Is Satan acting as 'Director' of Christianity Today ?

Status
Not open for further replies.

goodnewsinc

Senior Member
Supporter
Feb 18, 2002
1,589
97
80
Phoenix, AZ
Visit site
✟72,703.00
Faith
Christian
One day with God is 1000 earthly years and we KNOW the law is spiritual. The Sabbath Day commanded by Moses in the law was just an "allegory" pointing to that HUGE (1000-earthly years) DAY! Jesus did not change the law! "He MAGNIFIED IT and made it honorable".

Psa 40:7-8
(7) Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book it is written of me, (8) I delight to do thy will, O my God: yea, thy law is within my heart.

Mat 5:17
(17) Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Isa 42:21
(21) The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake; he will magnify the law, and make it honourable.

Jesus gave us a closer view of what is in the law and what is not in the law. Therefore he "worked" on the earthly 7-day weekly Sabbath Day, the allegory showing us the TRUE SABBATH of the spiritual law is a HUGE DAY yet to come!

John,
GOOD NEWS, Inc. :priest: :clap: :kiss:
 
Upvote 0

Silver Surfer

Active Member
Jul 5, 2003
224
2
71
Hayden, Idaho, USA
Visit site
✟7,869.00
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Single
tulc said:
prince didymus wrote: (#31)
"What are you trying to say here? That those Christians who worship on Sunday will incur the punishment of eternal death/damnation?"

Silver Surfer:
I'm sorry did you answer this question?
tulc
I think I did...but I respond to so many other forums....I'm not sure.

But I'll answer this here and now.

Remember that Jesus said; "But in vain....do they worship me...teaching for doctrine the commandments of men", (Matthew 15:3,9).
Sunday worship services are not ordained of God....therefore it is 'vain worship'.

To be really blunt...it is sin, because Sunday replaces the 7th day Sabbath which God set up as his Holy day.
He said to "REMEMBER the Sabbath day..to keep 'it' Holy", (Exodus 20:8-11).

And the Bible says that no one goes to heaven while committing known sin, (Romans 6:23).
 
Upvote 0

tulc

loves "SO'S YER MOM!! posts!
May 18, 2002
49,401
18,801
68
✟271,570.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Silver Surfer wrote: (#43)
"To be really blunt...it is sin, because Sunday replaces the 7th day Sabbath which God set up as his Holy day.
He said to "REMEMBER the Sabbath day..to keep 'it' Holy", (Exodus 20:8-11).
And the Bible says that no one goes to heaven while committing known sin, (Romans 6:23)."

Well that's clear! :) Thanks!
tulc(who thinks you're wrong, but that's ok, you're not who I serve! Have a great night!)
 
Upvote 0

Woodsy

Returned From Afar.
Supporter
Jun 24, 2003
3,698
271
Pacific NW
✟35,414.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
goodnewsinc said:
One day with God is 1000 earthly years and we KNOW the law is spiritual. The Sabbath Day commanded by Moses in the law was just an "allegory" pointing to that HUGE (1000-earthly years) DAY! Jesus did not change the law! "He MAGNIFIED IT and made it honorable".

Is that why God struck dead those Hebrews who tried to gather wood on the Sabbath?
 
Upvote 0

OldShepherd

Zaqunraah
Mar 11, 2002
7,156
174
EST
✟21,242.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Silver Surfer said:
I think I did...but I respond to so many other forums....I'm not sure.

But I'll answer this here and now.

Remember that Jesus said; "But in vain....do they worship me...teaching for doctrine the commandments of men", (Matthew 15:3,9).
Sunday worship services are not ordained of God....therefore it is 'vain worship'.

To be really blunt...it is sin, because Sunday replaces the 7th day Sabbath which God set up as his Holy day.
He said to "REMEMBER the Sabbath day..to keep 'it' Holy", (Exodus 20:8-11).

And the Bible says that no one goes to heaven while committing known sin, (Romans 6:23).

[size=+1]I posted this on another thread in response to a similar post by you. Ignoring my posts, the scripture, and the historical Jewish interpretation will not make it go away.

The Sabbath commandment is the only commandment which is NOT enjoined on NT believers. NT beliievers are never commanded to observe the Sabbath. Christians are NOT children of Israel but spiritual descendants of Abraham, Galatians 3:28.

