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Suppose the woman, who now has no reproductive organs and has never really liked being a woman, decides to live the rest of her life as a man? Would you be able to refer to her at work as "he?"
Neither fashion, hairstyle, mannerisms, friend groups or partner choice are necessarily tied to sex nor secondary sex characteristics. They are obviously social and cultural constructs. Secondary sex characteristics are themselves only differentiated between the sexes by degree rather than existence/absence.
No, that is true. Sex is determined by gamete size and gamete motility.
Often enough, I said it happens when you don't have access to social or cultural factors. We all use them in our determination of appropriate pronouns if we have access to them, hence why pronouns are not tied to sex. We need to talk about what tied means in this context. Because the existence of language without gendered pronouns but with males and females, shows that there is no biological or necessary logical (in the academic meaning of logic) connection. So I guess what you mean is there is an empirical correlation between sex and pronoun use? Perhaps there are, but as I said each one of us don't have access to the biological sex of very many people. What we have access to is gender expression and some secondary sex characteristics (depending on setting, outdoors in winter you don't get see many of them). Or what do you mean with tied in this context?
So what is your take on those that are XY SRY negative or XX SRY positive?
They all go by external genitalia when doing sex determinations. And they go by gender expression when deciding on pronouns.
Yes. I think secondary sex characteristics help define the pronoun someone uses.Yes, but they all overlap between the sexes (yes, even breast tissue and facial hair). Without social cues like fashion, hairstyle, speech patterns, friend gruops, partner choice and mannerisms those lead people to guess wrongly quite often.
Many of the secondary sex characteristics are also amenable to medical or surgical interventions. Are those who say that sex is used to determine pronoun use saying that if the secondary sex characteristics line up well enough with their expectation then the preferred pronouns should be used? @RileyG ?
So the you can't change your sex crowd are not talking about secondary sex characteristics, I guess?
That is nice
My question was more like if a trans person "pass" (are seen as the gender they want to present by the general public) are they then entitled to using their preferred pronouns in your view? If yes, that is an argument for medical intervention. If no, why say it is about secondary sex characteristics at all?
This is hypothetical. There aren't any reliable studies that show this. There is a lot that isn't covered in a questionnaire. Often we cant even see the questionnaire. We dont know anything about the people. We have no idea what other comorbitities they have. No, sorry, this is not real scientific research. It's interesting. It is something to consider, but its not reliable.
No. Because she isn't. She can refer to herself as he, and other people can call her a he if they wish. But I'm not going to lie about it.
Yes they are. They are all tied to sex. Like I said, you could interchange the word sex and gender in everyone of those things and it would be the same.
Incorrect. We can atill do it abscent social or cultural factors. I could go to some primitive tribe in Africa or wherever and know absolutely nothing about their social or cultural factors and be able to determine if a person is male or female. So could you.
Yes we do. Every person we come in contact with has their sexual expression. There is no gender expression outside of their sex. They all have personalities. But ones personality is individual. But your personality does not determine your sex.
Is that a genetic norm or is that a genetic defect? And what does that have to do with people who are not that way and still believe they are the opposite sex?
No they don't because we havent always had our genitalia hanging out. When ancient tribes fought and tried to take each other's females they weren't running around checking everyone's genitalia. They could tell who was who.
No. That is just your assertion. So what gametes does fashion produce? Names can be gendered, but I have yet to see a sexed name. Names don't produce either gametes or have chromosomes.
If you show just one individual fully clothed that is not at all certain. If you can see more than one of them them you have access to some cultural and social factors.
Of course there is, gendered expressions are formed by both the individual and the society. If you just make assertions it is fair game for me to I guess?
Genetic norm is the phenotypic variance a single genotype express in different environments. What do you mean with a genetic norm?
I'm pretty sure that all over the world across up until the discovery of the mammalian ova sex determinations were done using external genitalia. No, I they used gender expression.
