Arc said:
Just to add to what "Justme" said;
In Matthew 23;
32 "Fill up, then, the measure of the guilt of your fathers.
33 "You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell?
34 "Therefore, behold, I am sending you prophets and wise men and scribes; some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues, and persecute from city to city,
35 so that upon you may fall the guilt of all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, the son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar.
36 "Truly I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.
Wouldn't "all the righteous blood shed on earth" coming down on Jerusalem (this generation) constitute a "great tribulation"? The guilt of all blood shed on earth since the first murder ever comitted till the end of the generation Jesus was speaking (70 AD) was to fall upon the generation Jesus was speaking to!
Then Jesus said;
Matt 23:38 "Behold, your house is being left to you desolate!
Luke 21:20 says;
"But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then recognize that her desolation is near.
This already happened. It may happen again but the prophecy directly pointed to 70 AD.
" He is told by Jesus to measure the Temple of God, that is the one that will sit on the mount at the sides of the North, the mount of the congregation in Jerusalem. But. do not measure the daily that is going to be given to the Gentiles 42 months."
Very good point. How do you reconcile that with:
Luke 21:24 Jerusalem will be trampled under foot by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. If the trampling started in or about 70 AD, then it would have ended 42 months later, correct?
And finally, if the antichrist is the one who "confirms a covenant" then what covenant was Christ confirming;
Gal 3:17 And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect.
Arc, quote.
Just to add to what "Justme" said;
In Matthew 23;
32 "Fill up, then, the measure of the guilt of your fathers.
33 "You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell?
34 "Therefore, behold, I am sending you prophets and wise men and scribes; some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues, and persecute from city to city,
35 so that upon you may fall the guilt of all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, the son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar.
36 "Truly I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.
My reply.
This Generation?
Which one?
It means all the generations that killed the prophets.
Prophets have been killed over many centuries and by many generations.
Bible example of the term “generation.”
The book of THE GENERATION OF JESUS CHRIST, the son of David, the son of Abraham. 2Abraham begat Isaac; and Isaac begat Jacob; and Jacob begat Judas and his brethren; 3And Judas begat Phares and Zara of Thamar; and Phares begat Esrom; and Esrom begat Aram; 4And Aram begat Aminadab; and Aminadab begat Naasson; and Naasson begat Salmon; 5And Salmon begat Booz of Rachab; and Booz begat Obed of Ruth; and Obed begat Jesse; 6And Jesse begat David the king; and David the king begat Solomon of her that had been the wife of Urias; 7And Solomon begat Roboam; and Roboam begat Abia; and Abia begat Asa; 8And Asa begat Josaphat; and Josaphat begat Joram; and Joram begat Ozias; 9And Ozias begat Joatham; and Joatham begat Achaz; and Achaz begat Ezekias; 10And Ezekias begat Manasses; and Manasses begat Amon; and Amon begat Josias; 11And Josias begat Jechonias and his brethren, about the time they were carried away to Babylon: 12And after they were brought to Babylon, Jechonias begat Salathiel; and Salathiel begat Zorobabel; 13And Zorobabel begat Abiud; and Abiud begat Eliakim; and Eliakim begat Azor; 14And Azor begat Sadoc; and Sadoc begat Achim; and Achim begat Eliud; 15And Eliud begat Eleazar; and Eleazar begat Matthan; and Matthan begat Jacob; 16And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ. 17So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David until the carrying away into Babylon are fourteen generations; and from the carrying away into Babylon unto Christ are fourteen generations.
That is what the Bible means as “generation.”
Arc, quote.
Wouldn't "all the righteous blood shed on earth" coming down on Jerusalem (this generation) constitute a "great tribulation"? The guilt of all blood shed on earth since the first murder ever comitted till the end of the generation Jesus was speaking (70 AD) was to fall upon the generation Jesus was speaking to!
My reply.
You say.
“Wouldn't "all the righteous blood shed on earth" “Jesus was speaking (70 AD)”
One thing wrong with that theory is the fact that NOT ALL THE RIGHTEOUS BLOOD HAD BEEN SHED BEFORE 70AD.
Jesus was Not speaking of 70AD He never ever mentions 70AD only preterists do that.
Arc, quote.
Then Jesus said;
Matt 23:38 "Behold, your house is being left to you desolate!
Luke 21:20 says;
"But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then recognize that her desolation is near.
This already happened. It may happen again but the prophecy directly pointed to 70 AD.
My reply.
The above did not happen in 70AD. It was only surrounded by ONE ARMY, that was the ROMAN ARMY!
1. So far we DO NOT HAVE ALL THE RIGHTEIOUS BLOOD SHED BEFORE 70AD.
1. WE DO NOT HAVE ARMIES, ONLY ONE ARMY.
A Bible verse out of context by miss reading it, is not prophecy.
We must read “line upon line upon line.” And “precept upon precept upon precept.”
Luke 21:20.The “ARMIES” of the Gentiles will take over Jerusalem and this next quoted prophecy starts off from the time they occupy the city Jerusalem.
It is a completely different story from that of 70AD.
Luke 21:21. Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the COUNTRIES enter thereinto.
Luke 21:22. For these be the days of vengeance, that ALL THINGS which are WRITTEN may be FULFILLED.
So Luke is talking about the same story as John in Revelation.
Now let’s see if ALL WAS FULFILLED.
Rev 11: 2. But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
The city is only given over to the Gentiles for 3 ½ years.
You seem to ignore the time periods clearly indicated in prophecy when applying it to 70AD which is an application.
The Roman army was in Jerusalem a lot longer than 42 months from 70AD..
The Roman Hadrian had to deal with the Bar Cochba war with Israel (Simeon bar Kosiba, 'Simon son of the star') (d. 135
Rev 11: 3.And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
When was it recorded that the two witnesses, witnessed for 1260 days?
When did they start and finish?
Rev 11: 4. These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
Were their enemies killed by them?
Where is that recorded by Josephus in 70AD?
Rev 11: 5. And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
Was the rain stopped for 1260 days around 3 ½ years how does that fit into 70AD?
Rev 11: 6. These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.
Where is it recorded that the beast kills them in 70AD?
Rev 11: 7. And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
Where is it recorded that they died in 70AD?
Rev 11: 8. And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.