The Sabbath was given ONLY to the children of Israel, NOT to all mankind. The ancient Jews considered any non-Jew who observed the Sabbath as worthy of death.[/size]

  • Ex 31:12 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
    13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you.
    14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.
    15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
    16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the Sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.
    17 It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

    Ex 35:1 And Moses gathered all the congregation of the children of Israel together, and said unto them, These are the words which the LORD hath commanded, that ye should do them.
    2 Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death.

    Lev 23:2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.
    3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.

    Jewish Encyclopedia
    Resh Lakish (d. 278) said, "A Gentile observing the Sabbath deserves death" (Sanh. 58b). This refers to a Gentile who accepted the seven laws of the Noachidæ, inasmuch as "the Sabbath is a sign between God and Israel alone," and it was probably directed against the Christian Jews, who disregarded the Mosaic laws and yet at that time kept up the observance of the Jewish Sabbath. Rabbina, who lived about 150 years after the Christians had changed the day of rest to Sunday, could not quite understand the principle underlying Resh Lakish's law, and, commenting upon it, added: "not even on Mondays [is the Gentile allowed to rest]"; intimating that the mandate given to the Noachidæ that "day and night shall not cease" ("have no rest ") should be taken in a literal sense (Gen. viii. 22)

    http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=142&letter=G

    It is the sense of the Jews themselves, that the Gentiles are not obliged to keep their sabbath; no, not the proselyte of the gate, or he that dwelt in any of their cities; for they say F7, that

    "it is lawful for a proselyte of the gate to do work on the sabbath day for himself, as for an Israelite on a common feast day; R. Akiba says, as for all Israelite on a feast day; R. Jose says, it is lawful for a proselyte of the gate to do work on the sabbath day for himself, as for an Israelite on a common or week day:''

    and this last is the received sense of the nation; nay, they assert that a Gentile that keeps a sabbath is guilty of death F8; (See Gill on Mark 2:27). Yea, they say F9, that

    "if a Gentile sabbatizes, or keeps a sabbath, though on any of the days of the week, if he makes or appoints it as a sabbath for himself, he is guilty of the same.''

    It is the general sense of that people, that the sabbath was peculiarly given to the children of Israel; and that the Gentiles, strangers, or others, were not punishable for the neglect and breach of it F11; that it is a special and an additional precept, which, with some others, were given them at Marah, over and above the seven commands, which the sons of Noah were only obliged to regard F12; and that the blessing and sanctifying of it were by the manna provided for that day; and that the passage in (Genesis 2:3) ; refers not to the then present time, but (dyteh le) , "to time to come", to the time of the manna F13.

    FOOTNOTES:

    F7 T. Bab. Ceritot, fol. 9. 1. Piske Tosaphot Yebamot. art. 84. Maimon. Hilch. Sabbat, c. 20. sect. 14.
    F8 T. Bab. Sanhedrin, fol. 58. 2.
    F9 Maimon. Hilch. Melachim, c. 10. sect. 9.
    F11 T. Bab. Betza, fol. 16. 1. Seder Tephillot, fol. 76. 1. Ed. Amtst.
    F12 T. Bab. Sanhedrin, fol. 56. 2. Seder Olam Rabba, p. 17. & Zuta, p. 101. Ed. Meyer.
    F13 Jarchi & Baal Hatturim in Gen. ii. 3. Pirke Eliezer, c. 18.
 
Upvote 0

OldShepherd

Zaqunraah
Mar 11, 2002
7,156
174
EST
✟21,242.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Tribe said:
Is that why God struck dead those Hebrews who tried to gather wood on the Sabbath?

[size=+1]See my previous post. Yes, that is why God struck dead those Hebrews, i.e. children of Israel, who tried to gather wood on the Sabbath? Where is it recorded in scripture that God punished a non-Israelite for not observing the Sabbath?[/size]
 
Upvote 0

OldShepherd

Zaqunraah
Mar 11, 2002
7,156
174
EST
✟21,242.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Silver Surfer said:
To disobey God's command results in eternal death, (Romans 6:23).

[size=+1]I am a New Testament Christian NOT a descendant of Israel or a Pharisee. How about you?[/size]
  • Ro 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ

    Ro 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
    6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

    13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way

    Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

    Gal 4:21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?

    5:1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
    2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.
    3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.
    4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

    15:1 And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.

    15:5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.

    15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? [Note, see Gal 5:1, “yoke of bondage.”]

