Do you notice a lot of anger at God for a tragedy being the stumbling block for many non-believers today?

Richard.20.12 · Mar 7, 2023

I notice this an awful lot. Of course people have always used the "if there was a loving God He wouldn't have let this happen" excuse but it seems to be more common than ever today. It's probably because we have so much bad news every day because we have so much news in general so it's easy to see tragedy and especially "bad things happening to good people". But if God gave nice people an instant pass and nothing bad ever happened to them how fair would that be to the rest of the population? It has to rain on the just and the unjust for true equality. Anything else would require God's constant intervention which wouldn't be a free world really. Basically it's an excuse to turn away from who they need the most.

IoanC · Mar 7, 2023

The source of evil and tragedies is not God. God cannot overturn the laws of reality and causality because life would be abnormal and hard to understand. I think we often expect God to magically fix things, but if something is within our powers, it should remain so. As well, we seem to see God as being far away and accessible only through assiduous religion, when in fact He is constantly with us, residing in our hearts.

FireDragon76 · Mar 7, 2023

Richard.20.12 said:
I notice this an awful lot. Of course people have always used the "if there was a loving God He wouldn't have let this happen" excuse but it seems to be more common than ever today. It's probably because we have so much bad news every day because we have so much news in general so it's easy to see tragedy and especially "bad things happening to good people". But if God gave nice people an instant pass and nothing bad ever happened to them how fair would that be to the rest of the population? It has to rain on the just and the unjust for true equality. Anything else would require God's constant intervention which wouldn't be a free world really. Basically it's an excuse to turn away from who they need the most.

It's rarer than you think, at least in the US. New Atheism is a dying movement without any new ideas, I would describe most Gen Z and Millenials as increasingly "spiritual but not religious".

In the North American context, it's more like anger or disappointment and mistrust aimed at religion, similar to what happened in Europe nearly a century ago, and not exactly "anger at God".

Ceallaigh · Mar 7, 2023

When I was about 5 or 6 I was out with my mom and she lost her handbag and was upset. And I shook my fist at God. My mom said in an alarmed tone of concern, "don't be mad at God!". I don't think I ever been angry at God since then.

Blade · Mar 7, 2023

No can't say I have.

Richard.20.12 · Mar 7, 2023

IoanC said:
The source of evil and tragedies is not God. God cannot overturn the laws of reality and causality because life would be abnormal and hard to understand. I think we often expect God to magically fix things, but if something is within our powers, it should remain so. As well, we seem to see God as being far away and accessible only through assiduous religion, when in fact He is constantly with us, residing in our hearts.

Absolutely true. Good points! But remember this discussion is about tragedies which are usually far and away beyond our control. Like the death of someone very close, perhaps young, perhaps in an accident through no fault of their own or anyone else's. Those seem to illicit an anger towards the very entity they need the most. The irony is striking.

Really from birth to death we seem to be avidly seeking justification for not needing our Creator. Yet day after day this quest delivers very hollow and unfulfilling results. We stumble on and continue the madness instead of taking a step back, getting perspective away from all the busy noise of our lives, and try a new direction with a new focus with new goals.

Mark Quayle · Mar 23, 2023

Richard.20.12 said:
I notice this an awful lot. Of course people have always used the "if there was a loving God He wouldn't have let this happen" excuse but it seems to be more common than ever today. It's probably because we have so much bad news every day because we have so much news in general so it's easy to see tragedy and especially "bad things happening to good people". But if God gave nice people an instant pass and nothing bad ever happened to them how fair would that be to the rest of the population? It has to rain on the just and the unjust for true equality. Anything else would require God's constant intervention which wouldn't be a free world really. Basically it's an excuse to turn away from who they need the most.

There's also the tendency of people to think of themselves as individuals with the inherent right to be treated kindly, which is fed by many sources --everything from 'self-esteem' teaching to humanism.

A remark concerning "God's constant intervention": In reality, we don't know enough to be able to tell the difference between what we think falls out naturally, and God's constant intervention. That is, all reality can be "God intervening", yet we consider it as natural. To my mind, existence itself is miracle.

FireDragon76 · Mar 23, 2023

Mark Quayle said:
There's also the tendency of people to think of themselves as individuals with the inherent right to be treated kindly, which is fed by many sources --everything from 'self-esteem' teaching to humanism.

What's wrong with expecting kindness as normative, exactly?

Larniavc · Mar 23, 2023

Richard.20.12 said:
I notice this an awful lot. Of course people have always used the "if there was a loving God He wouldn't have let this happen" excuse but it seems to be more common than ever today. It's probably because we have so much bad news every day because we have so much news in general so it's easy to see tragedy and especially "bad things happening to good people". But if God gave nice people an instant pass and nothing bad ever happened to them how fair would that be to the rest of the population? It has to rain on the just and the unjust for true equality. Anything else would require God's constant intervention which wouldn't be a free world really. Basically it's an excuse to turn away from who they need the most.

