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1st John Who Was It Written Too.

Discussion in 'Non-denominational' started by jtc, Jan 31, 2002.

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  1. jtc

    jtc New Member

    33
    +0
    EVERY ONE HAS QUESTIONS ON WHO 1ST JOHN WAS WRITTEN TO. HE IS GOING BACK AND FOURTH. THAT IS WHY HE WILL START OUT SAYING I AM WRITING TO YOU LITTLE CHILDREN AND I AM WRITING TO YOU YOUNG MEN. IN VERSE 1:3 HE SAYS I AM WRITING SO THAT YOU MAY ALSO HAVE FELLOWSHIP WITH US. AND IN 2:2 IT SAYS IF ANYMAN SINS IT DOES NOT SAY IF YOU SIN OR IF ANY SAINT SINS. READ THE ENDOF CHAPTER 5 HE REITERATES THIS POINT. HE SAYS IF ANY MAN SEES HIS BROTHER SIN A SIN NOT UNTO DEATH.---- WE KNOW WHOSOEVER IS BORN OF GOD DOES NOT COMMIT SIN. YOU SEE HE SAYS IF ANY MAN, LIKE HE DID IN CHAPTER 2. HE DID NOT SAY IF ANY SAINT OR CHRISTAIN OR BROTHER IN CHRIST. HE SAID IF ANY MAN. LOOK AT THE REST OF THE BOOKS IN THE NEW TESTAMENT FROM ROMANS TO 2ND PETER AND EVEN 2ND AND 3RD JOHN. THEY ALL START OUT BY SAYING THEY ARE TO SAINTS AND THE ELECT. IF YOU WERE TO SAY ALL OF 1ST JOHN WAS WRITTEN TO BELIEVERS THE BIBLE WOULD CONTRADICT ITSELF AND BE INVALID. IT SAYS IF WE WALK IN DARKNESS(SIN) WE LIE IF WE SAY WE HAVE FELLOWSHIP WITH HIM.AND IF WE DONT KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS WE LIE IF WE SAY WE KOW HIM. AND WHOSOEVER ABIDETH IN HIM SINNETH NO ,WHOSOEVER SINNETH HAS NOT SEEN HIM OR KNOWN HIM. THE REASON HE SAID IF ANYMAN SINS IS BECAUSE JESUS DIED FOR THE WHOLE HUMAN RACE. YOU KNOW HOW THE JEWS WERE. THEY STUCK TO THEMSELVES AND THEY DID NOT ASSOCIATE WITH THE GENTILES. THAT IS WHY JESUS STRESSED ON LOVING ONE ANOTHER AND TO JUDGE NOT ACCORDING TO APPEARANCE BUT JUDGE RIGHTEOUS JUDGEMENT. THE LORD HAD TO REVEAL THIS TO PETER IN A DREAM IN ACTS CHAPTER 8 OR 9 I BELIEVE. JOHN BASICLY GAVE THE FIRST STEPS OF SALVATION IN 1:8-10. IF ANYONE SAYS THAT HE HAS NO SIN HE IS A LIAR. VERSE 9 IF WE CONFESS OUR SINS HE IS WILL FORGIVE US OUR SINS AND CLEANSE US FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS. IF YOU ARE CLEANSED FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUNESS YOU WONT SIN ANYMORE BECAUSE THE LORD PROMISES TO CLEANSE US AND JESUS SAID HE WOULD MAKE YOU FREE JOHN8:27-36. YOU ARE NOT CLEANSED FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS AND JESUS HAS NOT MADE YOU FREE IF YOU ARE STILL IN BONDAGE TO THE DEVIL. LATER ON IN CHAPTER 5 HE GIVES THE OTHER PARTS OF SALVATION WHEN HE TALKS ABOUT THE BLOOD THE WATER AND THE SPIRIT AGREEING ON EARTH. IF EVERYONE IS SO CONVINCED THAT ONCE YOUR SAVED YOU STILL SIN PLEASE SHOW ME A VERSE THAT CAN CLEARLY WITHOUT A DOUBT LIKE THE VERSES IN1ST JOHN 3:5-9 AND ALL OF THE OTHER VERSES THAT I HAVE POINTED OUT IN THE PAST LITTLE EXCERPTS I HAVE WRITTEN. AND I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHAT YOUR DEFINITION OF SIN IS. SIN SEPERATES YOU FROM GOD. SIN IS THE BREAKING OF THE TEN COMMANDMENT. 1ST JOHN 3:4,JAMES 2:10-- , ROMANS 2:18--, ROMANS 13:8--,MARK 10:17--AND I DONT KNOW THE EXACT VERSE ITHINK IT IS SOMWHERE IN THE MIDDLE OF ROMANS 7 WHEN PAUL SAYS I WOULD NOT HAVE KNOWN SIN AND LUST EXCEPT THE LAW SAID THOU SHALL NOT COVET OR SOMETHING CLOSE TO THAT NATURE. LOOK FORWARD TO HEARING YOUR COMMENTS.
     
