20 major reasons to reject the Premillennial doctrine

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Timtofly

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You have no discernment. Being dead unto sins doesn't mean we're literally dead in any way. Only unbelievers are dead in their sins, not believers (Eph 2:1-6). To be dead unto sin (not to be confused with being dead in sins) simply means that our sins are not counted against us and we are instead saved and "alive unto God through Jesus Christ".
How dead in sin does one have to be, to be literally dead?

You cannot be alive in Christ from the time you were inside your mother's womb. Therefore if you were never dead, you have no need to ever be alive in Christ.

You cannot claim to be alive in Christ, until after being dead in sin. This body is the result of being dead in sin. Did your body change when you became alive in Christ? Did you recieve a new body at that moment?
 
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sovereigngrace

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How dead in sin does one have to be, to be literally dead?

You cannot be alive in Christ from the time you were inside your mother's womb. Therefore if you were never dead, you have no need to ever be alive in Christ.

You cannot claim to be alive in Christ, until after being dead in sin. This body is the result of being dead in sin. Did your body change when you became alive in Christ? Did you recieve a new body at that moment?

We are talking about spiritual death.

The Psalmist outlines man’s grim state: “Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me” (Psalm 51:5).

The Bible says, we are all by nature the children of wrath (Ephesians 2:3). We are rebels against God and His plan and purpose for our lives.

The first death that man experienced in the garden after Adam ate of the fruit and consequently sinned was spiritual death. God said to Adam, in Genesis 2:17, “of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.”

Whilst we know from Scripture that Adam ate of that forbidden fruit, we equally know that he didn't physically die on that same day. This warning wasn’t therefore just talking about bodily death. In fact, Genesis 5:5 tells us, “And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died.” It couldn’t also have been his soul that would die otherwise life would immediately become extinct. The soulish man lived on. This must have been referring to a spiritual death which would separate man from that perfect communion he enjoyed with God. If spiritual death was the first death man experienced, the next death that he experienced, which was a direct result of the first, was physical death. The fall left mankind in a hopeless ruined state facing a certain two-fold death. Left to his own devices, man was destined for “the Lake of Fire” and eternal spiritual and physical death.

Every man since Adam is born with original sin and therefore completely guilty before a righteous God. The Bible says, “Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned (Romans 5:12).

When Adam fell his desires automatically changed from being God-ward to being self-ward. Natural man with Adam’s blood is born with that same corrupt aspiration. He is a rebel. In this, he will always go the way of sin. That is his natural inclination. This had to be corrected. That is why Christ (the second Adam) came. In salvation, Christ restores that desire for God and the things of God.

Since Adam, and because of original sin, our soulish man is alive, but our spiritual man is dead. separation from God is defined in Scripture as death, blindness, and deafness.

Man – in all generations – inherited Adam’s awful sinful nature, which ultimately separates man from a holy God. The first resurrection therefore that man needed was a spiritual resurrection to expiate the awful spiritual death sentence that he inherits. The second resurrection he required was a physical resurrection to (redeem or) replace the corruptible physical tabernacle that he inhabited.
 
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rockytopva

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I do not believe Revelation and end time prophecies are written where no two can read into and come up with the same conclusions, therefore the Lord says…

Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame. - Revelation 16:15

In which case, if this event were anything but pre-trib, there would be no reason to say such a thing. So… I look for the Lord to come any day, but within my heart believe such an event as decades off.
 
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sovereigngrace

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I do not believe Revelation and end time prophecies are written where no two can read into and come up with the same conclusions, therefore the Lord says…

Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame. - Revelation 16:15

In which case, if this event were anything but pre-trib, there would be no reason to say such a thing. So… I look for the Lord to come any day, but within my heart believe such an event as decades off.

Personal opinion means nothing: where is your biblical evidence that teaches a rapture of the Church, followed by a 7-year tribulation, followed by 3rd coming?
 
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ShineyDays2

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Its because you straight away assume Israel and the Body of Christ is equivalent, that is why point f is a problem for you.

To repeat (f) which you did not answer directly...
f) If you do not have guarantees of healings since you say that it is Israel/the Jews that have healings, are you not literally saying that you would recommend to sinning persons that they dismember all the parts of their bodies that may be causing them to sin when it has been shown to you that Jesus did not mean to actually do it??
Perhaps additional verses may help you see that scripture does not support your dispensational literal position.
  • Col 2:18 - Let no one disqualify you, insisting on self-abasement and...puffed up without reason by his sensuous mind,
  • Rom 7:23 - "...but I see in my members another law at war with the law of my mind and making me captive to the law of sin which dwells in my members.
  • Rom 8:6&7 - To set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace. For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God's law, indeed it cannot;
  • Eph 2:3 - Among these we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, following the desires of body and mind, and so we were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind.
  • Col 1:21 - And you, who once were estranged and hostile in mind, doing evil deeds,
  • 1Co 15:34 - Come to your right mind, and sin no more. For some have no knowledge of God. I say this to your shame.
  • Rev 2:23 - "...And all the churches shall know that I am he who searches mind and heart, and I will give to each of you as your works deserve.
Tragically, some have taken those words of Jesus in Mark 9 above in a sense He did not intend. Jesus never wanted to have people cut off their hands or mutilate themselves in some other way in a mistaken battle against sin as you seem to insist we take these verses.

