Today at 08:13 AM didaskalos said this in Post #22
Can God choose us, and then we refuse the selection?
Today at 08:29 PM Andrew said this in Post #25
Is all this theological arguing abt whether God chose us or we choose God or whether we CAN choose God or know that we CAN'T choose God etc etc etc really that crucial?
Today at 01:20 AM paulewog said this in Post #27
Actually, I think it IS rather ... important?
I mean, afterall, we're dealing with a lot of things here - Sovreignty of God, salvation, etc....
15th April 2003 at 04:29 AM Andrew said this in Post #25
Is all this theological arguing abt whether God chose us or we choose God or whether we CAN choose God or know that we CAN'T choose God etc etc etc really that crucial?
we shld just go out and preach the Gospel to every creature, him that believes saved, him that does not believe....(you know what happens).
those that are saved, just thank God for his mercy and grace for the rest of your life.
Yesterday at 06:48 PM Job_38 said this in Post #30
To have a correct view of who God is and who we are is a very large part of how we can grow with him.
Read the last sentance you wrote again. If I believe I gained that, how much pride will I have and how much this will get in the way. But when I come to the understanding that I have nothing to boast about, then it becomes, well, easier. No more struggling to understand passages that say God chooses us 'before the foundations of the Earth.' No longer must I twist passages to fit what I view as the right way.
Now to the second thing you wrote. How will we effectively preach the Gospel if we preach it incorrectly? But, even so, God will save who He will save. Because as we were dead in our sins, He still loved us and gave us a way out. There was no way I could have it.
This is why its important: Spiritual growth and a true understanding of who God is.
Thanks for listening to my spill.
10th April 2003 at 01:04 PM Quaffer said this in Post #6
I don't think I had any part in my salvation. I do believe though that I choose whether to walk in obedience to Him or not.
11th April 2003 at 12:15 AM Andrew said this in Post #8
that wld mean men are all just puppets, or that God created all pre-programmed robots. sounds like a very cold world.
11th April 2003 at 09:20 AM didaskalos said this in Post #9
I actually agree with both sides... yet both sides would likely disagree with me...
I think that the only way a person can be saved for God to draw them to Himself. He initates the action, and we can only respond.
Thing is, he is drawing all men to Himself, so the ball is really in our court.
We end up having to respond to the universal call.
I think the difference people have is in deciding who will respond and who will not. It seems one side is saying that God knows and so controls who will accept. The rejecters are lost causes so what is the use working with them. The other side says no. God knows, but has no part in the ulitimate decision as to who will accept and who will not.
I tend toward the latter. I think God knows... but it is not a "knowing" that lends itself to treating the accepters different from the rejecters. Jesus died for all... even the rejectors. He has taken away the sin of the world. This indicates God choose and made provision for all.
They just do not want Him.
SoccerAaron said:If it's our choice, we wouldn't choose God. Romans 3:10-12
paulewog said:As I said. Are we EVER going to understand this? Maybe, maybe not, but we sure won't with our minds the way they are.
How in the world can free will and sovreignty be coexistant?
"You have not chosen Me, but I have chosen you." That's a really important passage.
There are many that speak about predestination and many that spaek about out free-will. also known as, "rebellious will"
[/QUOTE]rnmomof7 said:I have two questions on this
I agree God initates the salvation of men , but if a man can refuse the grace ,does that mean that mans will is stronger than the grace of God?
2nd If God indeed desire that all (PAS) men (without exception) be drawn how do we explain the generations of men that never have heard the gospel..IF God desired them saved He with held the means of faith from them.
The bible says no men want Him
Was anyone saved at the cross?
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