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  2. ZiSunka

    ZiSunka It means 'yellow dog'

    +276
    Christian
    >>WE KNOW WHOSOEVER IS BORN OF GOD DOES NOT COMMIT SIN.

    In King James's time, the English language had some words that had different meanings than the same words do now. This part would be best rendered as "Whoever is born of God doesn't persistently embrace sin." Meaning that a person who loves to sin isn't born of God.

    Like, I know a man who goes through the motions of being a believer. He goes to church several times a week, talks about God incessantly, and has multitudes of Christian artwork in every room of his house. He also is "married" to another man, they are practicing homosexuals. When I have talked to him about the strange dichotomy, he says that he just doesn't read the parts of the Bible that condemn sin, especially homosexuality, so it doesn't bother him. The fact that his sin doesn't bother him, and that he continues to embrace it shows that he is not born of God, the Spirit isn't in him, or he would feel guilty and want to get away from the sin.

    This passage doesn't mean that anyone who ever commits any sin is tossed out of the kingdom of God. Read Romans 5 for a good explanation of why.

    Romans 5:20 God's law was given so that all people could see how sinful they were. But as people sinned more and more, God's wonderful kindness became more abundant.

    Romans 5:16 And the result of God's gracious gift is very different from the result of that one man's sin. For Adam's sin led to condemnation, but we have the free gift of being accepted by God, even though we ARE guilty of many sins. (not WERE guilty--meaning that we sinned only before we were saved)

    Romans 5:21 So just as sin ruled over all people and brought them to death, now God's wonderful kindness RULES instead, giving us right standing with God and resulting in eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. (present tense again)

    Romans 6:6 Our old sinful selves were crucified with Christ so that sin might lose its power in our lives. We are no longer slaves to sin. 7 For when we died with Christ we were set free from the power of sin. 11 So you should consider yourselves dead to sin and able to live for the glory of God through Christ Jesus. 12 Do not let sin control the way you live; F21 do not give in to its lustful desires. 13 Do not let any part of your body become a tool of wickedness, to be used for sinning. (present tense again--speaking to the believers of Rome, right? Meaning that we chose to sin or not to sin--our love of sin was crucified with Christ, but our freewill continues to let us be tempted by sin. We have to make the choice to stay away from sin.

    James 1:14 Temptation comes from the lure of our own evil desires. 15 These evil desires lead to evil actions, and evil actions lead to death. (He's writing to believers--telling them to refrain from committing sin, present tense.)

    James 4:1 What is causing the quarrels and fights among you? Isn't it the whole army of evil desires at war within you? (present tense to believers again)

    "My dear children, I am writing this to you so that you will not sin. But if you do sin, there is someone to plead for you before the Father. He is Jesus Christ, the one who pleases God completely."
    I John 2:1

    Galatians 2:16 And yet we know that we become right with God, not by doing what the law commands, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be accepted by God because of our faith in Christ – and not because we have obeyed the law. For no one will ever be saved by obeying the law." 17 But what if we seek to be made right with God through faith in Christ and then find out that we are still sinners? Has Christ led us into sin? Of course not! (Does not sinning make you a saint? No! Faith in God and His Son Jesus Christ makes you a saint!)

    So, nearly the whole Bible refutes what you have said jtc. We continue to have freewill to obey or disobey, and because disobedience sometimes is more attractive than obedience, we sin, even though we love God and know it is wrong. But when we sin, we know we have an Advocate with God
     
  3. SenseiPiccolo

    SenseiPiccolo Well-Known Member

    +0
    PEOPLE PLEASE!!!

    Remeber to press enter sometimes!!
    to insert some paragraph breaks!!
    please?

    He's writting to everyone!!
    ^_^
     
  4. filosofer

    filosofer Senior Veteran

    +287
    Lutheran
    And don't type in all caps, except for an occasional emphatic point.
     
