72% of Americans do not believe in Evolution

lucaspa

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JohnR7 said:
Are you that blind that you do not see your attitude and how condescending it is? I know there are lots of things that we do not agree on, so does that justify you having the attitude you have? Maybe it does according to your way of thinking.

It was a serious question. Instead of ducking the question by trying to turn this into some form of persecution of you, why don't you just answer the questions:

You use Bible verses out of context to say something different than what they say in context. If we can't trust you to correctly use Bible verses, how do we trust you when you make statements about science?

Also, what exactly have you read when you say you have "studied evolution"?
 
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lucaspa

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JohnR7 said:
Are you that blind that you do not see your attitude and how condescending it is? I know there are lots of things that we do not agree on, so does that justify you having the attitude you have? Maybe it does according to your way of thinking.

Let me put that post to you again. Maybe this time you will address the questions and issues:

It's a serious question. Time and again I look at the verses you post and find you take them out of context to make them say the exact opposite of what the verses are really saying. Now, you admit that you know little of science but that you do know about theology.

However, whenever we check on your quote verses we find that your use of them is not correct. So, we can't trust you in your stated specialty. If we can't trust you there, how can we possibly trust your statements about science? (BTW, this is EXACTLY what you stated about your brother.)

It's a serious question and I would appreciate a serious answer.

I would also appreciate an answer to my other question: WHAT EXACTLY have you read to study evolution?
 
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LorentzHA

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JohnR7 said:
What happened to me? Ask Darwin, I can only work with the genes I was given. But that is not the point. Let me take my one brother for example. Director of the Psychology Dept at the local tri country Children's hospital. He has one child a daughter. She has five children with four different men, and she was not married to any of them. Now I am not going to get into everything, I am just saying, what sense does it make to go to people like this for help, when their own personal lives are a mess. Don't go by the degree, go by what the Bible says: Before anyone is qualified to help others, their own personal life has to be in order. Or they are simply unqualified.

How would Darwin know? According to Christianity each person is hand made by the creator?

Are you proposing that because your bother is educated and (I am assuming from the above statement) a non-believer, that this is the reason his daughter had children with 4 different men?? Don't blame your brother or HER! The devil made her do it!! :p
 
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JohnR7

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LorentzHA said:
According to Christianity each person is hand made by the creator?

Adam and Eve were created in perfection and the Garden of Eden was a paradise. God's plan was for Eden to expand and fill the whole world. But Adam and Eve fell into sin and fell from the grace of God. They rebelled against His plan and purpose.

The good news is that Jesus is the second Adam. He gained back what the first Adam lost. God is going to restore and redeem this world and it will become a Paradise and we will live forever. Only God is going to test people first to see if they want to follow His will and His plan. The invitation is open for who so ever is willing, let them come.

Matthew 25:23
His lord said to him, 'Well done, good and faithful servant; you have been faithful over a few things, I will make you ruler over many things. Enter into the joy of your lord.'
 
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JohnR7

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lucaspa said:
It's a serious question. Time and again I look at the verses you post and find you take them out of context to make them say the exact opposite of what the verses are really saying. Now, you admit that you know little of science but that you do know about theology.

It is up to you to prove what your saying. So far you have not offered one shread of proof.

1 Cor. 1:27
But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

1 Cor. 1:20 Has not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

1 Cor. 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God.

2 Cor. 1:12 not with fleshly wisdom but by the grace of God,

1 Cor. 1:19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.

Matthew 11:25
At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.

1 Cor. 3:20 The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.

Psalm 94:11 The Lord knoweth the thoughts of man, that they are vanity.

1 Cor. 1:25
Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

Isaiah 44:25
That frustrateth the tokens of the liars, and maketh diviners mad; that turneth wise men backward, and maketh their knowledge foolish;

There you go, 10 more verses that say the same thing. The wisdom of this world does not even hold a candle to the wisdom of God. Man's wisdom and understanding is dung and fuel for the fire.

Man's opinions are worthless, unless they line up with the word of God.
 
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Vance

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But John, those verses are the last resort of those who know they can not argue their point. Yes, they are all true, God's wisdom is greater than ours and the comparison is not even close. But it still completely begs the question of point at issue. How do you know that YOUR wisdom (being your interpretation of God's Word) is more correct than any other Christian's wisdom?

