Forgivness?

Jesusmyfriend

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Ernie,

It is more important to gain God's forgiveness first because he is the one that will help you and soften the hearts of those persons that were hurt.
If he does not prepare them they may be unable to forgive you sincerly, if at all. This is even a more serious of a problem if they are non believers or a legalist Christian.
 
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Jmf, ernie understands that, the thing ernie can't understand, is that it seems like people can keep hurting others, and use God as a *crutch*, thinking they will just go home and Pray God to forgive them, and alls OK.

ernie also understands some people would find it hard to forgive.

But still, you did hurt them too.

:puzzled:

L8 e
 
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Follower of Christ

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''Therefore if you offer your gift on the altar, and there remember that your brother has anything against you, leave your gift there before the altar and go. First be reconciled to your brother, and then come and offer your gift. ''
(Mat 5:22-24)
 
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JohnR7

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ernie said:
Jmf, ernie understands that, the thing ernie can't understand, is that it seems like people can keep hurting others, and use God as a *crutch*, thinking they will just go home and Pray God to forgive them, and alls OK.

I believe in a two fold atonement. Jesus died to reconcile us with the Father, but also to reconcile us one with another. He left us with two comandments. To love God and to love one another. To walk in love means not to hurt others. We are to edify, encourage, and build them up in God's love so as to strengthen them and help them along the way. Esp. we should not gossip about people and tear them down with our tongue. To belittle them or make them look bad in any way.

The life we have is temperal. It does not last forever. It is a test to see if we will choose to walk in God's love. Those who walk in love for one another will enter into Heaven, and be given eternal life. Those who do not walk in God's love, will not receive eternal life. Of course it is the power of God at work in us, that transforms us into a people who are well pleasing to Him. Even we are called the Children of God. Because we have the same attitude and nature that Jesus has.
 
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JohnR7

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ernie said:
How important is it to gain forgivness from those you have wronged?

God is not going to allow two people into heaven if they are fussen with each other. To qualify to get into heaven, you have to love & get along with everyone that is there.

Even now the Kingdom of Heaven is on the inside of us. So we should live our life now as if we were in Heaven. But then the day well come, when we will enter into the fullness of all that God has for us.

This life is very short. The question is, what will we have to show for this life when it is all over. Some people will be empty handed, they will have nothing to show for the life they lived.
 
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Philip

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ernie said:
How important is it to gain forgivness from those you have wronged?

It is absolutely essential that you seek the forgiveness of others. If you are not seeking their forgiveness, then are you truly repentent? Whether or not the person forgives you is another matter.
 
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Kaye8

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"Then Peter came to Him and said 'Lord, how often shall my brother sing against me, and I forgive Him? Up to seven times?' Jesus said to him, 'I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.'" Matthew 18:21-22

This passage is talking about forgiveness of sins. Peter thought 7 times would be alot and he would be pleasing the Lord by showing that he was generous and saying seven times. He thought he would be generous because in those days the Rabbis would say you only needed to forgive 3 times. But the Lord replied saying to forgive seventy times seven which virtually means an infinite amount. It is important when you do something wrong to ask God for forgiveness and the people you have wronged. You shall love others as you love yourself, you shall love other ferverently. How do you show love to others by not asking for forgiveness after wronging them?
 
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Kaye8 said:
How do you show love to others by not asking for forgiveness after wronging them?

Hello, before you read this, ernie would like to Thank You for taking the time to read it, and would appreciate any suggestions you may have.

:help:

Hi, ernie is sorry to bump this, but ernie is still somewhat at odds with this.

Maybe ernie should explain a bit more...

ernie dated a woman on and off for about 18 months.

She went back and forth between ernie, and another man.

Last November, she and ernie had a fallout, and didn't speak to one another for about 3 months. During this time, ernie lost all *Being IN Love* feelings. He still cares about/loves her, but just as a friend.

We started talking again, brought back together by an E Mail situation with one of her friends.

Anyway...

Recently this woman told ernie something that was quite hurtful.

