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Your first step is to research the origins of Satan from the Hebrew Bible. For example, there is a difference between "the satan" (ha-satan) who appears in the Tanakh (Hebrew Bible) who works for God (Yahweh) and "satan" which is simply a Hebrew term for "adversary." This general Hebrew term is...

Do I beat the dead horse or do I leave the dead horse in peace?

Pick a verse any verse!

Shall I join, old friend?

You most likely find the tale strange because it’s taken from other sources and is not original to the author/s who wrote the Torah. You have the tale of Enmerkar and the Lord of Aratta (Sumerian myth). This is the foundation of the Genesis tale. It was written during the time of the...

It’s a huge subject. I don’t know if this subject would benefit this specific thread. For example, Operation Paperclip was an OSS program to bring over Nazis to the United States. This included intelligence officers. These intelligence officers were later associated with the OSS’s successor, the...

Genesis 4:1 The Hebrew word ‘know’ (yada) can have a wide range of meanings depending upon the context. Also, the concept of ‘knowing’ something or someone takes on a special meaning in the semitic languages. This special meaning has to do with relationships (primarily a relationship that is...

Maybe DrumZ is an Andy Kaufman type of entertainer. Wait, people think Kaufman staged his death, thus, DrumZ is really Andy Kaufman here to show off his brilliant long troll style prank.

LLoJ, this is the problem with most Christian apologist when it comes to the Hebrew. They think using Strong’s Lexicon makes them proficient on biblical Hebrew. It doesn’t work this way. The root verb נזה (NUN-ZAyin-HEH) can take on any of the meanings (to) shake, (to) drip and (to) sprinkle...

LLoJ, this fits flawlessly with the new path I wanted to take. Let’s assume Isaiah 52 – Isaiah 53 is talking about the Messiah, how do you think Jesus fits? Are you able to go verse by verse and show how Jesus fits?

I see that you agreed with me on the translation, ‘astonished, startled…’ RPK? HAHA! It might catch on, eh? If you want to talk about Jesus ‘fulfilling’ everything in the Hebrew Bible then start a thread. We can do it again. If Jesus started something new without the Hebrew Bible, then we would...

I agreed the case is closed between us. My status as an agnostic has nothing to do with this thread or the discussion about Isaiah 53. I never said Isaiah 53 is the best argument against Christianity. Again, you make a false claim against me. This is ridiculous. I agreed that the case is...

I can respect that question. I have an open-mind because if the evidence did not support my view then I will reevaluate my view and change it accordingly. Yet, if the evidence supports my view, then why do I need to change it?

I will tackle your last paragraph first. If Christianity wants to claim that Jesus was the Messiah then they must support their claims from the Hebrew Bible. This is the actual conflict. If you follow Judaism you simply cannot sacrifice wherever you feel like it. Sacrifices are only allowable in...

I agree but, stop playing the open-mind card, it's silly.

Yup; The Mishnah Torah, ‘If he did not succeed to this extent of he was killed, then we know that he is certainly not the one promised by the Torah..’ Have you researched the Mishnah Torah and the letter to Yemen?

Yes, I know, I was being mostly sarcastic. In the end I realized I should have followed my instincts. I was hesitant on moving forward and I should have ended the discussion. I provided my reasons in post #192. Oh well.

Let me ask you this. Does the letter to Yemen talk about Jesus and if so, what does it say about Jesus? If you want to know his thoughts on the Jewish Messiah you should read the Mishnah Torah but, maybe you do not because his thoughts on the Jewish Messiah invalidate Jesus. I quoted the...

I think when you dig deeper the letter to Yemen actually does the opposite, it doesn’t support Isaiah 53 is about the Jewish Messiah. First, why was the letter written? The second part of the letter was written because a man had appeared in Yemen who people claimed was the Messiah and the Rambam...

RPK, eh? I like it! :oldthumbsup: I am a bit hesitant on moving forward because of the way you handled our Rambam (Maimonides) discussion. 1. You use Rambam (Maimonides) to support your claim that Isaiah 53 is about the Jewish Messiah. I used Rambam’s more authoritative source, the Mishneh...