    15:19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
    20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

    15:24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:

    15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;

    15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

DJ B.K.

But I'm Le Tired...
Jun 24, 2003
9,936
139
38
Cincinnati, Ohio
Visit site
✟18,551.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Constitution
silver Surfer you aren't proving anything to me. Your post are all short and repetitive. Try putting a little bit of effort into proving your point because otherwise your going to keep getting completely out proven.
 
Upvote 0

tulc

loves "SO'S YER MOM!! posts!
May 18, 2002
49,401
18,801
68
✟271,570.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
So those scriptures Old Shepherd posted don't mean what they say? :
Ro 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

So I think you should go ahead and get yourself as bound up in the Law as you want, put the yoke on as much as you can bear, you have the right to do that (I don't know why you would seeing as how much it cost our Lord to set you free) but go ahead. BUT don't think you are doing anyone a favor by trying to lead us back to the very things we were set free from. You have your days to worship and you can judge the rest of Christ's Church all you want. Just a thought.
tulc
 
Upvote 0

goodnewsinc

Senior Member
Supporter
Feb 18, 2002
1,589
97
80
Phoenix, AZ
Visit site
✟72,703.00
Faith
Christian
In those days God chose the whole nation of Isreal for prophetic role-play (as the "chosen people"). Those who are part of prophetic role-play must ACT within the parameters of their specific role. Israel is nolonger in that specific acting-role. All men are God's "chosen people" as opposed by the powers of darkness, Hosea 1:10, Isaiah 25:6-8, Psalm 87. You will notice that Jesus was not "struck dead" for working on a 7-day weekly sabbath day. No one else has been "struck dead" either. All over the world men work on Saturday with no problems except what happens normally. God has not changed His mind about the Sabbath. He is not enforcing a "school-master" role anymore. Men down here need to direct their thinking to the real Sabbath which is the objective of the command, a huge 1000-earthly years day! We are not stuck in the mud of carnal Old Testament thinking about a spiritual matter, the Sabbath Day!

John,
GOOD NEWS, Inc. :kiss: :pink: :priest:
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

KelsayDL

Seeker of the Way
Aug 9, 2003
294
20
54
✟8,104.00
Faith
Other Religion
Marital Status
Married
The ancient Jews considered any non-Jew who observed the Sabbath as worthy of death.

OS, you seem to put alot of stock in this point concerning the ancient Jews. Yet ignore the posts people have made from Josephus stating that even the gentile believers in the diaspora observed the Sabbath.

They (the ancient Jews) added alot of their own beliefs to the Torah, which was a problem Jesus addressed in several instances. If you can show me where God says to put to death any non-Jew who observes the Sabbath, then I will put more stock into what you say concerning the issue. Until then, it is a man made doctrine and not of God, at best...

The ancient Jews you speak of here, also considered Jesus a heretic.
 
Upvote 0

Achichem

Faithful
Aug 9, 2003
1,349
58
✟1,857.00
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Libertarian
Old Shepard I want to believe you but if this is not mis-interpretation I do not know what is:

The Sabbath was given ONLY to the children of Israel, NOT to all mankind. The ancient Jews considered any non-Jew who observed the Sabbath as worthy of death.

Come on:

Deuteronomy 5:12-15 NKJV:
"Observe the Sabbath day, to keep it holy, as the LORD your God commanded you. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your ox, nor your donkey, nor any of your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates, that your male servant and your female servant may rest as well as you. And remember that you were a slave in the land of Egypt, and the LORD your God brought you out from there by a mighty hand and by an outstretched arm; therefore the LORD your God commanded you to keep the Sabbath day.

Exodus 12:49 NKJV:
One law shall be for the native-born and for the stranger who dwells among you." .

Leviticus 24:22 NKJV:
You shall have the same law for the stranger and for one from your own country; for I am the LORD your God."'.

Numbers 15:16
One law and one custom shall be for you and for the stranger who dwells with you."'

Numbers 15:29 NKJV:
You shall have one law for him who sins unintentionally, for him who is native-born among the children of Israel and for the stranger who dwells among them. .

Deuteronomy 31:12 NKJV:
Gather the people together, men and women and little ones, and the stranger who is within your gates, that they may hear and that they may learn to fear the LORD your God and carefully observe all the words of this law, .
 
