“Journey Epistemology”: Pro or Con within Christian Apologetics?

FireDragon76

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one that expects only to have to follow a Philosophy of Exploration rather than one requiring certain assumptions and expectations about various transcendent propositions which can never fully be captured by logic in the human mind. Such a way of thinking has been proposed, even if in various ways and articulations, by the likes of Pascal, Kierkegaard, Langdon Gilkey, Sarah Coakley, or Rolfe King, among other Christian theologians and philosophers.

Isn't this exactly what the Nicene Creed is about, or the statement of faith of most churches?

I am intrigued by the idea of a Christianity without metaphysical beliefs, however... I don't see that in any local churches, except maybe for the Quakers.

What Pros and Cons come about in your own thoughts about Christianity as a form of exploraton of life? How does an approach to Christian faith involving what King calls a “Journey Epistemology” compare or contrast with how you have thus far understood the nature and purposes of, and ways of reasoning about, the Christian Life?

It sounds like a step in the right direction.
 
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2PhiloVoid

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Isn't this exactly what the Nicene Creed is about, or the statement of faith of most churches?
I suppose it is. But while I don't think anyone necessarily has to concede to the Nicene Creed in order to be a Christian, I can understand the choice made here at CF for implementing it as an articulated standard by which to recognize more easily who "qualifies" as a Christian for the purposes for which this Forum site is designed. [And I'm going to stop right there with this particular train of thought, because I absolutely do not want this thread to devolve and become derailed by a conversation about the role which the Nicene Creed plays here on this website ... ]

But on the larger scale of life as we live and breath and contemplate our spiritual existence, whatever that may fully be in Christ, I think we need to be able to go beyond the Creeds themselves. Part of my saying this comes from my having been involved with the "Campbellite" Christian Church off and on and due to their mantra, "No creed but Christ, no book but the Bible, no law but love, no name but the divine."

Another, more significant part of my saying this, and the locus of what drives me in implying that a Journey Epistemology is more adequate as an cognitive mode by which to contemplate faith, comes from my being ensconced firmly in Philosophy, specifically Christian Philosophy, a field which, as you know, can't help but to ask questions that go "beyond" the Creeds and Traditions.

I am intrigued by the idea of a Christianity without metaphysical beliefs, however... I don't see that in any local churches, except maybe for the Quakers.
A metaphysical-less form of Christianity? That could be interesting, but you might need to frame for me first how it would benefit any of us to extricate Trinitarian (even Pauline) theology from what seems to be a set of testimonies and early second-hand accounts from the New Testament metaphysicalists regarding a "Risen Christ," such as what even Paul says he experienced (along with all of those handkerchief healings, exorcisms and whatnot which he is claimed to have also experienced). ;)

Then, if you want to talk about Christian Atheism or some "Buddha-fied" form of spiritual synthesis of Christianity that goes well beyond Langdon Gilkey and into the Land of either Siddhartha Guatama or the likes of, say, Thomas J.J. Altizer, all as a form of Exploration, then we can do so.

It sounds like a step in the right direction.
^_^ Well, it's always good to know one may be heading in the right direction before taking too many steps on a long journey. Of course, some people just like to make that Million Acre Hike anyway, here and there, don't they?
 
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FireDragon76

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Altizer, a "death of God" theologian. Yes, that is the perspective I might take. I could not describe myself as conventionally monotheistic. Not in a world where kids die from cancer. There is no transcendent superhero God out there.
 
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2PhiloVoid

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Altizer, a "death of God" theologian. Yes, that is the perspective I might take. I could not describe myself as conventionally monotheistic. Not in a world where kids die from cancer. There is no transcendent superhero God out there.

Well, that was a quick journey. But, I don't think I said you can use a Star Trek transporter in this discussion. :rolleyes:

So, let me get this straight. You're ditching Christianity because you think there's a discrepancy between kids being thrown to lions and other wild animals in an arena because those kids were Christian and the fact that God let's all of this kind of thing happen? Is that what you're saying?
 
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public hermit

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Is the Christian life a kind of quest, one that takes us to a destination of certain knowledge at some distinct point in this life, or is it instead meant to be an ongoing but always incomplete experience of the journey itself as we find ourselves--each day we live--traveling to the destination which God will make available to us, a destination still lying outside of what can be fully known by any one of us?

Is it a Quest for Certainty ... or an Odyssey of Exploration?



A FURTHER INQUIRY
:

In so many ways today, it seems to me that people are refusing to ponder or accept the Gospel of Christ because they view Christianity as a means by which to reach a fantastically definitive spiritual goal in this life. They often tend to view it as an objectively achieved state of being, a blessed life, one that should materialize in such a way so as to enable us to exuberantly and permanently enjoy life in the here-and-now: with health, wealth, knowledge and happiness at our beck and call.

But what if Christianity, as far as it concerns us within the recesses and folds of our mortally short lives, does not send us on a narrow path for the sake of achieving a clearly discernable goal meant for this life-time? What if the Christian life isn't really-- however heroic it may seem—similar to the climax of The Lord of the Rings stories where victory is gained with empirical certainty over evil forces? Might this alter how we view the essence of Christianity in what it is supposed “to do” for us and what it could do “to us” within our hearts and minds as we each make our way to that last day which we'll all have to eventually face...?

Perhaps if any of us is to successfully engage our own individual Christian life via a set of Christian beliefs offered by the Church that Christ mysteriously brought fourth into the historical matrix of our shared world, we need to adopt a more fitting view of the purpose of the Christian life, one that expects only to have to follow a Philosophy of Exploration rather than one requiring certain assumptions and expectations about various transcendent propositions which can never fully be captured by logic in the human mind. Such a way of thinking has been proposed, even if in various ways and articulations, by the likes of Pascal, Kierkegaard, Langdon Gilkey, Sarah Coakley, or Rolfe King, among other Christian theologians and philosophers.

What Pros and Cons come about in your own thoughts about Christianity as a form of exploraton of life? How does an approach to Christian faith involving what King calls a “Journey Epistemology” compare or contrast with how you have thus far understood the nature and purposes of, and ways of reasoning about, the Christian Life?

:cool:

That is a beautiful song, and a beautifully written post. I'll go with a journey of exploration anchored in faith, hope, and love. Certainty is a modern infatuation that has, personally, left me cold. It took me a good while to give up my own lust for certainty, but it has made all the difference. God is so good, especially in ways we might least expect it.

I can't get over the beauty of that song. I have never heard of him, so I shall explore. Thank you for your persistence in trying to offer something good and beneficial to those who seek. Myself, included.
 
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2PhiloVoid

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That is a beautiful song, and a beautifully written post. I'll go with a journey of exploration anchored in faith, hope, and love. Certainty is a modern infatuation that has, personally, left me cold. It took me a good while to give up my own lust for certainty, but it has made all the difference. God is so good, especially in ways we might least expect it.

I can't get over the beauty of that song. I have never heard of him, so I shall explore. Thank you for your persistence in trying to offer something good and beneficial to those who seek. Myself, included.

I'm glad to hear that you've found something in this thread that is of benefit. Likewise, I've definitely felt reaffirmed in fellowship by your own presence and writing here on CF. I thank you for all you've done so far, and I appreciate the PH BALANCE which you provide! ;)

Have a HAPPY NEW YEAR, Bro!
 
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