What do you think of bilingual education in schools?

I know that SOME countries teach English, and encourage their native students to learn English, because it's sorta... the technological language, I guess... whatever you'd call that.

Just MHO, OK, it would be a far better world if everyone was bilingual - but, at the same time, people should speak the language of the host country.

The immigrants that came to America back in the early 1900's were a different breed, they learned the language of the new country and kept some of the old ways, but by no means did they demand to be able to take a test for a drivers license in the US in the language of their native country. Not quite the case today.

Personally, I saw far too many guys in the Army spend three years or more in Germany, or a year plus in Korea and never learn a word in that language. To get to live in another country and yet never make it out the gate, passed the EM or NCO club, or the closest tavern off post is really a shame. When we are in their country and say, "danged Germans, why they don't they speak English", something is really awry.

But Americans aren't the only ones guilty of this. I'm going to use Koreans in this example because I've lived with them both in Korea and the US.
A Korean could come to America, go to "Arirang Town" (Koreatown) in L.A. , and never have to learn a word of English. There are 22 Korean language newspapers available. If you go in a grocery store there speaking English, you are the "foreigner". It's not just the restaurants that are Korean, it is the entire section of L.A., as if a part of Seoul was airlifted to California- but the weather is a lot better and there are more private autos than taxis. No harm in this, but they should still learn English, otherwise they become "language prisoners" of a sort in their own neighborhood.

But to force any of this on people in schools is not the way to do it.

A very thoughtful post Cenimo.

I would only add that the governments offered fewer services in the 19th century, so stuff like the drivers license thing wouldn't have come up. The machine politics of the port cities would have made it possible for many an immigrant to communicate to officials in their own language. And there were many communities in which people did simply retain their own language. This was especially true of various German communities up until WWI.

Should we let people drive if they can't take the test in English?

That would mean they might have problems understanding... ohhh, I don't know, shall we say, road signs, a police officer....

Brimshack

Very true. We have churches not far from here that do the whole service in German one Sunday each month.
I remember this comment from someone in California when it came to the drivers license testing:
"If they can take the test in their own language, fine. I just want to know they can read all the road signs that are in English when they're out in traffic."

An understandable concern, but of course that is precisely why traffic signs are also coded using shape and color. There are many English speakers that can't really read either. So, the solution for that is already in the system.

- and police officers?

Brimshack

True, international road signs and all, but I was thinking more like when someone is on the freeway and comes upon a cloverleaf or something...bad enough for native born people to try and figure out all the interchanges while doing better than a mile a minute...

You know, you drive 200 miles of Interstate and you're fine...then you hit one of those signs that says, "Chicago, next 34 exits.."

Brimshack,

I got an appreciation for what you educators have to endure..
you're underpaid, and really deserve hazardous duty pay
after my initial experience..

what did I get myself into... *grumble* *grumble*

There was a really great quote from a former foreign language teacher in my school district. I forget what it exactly was, but it went something like this.
- Everyone needs to learn a foreign language so they can have another perspective on the world.
Why would anyone want to think in English only? It's the ugliest language in the world.

I for one do not object to younger children learning another language. I can only think it might make them better rounded in the long run (especially if the classes also taught culture and customs). We are teaching our 2 year old Spanish words already (She can name her body parts in either language, without confusion), and if I can regain some of my former fluency in Spanish, I'll teach her as much as I can.

I think the "English only" ideal is a bit close-minded. I realize that mandated bi-lingual education carries many issues, such as; which language would a student in, say, Long Beach, CA be required to learn? There are 5 or 6 major lingual influences in Long Beach. Would the students and/or parents get to choose which one they thought would be most beneficial? In my case, if we live in this area for any amount of time, it would be more beneficial for my daughter (and me) to learn Navajo, but how much would we use it if we were to move to any other part of the country beyond the Rez proper?  So the question would then be "which language they should learn, not whether or not they should learn. 

There are many things to consider on this issue. Until various studies and hard facts prove that learning a second language hinders a child, I will support the idea. 

I have to agree, it's rather ugly, messy, etc...

Yeah, directions are a problem. Of course, most families have an English speaker or two, and they use them to resolve those issues. Part of the issue here, again, is that we are asking whether or not individuals should speak English, whereas immigrants, etc. often look at these practical problems as something to be resolved collectively.

Diné Bizaad is a beautiful language Dew, but learning the verb system is a cruel and unusual punishment if I've ever heard of such a thing.

Today at 02:29 PM Grizzly said this in Post #20
I agree that not speaking english in America puts one at a great economic and cultural disadvantage.  But the question still remains - what is the best way to teach spanish speaking kids to read/speak english.  I believe the jury is still out.

Click to expand...

My understanding is that there are a number of variables, but if you ignore the variables and just do one thing, immersion plus special tutoring in English seems to be the one that gets them up to speed the fastest.

This is a can of worms - that's for sure.

First of all, there are like 10 gazillion languages spoken on this planet. And, if a school system required the students to learn any second language, all the rest would be screaming, "What about me?! My language is just as important as all the others."

Of course, the ACLU and the trial lawyers would be getting involved at this point, filing one lawsuit after the next, representing each and every language, complaining about discrimination against any of the languages that were not reqired to be taught.

It would be a tort and injunction field day.

Today at 05:01 PM Brimshack said this in Post #33

Diné Bizaad is a beautiful language Dew, but learning the verb system is a cruel and unusual punishment if I've ever heard of such a thing.

Click to expand...

Brim,

I've tried a few times to pick even minute conversational Navajo, but with much frustration eventually leading to giving up.  I can't make my billigana (sp?) tongue do some of the things necessary.  I do know when I'm being called a few choice words, so that's a help...  

I've tried a few times too, but couldn't keep my schedule clear for it. I could learn the nouns, but the verbs are almost impossible. I have most of the sounds douwn, except I miss a lot of the tones, and I can't do t, followed by slash l, followed by a glottal stop. If I say it ten times, people will tell me I got it right once, but I won't know the difference.

It's bilagáana. …yeechaw!

Anyone tried Esperanto?

Can't say that I have. Did you make any headway in it?

ever try Quenya?