She stated that she never was *In Love* with ernie, but did Love him.

Now, to 99% of the world, when you are holding one another and say "I Love You" it means your IN love. This is her *Loophole*, so to speak.

So, she said she asked God to forgive her for her sins. And asked ernie forgive her as well.

As one could imagine, ernie is finding it difficult, because he does not believe her words to be true. (Its NOT an ego thing that will not allow ernie to believe this, just too long and not appropriate to get into in this forum. The above example of holding one another should allow you to understand. And she is NOT a Proverbs 7 *type* woman. NOR, is it a jelousy thing, where ernie still wants to be with this woman.)

Now, to the meat of the matter...

ernie believes she should explain herself thoroughly to ernie, so he can fully understand. She claims no explanation is necessary, as she only needs God to forgive her, its up to ernie if he wants to forgive her, and that God will explain things to ernie.

ernie feels she is doing this, to *Cleanse* herself of any relationship, so she can carry on to another, without feeling guilt for having had been in Love. Possibly, to even end a freindship, so she does not fall in love again. ernie has told her he could never Love her that way again.

She and ernie, until recently, had been BEST friends. Still able to talk, see one another, go to dinner together, hang out, ect.

:sigh:

Is ernie wrong to think this way?

Or, (Maybe this is a STRETCH, but than maybe you will understand ernies questions better)

Or, would God allow a killer in heaven, just because said killer asked God to forgive his sins. Without the killer even giving an explanation to the victims family?

Yes, ernie understands that we have to ask God to forgive us, but isn't there more to it than just God understanding?

Shouldn't the one who was hurt/harmed be given some compassion, and helped to understand the situation? So forgiveness can be had, and all parties can be at peace?

Oh, BTW, she has said God will explain to ernie all that is needed to know, ernie thinks God would want her to explain, God don't want to do her work, right?

Thank You for taking the time for a somewhat long read.

God Bless You.

L8 e
 
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Achichem

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Hello Ernie,

I see how you could be having such difficulty, seeing that you seem to be around this person so much and in so be confronted by this conflict.

I don&#8217;t want to sound so critical right out of the starting block but I am afraid I must for any hope of understanding.

What must be said to you is &#8220;judge not&#8221;.

You can&#8217;t put rules on subjects such as these, like the Pharisees did in Jesus's time. It is important to understand that forgiveness in God is about taking an event and learning from it, So as to not do it again. so if I tell you here today a rule such as &#8220;You always must explain to the victim why you did what you did&#8221; then the person would then just be complying to the law, and not truly repenting to God. And as you clamed that just seems wrong. Why is this, let me try and explain.

But to do that i have to make it somehow relevant, so let me now try to address first your example then your situation.

Ex. Question: Would God allow a killer in heaven, just because the said killer asked God to forgive his sins. Without the killer even giving an explanation to the victims family?

Ex Answer: God tells us, that it is not just enough to ask, but to live by the lesson learned in such repentance, to change from it, to never do it again,to get that one step closer to walking with your brother Jesus. if then the killer did REPENT to God then I would clam that that killer would be a killer no more. Of course I have yet to address your question. The answer then is, that if the killer was a killer no more ( which he would be in the eyes of God, and in so the eye of true followers of Christ ) would he even know why he did the act of murder? The answer to that question is no, he would not even know why. That is why he could not tell the family why, because there is no answer, for the reason "why" passed away when he turn away from the frame of mind.

On to you,

It then seems to me that this Girl did truly repent to God and in so truly regretted and turn away from the act. So when she was forced to explain, all she could tell you is that she made peace with God. She truly doesn&#8217;t know why anymore that is why she cannot tell you and in so she can never ask forgiveness in the way you wish.

I don&#8217;t have the answer to why she did what she did, I beg to ask what it matters. A huge lesson was learnt by someone who sounds to be a great person. Be glad that it was you this happen to, someone who fell out of love with her instead of someone who was truly in love with her.

I hope that offers some help,
God bless,

C.B.B (DaTsar)
 
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