  5. SenseiPiccolo

    SenseiPiccolo Well-Known Member

    +0
    ummmm....
    they already mentioned not to type in caps i believe...
    ^_^
     
  6. jtc

    jtc New Member

    33
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    1ST JOHN 2:2 DOES NOT SAY IF YOU SIN OR IF WE SIN OR IF ONE OF US SINS. IT SAYS IF ANY MAN SINS. IF ONCE YOUR SAVED YOU STILL OCCASIONALLY SIN IT MEANS YOUR A LIAR 1ST JOHN 1:6, 2:4,YOU HAVE NEVER KNOWN OR SEEN JESUS 1ST JOHN 3:6 AND YOU ARE OF THE DEVIL 1ST JOHN 3:8 AND YOU ARE NOT A CHILD OF GOD 1ST JOHN 3;10 AND YOU ARE LUKE WARM IF YOU ARE SOMETIMES GOOD AND SOMETIMES BAD. JESUS SAID HE WILL SPIT THOSE PEOPLE OUT OF HIS MOUTH.REVELATION 3:16. YOU HAVE TO HAVE YOUR SINS REMITTED IF WANT TO STOP SINNING AND THE ONLY WAY TO HAVE THAT DONE IS BY AN APOSTLE CALLED BY GOD.
     
  7. Ben johnson

    Ben johnson Legend Supporter

    +374
    Christian
    John absolutely supports the premise that
    salvation is "fellowship with/in/through Jesus". Jesus said, "Unless you are born again you will not inherit the kingdom of God". As Lamb's Love eloquently positted, the "born again" thing is excellently detailed in Rom6. Where the "old self" dies, and we are a new creation, the old self "buried with Him in death, and as He was raised from the dead, so too shall we walk in newness of life".

    Fellowship with Jesus, is abiding in Him. Paul says in Rom7 that the old nature, though dead, is very much still present, and sometimes seems to be alive again, causing a war between the old and the new natures. The solution to this war is explained in chapter 8. "There is now therefore no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus---for what the law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did, sending His own Son ...as an offering for sin." It then goes on to discuss the difference between "walking in the Spirit" (so that the old nature is dead, and we do not sin), vs "walking in the flesh" (so that the old nature lives and we sin).

    The difference between "saved" and "lost", is the fellowship. Which means, "saved" do not PRACTICWE sinning. Now, in 1Jn, we see perfect harmony of this concept. Chapter 3 says "No one born of God sins, indeed he CANNOT sin". This seems to be a contradiction of chapter 1, which says: "If I say I have no sin, I am a liar and the truth is not in me." But contextually, it is only saying that we, as Christians, do not practice sin. Repentence is the hallmark of a true Christian. As a continual attitude.

    When a Christian sins, obviously his (her) focus is off of God, and he/she is not abiding in Him. Is he or she unsaved? It depends on whether he/she repents and returns to abide in Him. 1Jn1:9 is very clear that if we repent, His forgiveness is complete.

    What if we do NOT repent? Can we fall from salvation? YES, according to 2Jn1:8-9. (Read this with 1Jn5:12) If we "go too far" ("go on ahead" in some translations). THIS ALSO supports the premise of "salvation being ABIDING IN HIM (and He in us)".

    In context, there is no contradiction, but perfect harmony. Almost as if it had been words inspired by God...

    ;)
     
  8. Debbie

    Debbie Active Member

    504
    +0
    JOhn wrote this epistle to believers of Asia MInor, who needed direction & were facing new challenges to their faith. People opposing Christianity had infilttrated their churches with false doctrine.
    The book is divided into 4 sections, 1st warning believers on their indifference to sin(1:1- 2:11). Next admonishing love of this world as opposed to things of Christ.(2:12-28). Then the importance of pure & righteous love relating especially to one another brother in Christ(2:29-3:22). Finally revealing that true faith in Christ aas the Son of God is the foundation on which all Christianity is based. (3:23-5:21).
     
  9. jtc

    jtc New Member

    33
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    how many times do i have to murder someone before i am a practicer. It does not mean you dont practice it. Jesus said a good tree cannot bear bad fruit. He said a spring of water cant bring fourth fresh and salt water. If you commit sin you are a servent of sin.john 8:34. If you still sin you have not repented. If you still sin you are not in christ. The reason you cant sin is because you have God living in you. If you dont want to sin you will not do it if the son has set you free. All I can say is read mathew 7-21-- and luke13:26. Read hebrews 10:26. If you decide you want to commit a sin after you are saved you are done for forever. Jesus said he is coming back for his bride. there are over 2500 different religions that claim to be that one. If you are Lukewarm in your walk with God"sometimes good sometimes bad" Jesus said he would spit you out. The name of God is blasphemed because of all of these fakes. You are know different from any one else in the world if you still sin. It doesnt matter if you believe or not because Jesus is still the Christ know matter what you believe. Like james said in chapt 2:19 . even the devil believes. People possed with deamon spirits confessed that jesus was the christ. Jesus said the way you prove you love him is by keeping his commandment and his teachings.john 14,15. God commandeth all men everywhere to repent.acts 17:30. if you repented of your sins you wont do them anymore.
     
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