Upvote 0

Achichem

Faithful
Aug 9, 2003
1,349
58
✟1,857.00
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Libertarian
I agree, for remember Sunday is the worship day for the sun, Lucifer is called the morning star (sun).dann dann dannnnnnnnnnn

My research shows that the name Lucifer is not for the devil but actually the name of a king thrown off the throne who persecuted Jews, interesting to note I?m sure.

But Jesus also called him self the morning star, does that validate Sunday worship?

Btw right now it is the Sabbath day (I follow the Sabbath day), and I?m typing OOOOOOOOOwwwww. Ok I?m done, wait no, See I will not let it become a burden, will you silver surfer?

God bless, and can people please stop putting random bible quotes, and please put the bible quotes in either quote boxes, colors or lists, it gets confusing.

Thanks all,
And let just say this simple prayer:

Our Father in heaven,
Blessed be your holy name,
Bless all your children on this beautiful Sabbath night,
May your will be done for all the earth and may understanding and sight come to all believers in Jesus Son of God. May the devils fruits be revealed and may his snares become broken and set us all free, lord.
May our conversation on this most important topic take order and may people back them self?s up with relevant and well place quotes from your holy word the bible,
Bless be you lord, and may you open our hearts to you father.
We ask this all in the name of your son
Yeshau Messiah
 
Upvote 0

Der Alte

This is me about 1 yr. old.
Supporter
Aug 21, 2003
28,575
6,063
EST
✟992,246.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
KelsayDL said:
OS, you seem to put alot of stock in this point concerning the ancient Jews. Yet ignore the posts people have made from Josephus stating that even the gentile believers in the diaspora observed the Sabbath.

They (the ancient Jews) added alot of their own beliefs to the Torah, which was a problem Jesus addressed in several instances. If you can show me where God says to put to death any non-Jew who observes the Sabbath, then I will put more stock into what you say concerning the issue. Until then, it is a man made doctrine and not of God, at best...

The ancient Jews you speak of here, also considered Jesus a heretic.

PMFBI but Josephus says nothing about "gentiles believers in the diaspora" Here is the exact quote that was posted. Josephus was a Jew, NOT a Christian and he said "our [Jewish] custom of resting on the Sabbath”. And he is correct, Judaism spread throughout the known world at that time.

Sabbath observance in the early church

Josephus says


"There is not any city of the Grecians, nor any of the barbarians, nor any nation whatsoever, whither our custom of resting on the seventh day hath not come!" M'Clathie, Notes and Queries on China and Japan. (edited by Dennys),Vol.4, Nos. 7,8, p.100.

http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?p=942861&postcount=39

Irrelevant that it was a man made law, that is what the first century Jews were taught and that is the attitude the first century Christians encountered. Roman law was also not in the Bible but all the Jews, Christians and everything else certainly obeyed it.

That is correct the ancient Jews rejected Jesus and the Jews today still reject Him. That is irrelevant. The Jews taught that gentiles were not to observe the Sabbath and any who did could be put to death.

Did gentiles Christians keep Sabbath in Israel where they could be put to death?

According to scripture the Sabbath is a covenant and a sign between God and Israel and the scriptures never say anything about Gentiles keeping Sabbath.

Ex 31:12 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you.
14 Ye shall keep the Sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.
15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the Sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.
17 It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

Ex 35:1 And Moses gathered all the congregation of the children of Israel together, and said unto them, These are the words which the LORD hath commanded, that ye should do them.
2 Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death.

Lev 23:2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.
3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your (Israel) dwellings.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Der Alte

This is me about 1 yr. old.
Supporter
Aug 21, 2003
28,575
6,063
EST
✟992,246.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
DaTsar said:
Deuteronomy 5:12-15 NKJV: " nor your stranger who is within your gates,

Exodus 12:49 NKJV: the stranger who dwells among you." .

Numbers 15:16 the stranger who dwells with you."'

Numbers 15:29 NKJV: the stranger who dwells among them. .

Deuteronomy 31:12 NKJV: the stranger who is within your gates,

I dwell in the US. I do not dwell among Israel and I am not within Israel’s gates. The early Christians who lived in Greece, Italy, Asia Minor, Assyria, Egypt, etc. also did NOT dwell among Israel nor within Israel’s gates.

Three times in the NT, Acts 15:20, 15-29, and 21:25, gentile Christian were told to obey four specific laws, abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.