Did Adam have Eternal Life Pre-Fall?

sawdust said:

A lot of what we have discussed regarding the Holy Spirit and His ministry is elementary and you think yourself a teacher of the word? I find that very disturbing.

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The Law and commandments, were given to lead you to the Cross.

Chaleb said:

The NT understanding of Eternal is "eternal life".

Jesus said....>"all that are water baptized, and keep all of the commandments and do penance, i give unto you eternal life".

Ummmm , NO.....that is not what JESUS said, but that is what a lot of people on this forum would teach as their : "Salvation".
And notice what is missing?
There is no CROSS in THEIR Salvation.

Make sure it's in yours Reader, or you wont be going to heaven when you die, as water baptism and law and commandments wont get you there.

So, Jesus said...>"All that believe in me, I give unto you, eternal Life, and you shall never perish".

Notice "never perish"<<.......so, that is the Eternal Life that is to be BORN AGAIN "In Christ"

Eternal Life, is not temporary. Its Spiritual.

To have Eternal life, is to be spiritually Joined to the CHRIST who Himself IS Eternal life.
Jesus is Eternal Life. Jesus said..>"i am THE way, THE Truth, and THE LIFE"... .See that Life? That is not going to end if you have it.
= as When you are joined to Him, by being BORN AGAIN....then this happens. = "Christ in you, the hope of Glory"... (Glory is heaven).

Also.....Notice that the born again are "seated in heavenly places"......"IN CHRIST"....... see that?
The born again are already there. "'IN Christ"

and notice this verse..

"As Jesus IS......so are the born again......IN THIS WORLD"...

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There are several scriptures that refute eternal security. In order to actually receive eternal life we must abide in Christ and endure to the end. John 15:1-7 is very strong evidence to support this. Then there’s also 2 Timothy 2:12. Eternal security was invented 500 years ago by the reformation and has been refuted by every single apostolic church. Furthermore there are no early church writings that support eternal security, in fact they actually support conditional salvation.

sawdust said:

The context when using the word eternal in the post you quoted was God's life. Are you suggesting God had a beginning?

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No it wasn’t it was in reference to Adam’s life not God’s.

GenemZ said:

​

Before the mountains were born or you brought forth the whole world, ​

from everlasting to everlasting you are God." Ps 90:2​

When its translated to say?.... 'from everlasting to everlasting..." That means to go back in time (everlasting), and forward in time (everlasting). Hence, having no beginning, having no end.

Abraham planted a tamarisk tree in Beersheba, and there he called
on the name of the LORD, the Eternal God. Gen 21:33​

Eternal is what God is. God had no beginning. He has no end! Everlasting to everlasting!

How some dictionaries may translate it? They can at times contain commonly accepted errors.

Why that happens?

The body of Christ is always LEARNING AND GROWING BEYOND what it was before.
Its just like a body matures and keeps changing with growth. Always something more to realize.

grace and peace ..................

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We weren’t talking about God the discussion is about Adam. The post I quoted was referring to Adam.

GenemZ said:

​

Before the mountains were born or you brought forth the whole world, ​

from everlasting to everlasting you are God." Ps 90:2​

When its translated to say?.... 'from everlasting to everlasting..." That means to go back in time (everlasting), and forward in time (everlasting). Hence, having no beginning, having no end.

Abraham planted a tamarisk tree in Beersheba, and there he called
on the name of the LORD, the Eternal God. Gen 21:33​

Eternal is what God is. God had no beginning. He has no end! Everlasting to everlasting!

How some dictionaries may translate it? They can at times contain commonly accepted errors.

Why that happens?

The body of Christ is always LEARNING AND GROWING BEYOND what it was before.
Its just like a body matures and keeps changing with growth. Always something more to realize.

grace and peace ..................

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That verse you quoted has nothing to do with the post I quoted.

BNR32FAN said:

There are several scriptures that refute eternal security. In order to actually receive eternal life we must abide in Christ and endure to the end. John 15:1-7 is very strong evidence to support this.

