Why is it?

To John:

This forum is for the "discussion" of Catholic Beliefs. It is not intended for those who wish to argue them. "Here we go again" are the words that are not the preface to peaceful discussion.

ALL Catholic teaching is Scriptural. Period. There is nothing the Church teaches that is against Scripture. And yes, there is "proof" for that.



Peace be with you,
~VOW

>>It is not intended for those who wish to argue them.

Then why do you argue them if that is not what they are intended for? I know why you do what you do. I just want to know if you know why. Thanks, JohnR7

Let's keep our cool guys

This is not the appropriate forum to debate what catholics believe or not.The proper place for that is the interfaith.

If anyone has a legitimate and genuine question for Catholics you can post here but remember this is a catholic bible study area and they don't need to defend their faith herefor anyone else. Go to interfaith and post there.

Thank you for your cooporation.

God bless

Originally posted by JohnR7
>>It is not intended for those who wish to argue them.<<

Then why do you argue them if that is not what they are intended for?

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This particular forum is not designated for debate. That is what was meant.

I know why you do what you do. I just want to know if you know why. Thanks, JohnR7

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Why do we defend our faith?

1 Peter 3:15
But in your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have....

.....But do this with gentleness and respect, 16keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciously against your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander. 17It is better, if it is God’s will, to suffer for doing good than for doing evil.

To Jeff:

Thanks, Hon. I probably need to have those verses tattooed on my forehead.


Peace be with you,
~VOW

Exactly, PJ. This is the problem I was having recently. It is very hard to hand out gentleness and respect when you are getting nothing but slaps and put downs in return, but we are called to do it. And you've had to deal with that too, I know. May God bless you for your efforts, my friend, as I hope He blesses me for mine.

I pray the current controversies do not ruin my friendships.

Originally posted by PrinceJeff
I pray the current controversies do not ruin my friendships.

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Don't worry about it, Hon. Remember the same fire that melts butter, tempers steel.

You're the best!


Peace be with you,
~VOW

Originally posted by Avila
Like on this board - there are several of our Protestant brothers and sisters who are genuinely interested in sharing the faith with us - and putting any differences aside.

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Without trying to add fuel to the fire I would like to state that Catholics and Protestants can not "put differences aside" and have true fellowship.
Amos 3:3 says, "Can two walk together, unless they are agreed?"
The disagreements are numerous and although I don't believe in being contentious, I do believe in standing for truth and rebuking error. But it should be in love as scripture teaches, not quarrels.

Originally posted by Apologist

Without trying to add fuel to the fire I would like to state that Catholics and Protestants can not "put differences aside" and have true fellowship.
Amos 3:3 says, "Can two walk together, unless they are agreed?"

The disagreements are numerous and although I don't believe in being contentious, I do believe in standing for truth and rebuking error. But it should be in love as scripture teaches, not quarrels.

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I agree, we cannot put our differences aside and have true fellowship unless we are agreed on the issues that separate us.

The following is an article I wrote for my parish on the topic of Ecumenism.


In spite of the clear teaching of Jesus Christ and the New Testament, the one church of Jesus Christ has been divided. Catholics realize that this is a direct violation of the will of God, and is reflected by the Second Vatican Council in their Decree on Ecumenism:

Without doubt, this discord openly contradicts the will of Christ, provides a stumbling block to the world, and inflicts damage on the most holy cause of proclaiming the good news to every creature. (no. 1)

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This same decree presents God's solution to this situation, the ecumenical movement:

...there increases from day to day a movement, fostered by the grace of the Holy Spirit, for the restoration of unity among Christians. Taking part in this movement, which is called ecumenical, are those who invoke the Triune God and confess Jesus as Lord and Savior. (UR, no. 1)

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Ecumenism, defined as "worldwide Christian unity or cooperation", is not a new subject to Christianity, as the idea of a universal (catholic) church dates back to the times of the New Testament. Jesus Christ referred constantly to the unity His church should have:

"There shall be one flock and one shepherd." (John 10:16)