True, God's path for our lives, that of obedience, putting others ahead of ourselves, belief in God in the first place, is foolishness to those who do not believe and these will, indeed, confound all those who do not believe.

But how does this apply to Biblical scholarship and the study of God's Creation? Whether evolution is valid is not a question of the "World" v. God. Many, many Christians believe it is how God created the world. There are Christian scientists on both sides of this issue.

You are equating the theory of evolution with the "wisdom of the world". What about every other scientific theory? Are they are "worldly wisdom" and thus foolishness as well? Take photosynthesis. Is that foolishness because it was developed by worldly scientists? What about medicine? Is every cure for a desease foolishness?

No, these scriptures are not referring to these types of human "wisdom", but the worldly wisdom which is contrary to the *ways* of God.

God gave us our intellect, it is when we worship our intellect over His ways that we become foolish.
 
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stefaniii

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JohnR7 said:
Did they change the Intelligence test? Last I hear average was between something like 90 and 110. That the majority of the people fell into this group.
The irony here made me fall out of my chair laughing.

"50% of people have below average intelligence" is true by definition.
 
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Arikay

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Vance hit on a good point. These are refering to Gods wisdom. However, your are interpreting gods words and pretending they are gods wisdom, when many arent even his words, he only Inspired Men to write them.

So John, what happens when your interpretation doesnt match gods creation?

a) Plug your ears and say you are right over gods creation.
b)Say the study of gods creation doesnt matter, only your interpretation of his words.
c) change your interpretation to more closely match gods own creation.
 
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Gracchus

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JohnR7 said:
Adam and Eve were created in perfection and the Garden of Eden was a paradise. God's plan was for Eden to expand and fill the whole world.
What kind of planning is that? He knew it was going to fail, but didn't change the plan. Can you explain why we should not conclude your god is stupid?

But Adam and Eve fell into sin and fell from the grace of God. They rebelled against His plan and purpose.
And He knew that they were going to do this, but still condemned not only them, but innocent children to sin, suffering and death. That is not mercy, that is not even justice.

The good news is that Jesus is the second Adam. He gained back what the first Adam lost.
And we are supposed to be thankful that He will save us, after much suffering, from the trap He set for us?

God is going to restore and redeem this world and it will become a Paradise and we will live forever.
Well, He's certainly taking His time about it.

Only God is going to test people first to see if they want to follow His will and His plan.
But if He is omniscient, he knows how the "test" will turn out, and that makes the "test" just so much unnecessary cruelty.

The invitation is open for who so ever is willing, let them come.
JohnR7, if your god were really God, which he is not, he deserves neither gratitude nor respect.

Your god lacks intelligence and mercy, JohnR7, he is capricious and unfair. And your god is not real, just a dark altar in your mind, where you attempt to assuage your fear.

Matthew 25:23
His lord said to him, 'Well done, good and faithful servant; you have been faithful over a few things, I will make you ruler over many things. Enter into the joy of your lord.'
JohnR7 never misses an opportunity to show how holy he is by breaking into sermon mode. He just can't stay on topic. I am beginning to suspect that he doesn't know what he's talking about, and slips into sermon mode, so that he can parrot the teachings of his singular cult. In his mind, this passes for learned discourse.


Never once have I seen him post on topic. He may start on topic, but he always almost immediately, rides off into the intellectual boondocks.
I'm sure he is a very nice man, never beats his wife on the Sabbath, and never commits senseless homicide, but he just can't STAY ON TOPIC.

 
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JohnR7

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stefaniii said:
"50% of people have below average intelligence" is true by definition.

By definition 90 to 110 is average intelligence. To be above average you have to have a intelligence of 111 or above. To be below average your intelligence would be 89 or lower.
 
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JohnR7 said:
By definition 90 to 110 is average intelligence. To be above average you have to have a intelligence of 111 or above. To be below average your intelligence would be 89 or lower.

Perhaps you are unfamiliar with the word "average," John. Average intelligence is 100. Many people fall within the 90 to 110 range, but that range is not the average per se.
 
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Arikay

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Well, beyond the insult towards someone (thought you were trying to stop that) :D

It wouldnt make him anything, since if one had a stupid creator, one may be able to out grow that creator and become smarter than them.

So, John, what is your answer to my question?
Hmm, I bet it will be ignored. ;)
 
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Nathan Poe

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JohnR7 said:
If God created you, and you think God is "stupid", then what does that make you?

