Countering America’s “Establishment Revolution”

Vambram · Jun 9, 2024

Countering America’s “Establishment Revolution”

As America is increasingly crumbling in most every way all around us, it is up to those who know God—those whom He has put in office—to identify the cultural front battle lines, protect America from a debauched, aberrant “woke” morality, and fight with great boldness and courage to preserve our...

capmin.org

This is a very long, but also very interesting read. I hope that y'all may enjoy as well as be blessed by this article.

BCP1928 · Jun 9, 2024

Vambram said:
Countering America’s “Establishment Revolution”

As America is increasingly crumbling in most every way all around us, it is up to those who know God—those whom He has put in office—to identify the cultural front battle lines, protect America from a debauched, aberrant “woke” morality, and fight with great boldness and courage to preserve our...

capmin.org

This is a very long, but also very interesting read. I hope that y'all may enjoy as well as be blessed by this article.

Actually a pretty creepy read, but he appears to be telling us that the secret to slaying the Woke Monster can be found in the book of Joshua.

Vambram · Jun 9, 2024

BCP1928 said:
Actually a pretty creepy read, but he appears to be telling us that the secret to slaying the Woke Monster can be found in the book of Joshua.

In my opinion, there is nothing creepy at all in that article and that Bible study.

BCP1928 · Jun 9, 2024

Vambram said:
In my opinion, there is nothing creepy at all in that article and that Bible study.

It's interesting that he suggests that we evangelize and discipline the Civil Service. I know Christ told us to evangelize, but I don't recall anything about disciplining those we evangelize. That part was pretty creepy.

Vambram · Jun 9, 2024

BCP1928 said:
It's interesting that he suggests that we evangelize and discipline the Civil Service. I know Christ told us to evangelize, but I don't recall anything about disciplining those we evangelize. That part was pretty creepy.

It was probably a typo and the author meant to use the word, "disciple."

BCP1928 · Jun 9, 2024

Vambram said:
It was probably a typo and the author meant to use the word, "disciple."

Whatever. It's all just shouting at the Woke Monster anyway.

The IbanezerScrooge · Jun 9, 2024

Vambram said:
Countering America’s “Establishment Revolution”

As America is increasingly crumbling in most every way all around us, it is up to those who know God—those whom He has put in office—to identify the cultural front battle lines, protect America from a debauched, aberrant “woke” morality, and fight with great boldness and courage to preserve our...

capmin.org

This is a very long, but also very interesting read. I hope that y'all may enjoy as well as be blessed by this article.

This is religio-political propaganda. Borderline proselytization. Doesn't really belong here. You guys have your very own safe spaces to post this stuff and not get your feelings hurt by us posting what we actually think about it and risking getting banned.

Vambram · Jun 10, 2024

The IbanezerScrooge said:
This is religio-political propaganda. Borderline proselytization. Doesn't really belong here. You guys have your very own safe spaces to post this stuff and not get your feelings hurt by us posting what we actually think about it and risking getting banned.

Although this sub-forum is not designed for Christians only, I still do not have a problem with sharing different ideas from people with a Biblical world view concerning current events.

Bradskii · Jun 10, 2024

Vambram said:
Although this sub-forum is not designed for Christians only, I still do not have a problem with sharing different ideas from people with a Biblical world view concerning current events.

The biblical view in this case includes genocide. Joshua would be tried as a war criminal if what he did happened today. The author has a general whinge about morality at the end. How do you justify using a mass murderer as an example of someone we should look to for inspiration?

FireDragon76 · Jun 10, 2024

Theocratic fantasies being pushed by the small and cruel.

Fantine · Jun 10, 2024

Your Biblical worldview is incomplete when it ignores the principles of social justice Jesus spent his life promoting.

While he condemned the arrogant legalism of the Pharisees, he talked of the Good Samaritan. Who is my neighbor? The foreigner. Hmm.

He talked about respecting government-- render to Caesar-- not trying to overthrow it.

He talked about poverty dozens of times more than sexual sins.

So get your Biblical values straight and then we can talk.

It is sad to see how the secular humanists in Western Europe follow the spirit of Jesus' words more closely than American evangelicals.

FireDragon76 · Jun 10, 2024

Fantine said:
Your Biblical worldview is incomplete when it ignores the principles of social justice Jesus spent his life promoting.

While he condemned the arrogant legalism of the Pharisees, he talked of the Good Samaritan. Who is my neighbor? The foreigner. Hmm.

He talked about respecting government-- render to Caesar-- not trying to overthrow it.

He talked about poverty dozens of times more than sexual sins.