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Except that fact was that Jesus was teaching Jews as a rabbi, and was citing what they could know from the OT Scriptures.

It will be during the Tribulation of seven years that those who will endure to the end who will be saved.
They will be saved to enter the Millennium alive and with rejoicing!

Rightly dividing the Word of God is essential.

grace and peace ...................

BNR32FAN said:

We weren’t talking about God the discussion is about Adam. The post I quoted was referring to Adam.

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And it turned to God. Why? Because only God has eternal life. And, some here wrongly attributed eternal life to Adam when it was everlasting life Adam could have had if he did not sin and ate from the Tree of Life.

grace and peace ................

GenemZ said:

And it turned to God. Why? Because only God has eternal life. And, some here wrongly attributed eternal life to Adam when it was everlasting life Adam could have had if he did not sin and ate from the Tree of Life.

grace and peace ................

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The word eternal does not always mean without beginning or end. So according to the actual definition of the word eternal it can be correctly and accurately stated that Adam did have eternal life.

sawdust said:

You quoted post#424 where it was stated God had eternal life, Adam had everlasting life before he sinned. There was a distinction made between the two. Eternal life was in reference to God. You piped up with eternal doesn't always mean without beginning or end and as the post #424 was referencing God as having eternal life I asked the question as to whether you think God had a beginning.

So no, it wasn't in reference to Adam but to God.

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This was the first statement in that post.

“Adam would have had everlasting life. Not eternal life.”

This is the definition of the word eternal

1. Being without beginning or end: belief in an eternal creator.
2.
a. Continuing without interruption; perpetual: earned my eternal gratitude. See Synonyms at continual.
b. Seemingly endless; interminable: eternal waiting at the airport.
n.
1. Something timeless, uninterrupted, or endless: "Shall we speak of universals and eternals?" (Cynthia Ozick).
2. Eternal God. Used with the.

Here’s another one

1
a
: having infinite duration : EVERLASTING
eternal damnation

b
: of or relating to eternity
c
: characterized by abiding fellowship with God
good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?—Mark 10:17 (Revised Standard Version)


2
a
: continued without intermission : PERPETUAL
an eternal flame

b
: seemingly endless
eternal delays


3
archaic : INFERNAL
some eternal villain … devised this slander—William Shakespeare


4
: valid or existing at all times : TIMELESS

According to the definition of the word eternal it can be accurately stated that Adam had eternal life because the word eternal does not always refer to something or someone without a beginning.

GenemZ said:

Except that fact was that Jesus was teaching Jews as a rabbi, and was citing what they could know from the OT Scriptures.

It will be during the Tribulation of seven years that those who will endure to the end who will be saved.
They will be saved to enter the Millennium alive and with rejoicing!

Rightly dividing the Word of God is essential.

grace and peace ...................

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No He was telling them that if they turn away from Him that they will be cast away to wither and cast into the fire to be burned. Hence they would lose the salvation they would’ve received if they had remained in Him.

Just like what Paul said in 2 Timothy 2:12

“If we deny Him He will deny us”.

BNR32FAN said:

The word eternal does not always mean without beginning or end. So according to the actual definition of the word eternal it can be correctly and accurately stated that Adam did have eternal life.

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If you want to use the misunderstood term? Feel free.

But, define what you mean when you use it, so we will not confuse it with God's life.

BNR32FAN said:

No He was telling them that if they turn away from Him that they will be cast away to wither and cast into the fire to be burned. Hence they would lose the salvation they would’ve received if they had remained in Him.

Just like what Paul said in 2 Timothy 2:12

“If we deny Him He will deny us”.

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OK... stay in your "camp." Enjoy your campfire until the wood, hay, and stubble runs out....

He will deny us REWARDS if we deny Him before men.
Read 1 Cor 3:11-15 and see what I mean by what I stated.





