mat. 25:v.10 This prophecy will fulfil LITERALLY from now on. The Spirit of Christ is the Spirit of prophecy.

Our LORD was sat upon the mount of Olives, and the disciples came unto him privately, saying; Tell us:
what shall be the SIGN of thy coming? and of the END of the world? Mat. 24:v. 3. JESUS answered, saying: many shall be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another; many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many; and because INIQUITY shall abound (the mystery of iniquity doth already work: , only he who now letteth will let, until He be taken out of the way-2Thes.2:v.7), the love of MANY shall wax cold; but he that shall endure unto the END, the same shall be saved. Mat.24:v.10-13

Luke 13:v.25 - JESUS warned: When once the Master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door
(he who now letteth will be taken out of the way), and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are:

So, let us be ready to go in with Him to the marriage: the door will be shut very soon as the door of the Ark of Noah and many will be at the side out, and will lose their soul.

In Christ JESUS
Oseas (Hosea)
 
Upvote 0