The problem with taking Jesus’ words literally here is that bodily mutilation does not go far enough in controlling sin. Sin is more a matter of the heart and mind as you can see in the verses above than of any particular limb or organ. As I said before, if I cut off my right hand, my left is still ready to sin. If I completely dismember my body, I can still sin in my mind and in my heart and that is the real message behind the words of Jesus in Mark.
 
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Guojing

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Jesus never wanted to have people cut off their hands or mutilate themselves in some other way in a mistaken battle against sin as you seem to insist we take these verses.

The problem with taking Jesus’ words literally here is that bodily mutilation does not go far enough in controlling sin. Sin is more a matter of the heart and mind as you can see in the verses above than of any particular limb or organ. As I said before, if I cut off my right hand, my left is still ready to sin. If I completely dismember my body, I can still sin in my mind and in my heart and that is the real message behind the words of Jesus in Mark.

So did Jesus forget to add the words "Oh I was actually joking there, please don't take me literally, but rather symbolically"?
 
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ShineyDays2

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So did Jesus forget to add the words "Oh I was actually joking there, please don't take me literally, but rather symbolically"?
GET REAL!
I'm not going to waste my time anymore on someone who can't understand simple common sense.

You speak with forked tongue. You ramble on and on about taking these verses literally but I would like to have you send me a picture of your mutilated body showing that you practice what you preach!
 
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Guojing

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GET REAL!
I'm not going to waste my time anymore on someone who can't understand simple common sense.

Its a simple point actually, if Jesus did not mean what he said, why don't he just say what he meant?
 
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ShineyDays2

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Its a simple point actually, if Jesus did not mean what he said, why don't he just say what he meant?
You speak with forked tongue. You ramble on and on about taking these verses literally but I would like to have you send me a picture of your mutilated body showing that you practice what you preach!
 
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jeffweedaman

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So did Jesus forget to add the words "Oh I was actually joking there, please don't take me literally, but rather symbolically"?

I am glad that the Apostle Paul didnt take that scripture literally. He would have chopped himself to pieces long before his first missionary journey ended.


Rom 7
14 For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am fleshly, sold into bondage to sin. 15 For I do not understand what I am doing; for I am not practicing what I want to do, but I do the very thing I hate. 16 However, if I do the very thing I do not want to do, I agree with the Law, that the Law is good. 17 But now, no longer am I the one doing it, but sin that dwells in me. 18 For I know that good does not dwell in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not. 19 For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want. 20 But if I do the very thing I do not want, I am no longer the one doing it, but sin that dwells in me.

21 I find then the principle that evil is present in me, the one who wants to do good. 22 For I joyfully agree with the law of God in the inner person, 23 but I see a different law in the parts of my body waging war against the law of my mind, and making me a prisoner of the law of sin, the law which is in my body’s parts. 24 Wretched man that I am! Who will set me free from the body of this death? 25 Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord!
 
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Guojing

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You speak with forked tongue. You ramble on and on about taking these verses literally but I would like to have you send me a picture of your mutilated body showing that you practice what you preach!

I already stated Matthew 15:24.
 
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Guojing

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I am glad that the Apostle Paul didnt take that scripture literally. He would have bee chopped to pieces long before his first missionary journey ended.


Rom 7
14 For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am fleshly, sold into bondage to sin. 15 For I do not understand what I am doing; for I am not practicing what I want to do, but I do the very thing I hate. 16 However, if I do the very thing I do not want to do, I agree with the Law, that the Law is good. 17 But now, no longer am I the one doing it, but sin that dwells in me. 18 For I know that good does not dwell in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not. 19 For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want. 20 But if I do the very thing I do not want, I am no longer the one doing it, but sin that dwells in me.

21 I find then the principle that evil is present in me, the one who wants to do good. 22 For I joyfully agree with the law of God in the inner person, 23 but I see a different law in the parts of my body waging war against the law of my mind, and making me a prisoner of the law of sin, the law which is in my body’s parts. 24 Wretched man that I am! Who will set me free from the body of this death? 25 Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord!

Paul stated Romans 15:8, regarding who Jesus was addressing in that passage.

In case you are still unclear, he also stated 2 Corinthians 5:16 to tell us that we no longer know Christ after the flesh.
 
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Guojing

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Guojing

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NOPE! Not going to patronize you any longer! Send me those LITERAL photo's of your mutilated body! Until then don't waste my time any longer.

In bible discussions, learn to just "agree to disagree".

All these are non-salvific issues, as long as you are putting your faith in the gospel that Paul preached to us in the Body of Christ in 1 Cor 15:1-4, we will see each other in heaven.
 
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ShineyDays2

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Its a simple point actually, if Jesus did not mean what he said, why don't he just say what he meant?
All these are non-salvific issues, as long as you are putting your faith in the gospel that Paul preached to us in the Body of Christ in 1 Cor 15:1-4, we will see each other in heaven.
Are you questioning God because He did not speak the way you wanted Him to speak??? I don't think He is going to like that one bit.

End of discussion ---I'll wait for those pictures!
 
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Guojing

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Are you questioning God because He did not speak the way you wanted Him to speak??? I don't think He is going to like that one bit.

End of discussion ---I'll wait for those pictures!

No, I am respecting that Jesus meant he said and said what he meant, but he was only speaking to the nation of Israel during his first coming, as Matthew 15:24 clearly stated.
 
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