- Sep 19, 2002
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You don't have to convince me of anything. I really don't have much of an opinion, other than the feeling that our country is basically doomed no matter what the outcome of this year's election.Existential1 said:I'm saying that their culpability goes much deeper than anyhting you suggest.
Namely, that this pair took two countries to war against another, based on their own conviction, and their own perspective of conviction: I'm saying that we went to war, crucially, because we had two somewhat fundamentalist Christians at the helm.
In doing this, in acting on conviction, they both somewhat subverted domestic and international institutions and processes, that have been laboriously built up to protect the human world.
They acted to block out contrary opinion, of all sorts: they took us to war, without sufficient domestic and international consensus, and with insufficient legal authorisation.
In their conviction, they brought fascism into our democratic processes: they made Christianity, as the backdrop to their conviction, into a variant of democratic fascism
They cannot now slide away from accountability, by saying that the intel was at fault.
I would be shocked if, on this side of the Atlantic, the Butler report similarly gives impression of exonorating Tony Blair.
If it does, British constitutional process would be in major crisis: as that suggestion of exoneration as regards intel; will just not be plausible to a large part of the British electorate.
My suspicion is that Tony Blair might well resign following this Butler report.
As another poster said: this US report does not look at the GWB handling of the intel; it merely looks at the intel, in terms of some criteria of what is satisfactory in intel.
Americans have more reverence for their leaders than do we: I would not expect even this second report, to be effectively critical of GWB; perhaps especially if he were to be ellected for a second term.
I think that what is involved in judging Bush and Blair: is the biggest test that the western world has faced, since WW2.
If we do not act to find their style of leadership wanting, and put in place the necessary safeguards, to prevent such adventure happening again: then the world faces a progressive slide into democratic fascism, government by opinion formation, rather than on the basis of facts and evidence.
Growing terorism is a threat: but, the threat to the world posed by this democratic fascism, Christian flavoured as it has become with this pair; poses an infinitely greater threat.
I can't wait to see what Kerry does about Iraq. Think he'll just pull us out and let them have their civil war? Or will he keep us there for the 5-10 years it'll take to put the place back together?
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