The product of billions of years of evolution, the best that our environment has to offer, and not the cobbled-together slaves of a petty, capricious, incompetent, psychopathic, schizophrenic figment of a primative people's imagination.
 
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JohnR7

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Arikay said:
Well, beyond the insult towards someone (thought you were trying to stop that)

It was not a insult, I just asked a question.

So, John, what is your answer to my question?
Hmm, I bet it will be ignored. ;)

What was your question?
 
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Arikay

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Although I assume your scroll bar isnt broken, since you often say you skip posts, I will repost it,


Vance hit on a good point. These are refering to Gods wisdom. However, your are interpreting gods words and pretending they are gods wisdom, when many arent even his words, he only Inspired Men to write them.

So John, what happens when your interpretation doesnt match gods creation?

a) Plug your ears and say you are right over gods creation.
b)Say the study of gods creation doesnt matter, only your interpretation of his words.
c) change your interpretation to more closely match gods own creation.


JohnR7 said:
It was not a insult, I just asked a question.



What was your question?
 
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lucaspa

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JohnR7 said:
Originally Posted By: Gracchus

Can you explain why we should not conclude your god is stupid?

If God created you, and you think God is "stupid", then what does that make you?

John, you missed it. Gracchus used the small "g" in god. YOUR god is not God. So we can conclude YOUR god is stupid without saying anything about the real God.
 
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JohnR7

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Vance said:
But John, those verses are the last resort of those who know they can not argue their point. Yes, they are all true, God's wisdom is greater than ours and the comparison is not even close. But it still completely begs the question of point at issue. How do you know that YOUR wisdom (being your interpretation of God's Word) is more correct than any other Christian's wisdom?

When you say: "God's wisdom is greater than ours and the comparison is not even close". That was the point I was trying to make. Now you want to know: "How do you know that YOUR wisdom is more correct than any other Christian's wisdom?"

How much time do you have for me to explain this to you? If it were my wisdom, then it would be human wisdom that you say does not even come close to God's wisdom. So, the wisdom I seek after is not man's wisdom, but God's wisdom. The Bible says, we can have the mind of Christ. Actually we can have the mind that Adam and Eve had, before they fell into sin and fell from the grace of God. Jesus came to restore us to our rightful place with God.

Philip. 2:5 Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus,

1 Cor. 2:16 But we have the mind of Christ.


The Mind of Christ


1. A mind of divine love 2. A mind of peace 3. An anointed mind 4. A praying mind 5. A fasting mind 6. A mind of faith 7. A mind that glorified God 8. A mind of compassion 9. An obedient mind 10. A trusting mind 11. A mind free of all condemnation 12. A mind of full assurance 13. A happy mind 14. A contented mind 15. A tempted mind 16. A mind acquainted with grief and sorrows 17. A mind that wept 18. A magnanimous mind 19. A forgiving mind 20. A serving mind 21. A pure mind 22. A mind of truth 23. A sober mind 24. A resurrected mind 25. A longsuffering mind 26. A mind of prophecy 27. A Holy Ghost mind 28. A believing mind 29. A mind of the nine fruits of the Spirit 30. A mind accepting 9 gifts of the Spirit 31. A mind that feels the need of the Holy Ghost for all people 32. A born new mind 33. A mind of Calvary 34. A mind of Bible Pentecost 35. A mind of one accord with the Father 36. A mind of unity with the Holy Spirit 37. A sacrificial mind 38. A sanctified mind 39. A mind God can reason with 40. A mind with the whole armor of God 41. A made up mind 42. A thankful mind* 43. A mind of holiness 44. A mind that blessed 45. A mind to do God's work 46. A mind of God's wisdom 47. A mind dwelling on the right kind of thoughts 48. A mind with the love bridle 49. A mind of tender mercy 50. A mind of goodness 51. A mind of kindness 52. A mind knowing the will of God 53. A mind God could use as His very own 54. A mind of courage 55. A mind of boldness 56. A mind of hope 57. A Word mind 58. A divine blood mind 59. A mind of divine knowledge 60. A stable mind 61. A consecrated mind 62. A mind of endurance 63. A dedicated mind 64. A mind of encouragement 65. A mind of fellowship 66. A willing mind 67. A perfect mind 68. A working mind (#140)BB 69. A mind connected with heaven 70. A mind God could use all the time 71. A mind to fulfill His divine mission 72. A victorious mind 73. An all-conquering mind 74. A gentle mind 75. A mind with the conversation of heaven 76. A wonderful mind 77. An understanding mind 78. A steadfast mind 79. A mind of joy 80. A Spirit-filled mind 81. A praising mind 82. A grace mind 83. A mind of freedom 84. A mind of living water 85. A mind of unbelievable kindness 86. A grateful mind 87. An on time mind* 88. A spiritual mind 89. A thoughtful mind 90. A soul-wining mind to sow and reap 91. An eternal life mind 92. A healing mind 93. A miracle mind 94. An obedient mind 95. A mind of determination 96. A divine blood mind 97. A mind completely surrendered 98. A mind of honor 99. A perfect mind like the first Adam 100. A mind just like the heavenly Father 101. A sound mind* 102. A mind of power 103. A made up mind 104. A mind with the right attitudes (#134) 105. A patient mind 106. An unshakable mind 107. A mind of compassion 108. A mind with the six spiritual senses 109. The Eden mind with holy physical senses 110. A gracious mind 111. A quick mind 112. A watching mind 113. A mind of pure light 114. A lovely mind 115. A submissive mind 116. A waiting mind 117. A mind of zeal to do God's work 118. A mind of heaven's courage 119. A peculiar mind 120. An alert mind 121. An honest mind 122. A mind of humility 123. A mind of a good report 124. A mind of complete self control 125. A mind without spot 126. A mind without wrinkles, blemishes or any such thing 127. A "boastless" mind 128. A mind to respect each person* 129. A renewed mind 130. A mind of righteousness 131. A mind stayed on the Lord 132. A mind that pleased God 133. The Eden mind 134. A blessed mind of the Beatitudes (#104) 135. A mind with the divine blood shield 136. An exciting mind 137. A mind of blood happiness 138. A mind without any guile 139. An overcoming mind 140. A working mind (#68) 141. A mind of all the promises of God