So get your Biblical values straight and then we can talk.

It is sad to see how the secular humanists in Western Europe follow the spirit of Jesus' words more closely than American evangelicals.

I am convinced the ethic of the New Testament has more in common with groups like the radical Franciscans, Anabaptists, Quakers, and Shakers than it does with what passes for the average American Evangelicals ethics. That's not to say I believe those groups were perfect, but it alot more faithful to the text, and what we know of the early Church based on outside sources.

What American Evangelicals embrace is alot more like a kind of caesaropapism of a reactionary, integralist or fundamentalist sort. It is very much fascinated with power, whereas I believe the early Christian movement was more like the opposite, a social revolution that rejected worldly power as an ordering principle.

durangodawood · Jun 10, 2024

Fantine said:
He talked about poverty dozens of times more than sexual sins.

Sexual sins: you are bad; you must change.

Poverty: we have problems; we should change.

You can see why moralists are more attracted to the former. It simply doesnt place demands on them (except in private, as we see over and over, but thats more easily ignored.)

FireDragon76 · Jun 10, 2024

durangodawood said:
Sexual sins: you are bad; you must change.

Poverty: we have problems; we should change.

You can see why moralists are more attracted to the former. It simply doesnt place demands on them (except in private, as we see over and over, but thats more easily ignored.)

I think that just shows how reductive the American Evangelical understanding of the Bible has been, and how much its captured American religious imagination and discourse. In reality, Jesus ministry involves reframing the inherited Axial Age notions of the proper ordering of human life- he suggests people can be closer to the Kingdom by forgoing marriage and traditional family ties, he's oblivious to "proper" gender roles and hierarchies, and he sees poverty as a blessing from God (even merely seeing poverty as a "problem" to be solved is relatively reductionist in comparison).

Hans Blaster · Jun 10, 2024

BCP1928 said:
Actually a pretty creepy read, but he appears to be telling us that the secret to slaying the Woke Monster can be found in the book of Joshua.

Agreed. I read the opening letter, but not the bible study. (The bible is boring.)

The whole notion of a ministry focused on government leaders is creepy. The letter also uses the "seven hills" (or mountains) notions tied to the NAR dominionist group.

iluvatar5150 · Jun 10, 2024

The IbanezerScrooge said:
This is religio-political propaganda. Borderline proselytization. Doesn't really belong here. You guys have your very own safe spaces to post this stuff and not get your feelings hurt by us posting what we actually think about it and risking getting banned.

I can go in there and tell them what I think of it. :-D

Hans Blaster said:
Agreed. I read the opening letter, but not the bible study. (The bible is boring.)

The opening letter is the only part that makes any sort of point. The "study" is just a bunch of rambling nonsense.

BCP1928 · Jun 10, 2024

FireDragon76 said:
I think that just shows how reductive the American Evangelical understanding of the Bible has been, and how much its captured American religious imagination and discourse. In reality, Jesus ministry involves reframing the inherited Axial Age notions of the proper ordering of human life- he suggests people can be closer to the Kingdom by forgoing marriage and traditional family ties, he's oblivious to "proper" gender roles and hierarchies, and he sees poverty as a blessing from God (even merely seeing poverty as a "problem" to be solved is relatively reductionist in comparison).

It occurred to me that what is happening is perfectly natural. When God turns against a nation, sending disasters and calamities, it's because He wants us to crack down on immorality. You can find it throughout the Bible and all the way up to blaming Hurricane Katrina on God's disfavor with gays.

durangodawood · Jun 10, 2024

FireDragon76 said:
I think that just shows how reductive the American Evangelical understanding of the Bible has been, and how much its captured American religious imagination and discourse. In reality, Jesus ministry involves reframing the inherited Axial Age notions of the proper ordering of human life- he suggests people can be closer to the Kingdom by forgoing marriage and traditional family ties, he's oblivious to "proper" gender roles and hierarchies, and he sees poverty as a blessing from God (even merely seeing poverty as a "problem" to be solved is relatively reductionist in comparison).

The job of Jesus is to save you, not to tell you how to live in the world among other people. Paul and the Old Testament have that 2nd job.

Thats the message I get from American Christians anyway.

FireDragon76 · Jun 10, 2024

durangodawood said:
The job of Jesus is to save you, not to tell you how to live in the world among other people. Paul and the Old Testament have that 2nd job.

Thats the message I get from American Christians anyway.

David Bentley Hart's reading of Paul is alot more coherent than what I hear out of Evangelicals. Paul is eschatological and mystical, and relatively disinterested in what Protestants think of as "justification" as separate from "sanctification".

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