"I pray not only for them, but also for those who will believe in me through their word, so that they may all be one, as you, Father, are in me and I in you, that they also may be in us, that the world may believe that you sent me. And I have given them the glory you gave me, so that they may be one, I in them and you in me, that they may be brought to perfection as one, that the world may know that you sent me, and that you loved them even as you loved me." (John 17:20-23)

And St. Paul often wrote about a unified and universal community:

"I appeal to you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree and that there be no dissensions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment." (1 Corinthians 1:10)

"The bread which we break, is it not a participation in the body of Christ? Because there is one loaf, we who are many are one body, for we all partake of the same loaf." (1 Corinthians 10:16-17)

"I, then, a prisoner for the Lord, urge you to live in a manner worthy of the call you have received, with all humanity and gentleness, with patience, bearing with one another through love, striving to preserve the unity of the spirit through the bond of peace: one body and one Spirit, as you were also called to the one hope of your call; one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all."(Ephesians 4:1-6)

And so, we see that at the foundation of all Christianity lies the building blocks of cooperation, love and peace between all the followers of Christ. It is extremely important that this cooperation and love be fostered amongst Christians, for to deny this relationship between the children of God is to deny all that Christ taught, and all that we, as Christians, believe in and preach about.

In Pope John Paul II's encyclical Ut Unum Sint ("That They May Be One"), we read:

No one is unaware of the challenge which all this poses to believers. They cannot fail to meet this challenge. Indeed, how could they refuse to do everything possible, with God's help, to break down the walls of division and distrust, to overcome obstacles and prejudices which thwart the proclamation of the Gospel of salvation in the Cross of Jesus, the one Redeemer of man, of every individual? (no. 2)

So how can we be more ecumenical? How can we reach out to our brothers and sisters in Christ? That same Second Vatican Council which acknowledges this problem also lays down a solid guideline on how Catholics should represent themselves and their church:

First, the primary duty of Catholics in promoting ecumenism is to seek the renewal of the Catholic church so that its life may be a clearer witness to its teachings. "Let all Christ's faithful remember that the more purely they stive to live according to the gospel, the more they are fostering and even practicing Christian unity." (UR, no 7).

Second, Catholics can genuinely learn and receive support from other Christians. In fact, Catholics are encouraged to study the beliefs and backgrounds of other Christian churches in order to understand them better and to meet individually or in groups to pray with other Christians. (UR, no. 4)

Third, in discussing our beliefs with other Christians, Catholics should state the teachings of the Catholic Church clearly and non-defensively. As the Decree on Ecumenism instructs, Catholics should avoid a "false conciliator approach" in presenting Catholic belief "which harms the purity of Catholic doctrine and obscures its assured genuine meaning". This decree also encourages Catholics to explain their beliefs "profoundly and precisely, in ways and in terminology which our separated brethren too can really understand." (UR, no. 11)

In addition, we must seek forgiveness and give forgiveness to our non-Catholic Christian brothers and sisters.

Separation from the Catholic Church is of the past, and our brothers and sisters in Christ are baptized, believe in the Trinity and in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. They have the right to be "honored by the title of Christian, and are properly regarded as brothers and sisters in the Lord by the sons and daughters of the Catholic church." (UR, no. 3)

And finally, Catholics are encouraged to join with all Christians in professing to the whole world our "faith in God, one and three, in the incarnate Son of God, our Redeemer and Lord." Most importantly, our cooperation in matters of social justice is essential. This is possibly the most visible of all the initiatives we can take in our journey of ecumenical outreach, and the one which offers the most potential for a strong, solid cooperative foundation between the Catholic church and the Protestant churches. (UR, no. 12)

Originally posted by Apologist
The disagreements are numerous and although I don't believe in being contentious, I do believe in standing for truth and rebuking error. But it should be in love as scripture teaches, not quarrels.

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What do you do when both sides believe they are standing for truth and rebuking error? Which one is "right"? Certainly not the one who is screaming the loudest, or thumping the Bible the hardest.

The second problem with the disagreements is that one side doesn't truly understand the teachings of the other side. And much of the screaming and thumping is over this misunderstanding.


Peace be with you,
~VOW