As far as being more correct than others: Everyone is one in Christ.

Ephes. 1:9-10
Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself: [10] That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:

Ephes. 4:4-6
There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; [5] one Lord, one faith, one baptism; [6] one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

Philip. 2:2
fulfill my joy by being like-minded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind.

We are to be of one mind. Now whos mind do you think that is, my mind, your mind? Nope, the mind of Christ.

Now, if that is not enough for you, I will give you the garment we are to wear, our robe of righteousness. As in without spot, blemish or wrinkle.

Put on the garments of:
Blood
Salvation
Love
Faith
Peace
Joy
Long-suffering
Gentleness
Goodness
Meekness
Humility
Self control
Sacrifice
Steadfastness
Hope
Serving
One mind (no fussing)
Sincerity
Perseverance
Grace
Obedience
Blessings untold
Gladness
Determination
Wisdom
Knowledge
Dedication
Consecration
Sobriety
Deep thoughts
An understanding heart
Separation from everything that Jesus was separated from
Truth
Full assurance
Complete trust
His will to do all of His will
Knowing what all the will of God is
Being on time, i.e.: God’s time
Prayer
Fasting
Hunger and thirst for the Holy Ghost
I will! I can!
To run after Jesus because He is drawing on you
Godly fear with honor and respect
Holy boldness
Miracle power
Healing power
Calvary’s compassion
An obedient life
Holiness
Righteousness
Contentment
Waiting upon the Lord
Encouragement to your own heart
Pleasing God by using the garment of faith
Reality of God
Reality of Jesus
Reality of the Holy Ghost
Every time these anointings are given out, it is another garment for you to wear, saith the Lord.
Freedom and liberty
Witness (live your witness, don’t just talk it)
Being an example of a true believer (live, walk, speak in truth0
Talents
Being led by the Spirit and the Spirit only
Inspiration
Revelation
Pentecostal fire
Purity of God
Honesty
Good report
Meditation on the Word
Sanctification
Fire of the Holy Ghost
Strength
Holy conversation
The whole armor of God
Kindness
Brotherly love
Unity of the Spirit till we all come into unity
Sound doctrine
Blamelessness
Hospitality
Sound speech
Perfection
Justification
Watchfulness
To fight or war against the devil
Godliness
The six spiritual senses
Reconciliation
Forgetting the past
Light, no darkness at all
Harmlessness
Forgiveness
Fullness of Christ
Fullness of the Godhead
 
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