What a terrible shame. Even a Christian who is total loser in failing to please Christ. And it says? He remains saved!

Can you read?

GenemZ said:

If you want to use the misunderstood term? Feel free.

But, define what you mean when you use it, so we will not confuse it with God's life.

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The same thing is written in the Greek manuscripts. Aionios is used to describe God’s infinity, His power, His glory, etc, ans well as our eternal life. Aionios, just like the word eternity, can mean something without beginning or end or something perpetual or everlasting. Is it really necessary to distinguish between the two definitions when referring to God or man? It’s blatantly obvious which definition should be applied in either case.

GenemZ said:

OK... stay in your "camp." Enjoy your campfire until the wood, hay, and stubble runs out....

He will deny us REWARDS if we deny Him before men.
Read 1 Cor 3:11-15 and see what I mean by what I stated.

For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. ​

If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, ​

their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be ​

revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. If what has ​

been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. If it is burned up, the builder will ​

suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.​

What a terrible shame. Even a Christian who is total loser in failing to please Christ. And it says? He remains saved!

Can you read?

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Jesus specifically stated exactly what He would do to those who deny Him.

“But whoever denies Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father who is in heaven.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭10‬:‭33‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

This is referring to our judgment on Judgement Day. Those whom Christ denies before The Father are cast into the lake of fire. 1 Corinthians 3:11-15 only refers to those who are actively “building on the foundation of Christ”. Are you suggesting that people who deny Him are building upon His foundation? The word Christian means “follower of Christ”. Anyone who denies Him is not following Him.

BNR32FAN said:

The same thing is written in the Greek manuscripts. Aionios is used to describe God’s infinity, His power, His glory, etc, ans well as our eternal life. Aionios, just like the word eternity, can mean something without beginning or end or something perpetual or everlasting. Is it really necessary to distinguish between the two definitions when referring to God or man? It’s blatantly obvious which definition should be applied in either case.

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Our eternal life is the state of our soul being baptized into His Life!!!!!!!!!!! Into Himself!

He gives us His Life to live in!

In eternity we will be always walking in God's life like we now walk in air on earth.

sawdust said:

The poster said God has eternal life. You want to throw in red herrings by saying eternal doesn't always mean without beginning or end even though the reference was to God's life. Fine play your games. See you on the other side.

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This is ridiculous, the poster also said that Adam did not have eternal live he had everlasting life. The point I was trying to make is that it is accurate and correct to say that Adam did have eternal life according to the definition of the word just like the Greek word aionios which has the exact same definition as the word eternity. Both can mean without beginning or end and both can mean without end. Aionios is the Greek word used in the Greek manuscripts to describe God’s power, His glory, His reign, and His existence. It’s also the same word used to describe the life we receive in Christ, eternal life or everlasting life, and it’s also used to describe the length of time the punishment for those who are condemned will endure. I don’t know why you persist in this argument when I’ve already provided the very definition of the word eternity. I even provided two examples of it and you obviously have the capability to search it for yourself to see that those definitions are in fact valid. So I don’t know why your persisting in this argument as if I were somehow implying that God is not eternal meaning He had a beginning which is an extremely obtuse way of perceiving what I wrote in that post and especially since I’ve already clarified my position on the matter. Are you here just to troll and start arguments or are you just too prideful to admit you made a mistake?

GenemZ said:

Our eternal life is the state of our soul being baptized into His Life!!!!!!!!!!! Into Himself!

He gives us His Life to live in!

In eternity we will be always walking in God's life like we now walk in air on earth.

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Uhuh and what about eternal punishment? Aionios kolasis. Or eternal sin? Aionios hamartēma. Are these examples of punishment with no beginning or sin with no beginning?

....

BNR32FAN said:

Uhuh and what about eternal punishment? Aionios kolasis. Or eternal sin? Aionios hamartēma. Are these examples of punishment with no beginning or sin with no beginning?

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Chapter and verses you are referring to, please?