Most of my friends are atheist and none of them are so because they are angry with God. How can you be angry with something you don’t believe exist?

I's2C · Mar 24, 2023

I posted this on another topic but it applys here too so will re-post. GOD laid down laws for us to fallow to be healthy, wealthy and wise. GOD never loses; its man that loses when they don’t do things HIS way. For instance GOD says if someone murders then send them to ME and I will deal with them. HE says if someone rapes and kills a child to send them to me because the one they murdered is waiting to meet them face to face. You want peace and prosperity in society than do it GODS way or you get the garbage we have now. When you do as HE says it ceases to be among us. But what have we allowed in our society? We allowed perversion to get a foot hold to now it is in our schools, our government. You can’t turn on a TV without seeing perverted confused people. We have the leader of the free world promoting perverted confused people to spread their filth where our children think its ok. GOD set laws to fallow but time after time HIS own children have rejected HIM, taking GOD out of everything where the void is filled by evil. GOD set a plan in motion and gave man the tools and a letter how too. GOD does not interfere in anyone’s life unless they ask but if the one asking does not live the way HE tells you, don’t expect any blessings. If GOD interfered than when time of judgement comes they will say “well you interfered”. To have a free will society with fair and equal justice than what GOD did for one HE would have to do for all and that would lead to dictatorship. GOD wants your love by you freely and willingly loving HIM. If HE ordered all to love HIM; HE might as well of just created robots. Your choice to except HIM or Satan.

SavedByGrace3 · Mar 24, 2023

We live in a creation of the possible. When God created all things, He instilled in these things both the right to exist and the right to interact with other things. A bit of His sovereignty, if you will. If this were not true, then the creation would be nothing but a streaming, outward manifestation of His thoughts and desires. By this we deduct that anything can happen in creation by default. God's actions in the universe are interventions. Salvation is an intervention against the fallen/falling nature of the universe. So too healing against the sick nature of creation and deliverance against the binding nature of creation. When God acts today, it is an intervention. He is not orchestrating every action in creation. Being angry at God is like being angry at the lifeguard who is saving you. The trouble is, being angry at God causes you to doubt God. As the OP states, unbelievers may be angry at God for the state of the world and their lives. This may be, in part, due to bad teaching by the church. The "God is in control of everything" dogma is behind this error. The atheist rightly states that "if there is a God and if He is in control of everything, then He is not very good at this control thing, or worse He is very good at it and what we are seeing what your God is really like!" It is either a failed attempt by an inept God, or the successful attempt by a evil God. I have heard some poor attempts by believers to defend this "God is in control of everything" false teaching.
Much more on this in the book "The 'God is in Control of Everything' Myth"

Mark Quayle · Mar 24, 2023

FireDragon76 said:
What's wrong with expecting kindness as normative, exactly?

Perhaps I didn't express that well. It should be normative, but to expect it from the creator, as though he owes it to us, is quite a bit beyond reasonable.

FireDragon76 · Mar 24, 2023

Mark Quayle said:
Perhaps I didn't express that well. It should be normative, but to expect it from the creator, as though he owes it to us, is quite a bit beyond reasonable.

1 John 4:8 says "God is love", so I don't think it's entirely unreasonable to expect kindness to be realistic for God.

seeking.IAM · Mar 24, 2023

If you are angry at God, you are not a non-believer.

Richard.20.12 · Mar 24, 2023

I's2C said:
I posted this on another topic but it applys here too so will re-post. GOD laid down laws for us to fallow to be healthy, wealthy and wise. GOD never loses; its man that loses when they don’t do things HIS way. For instance GOD says if someone murders then send them to ME and I will deal with them. HE says if someone rapes and kills a child to send them to me because the one they murdered is waiting to meet them face to face. You want peace and prosperity in society than do it GODS way or you get the garbage we have now. When you do as HE says it ceases to be among us. But what have we allowed in our society? We allowed perversion to get a foot hold to now it is in our schools, our government. You can’t turn on a TV without seeing perverted confused people. We have the leader of the free world promoting perverted confused people to spread their filth where our children think its ok. GOD set laws to fallow but time after time HIS own children have rejected HIM, taking GOD out of everything where the void is filled by evil. GOD set a plan in motion and gave man the tools and a letter how too. GOD does not interfere in anyone’s life unless they ask but if the one asking does not live the way HE tells you, don’t expect any blessings. If GOD interfered than when time of judgement comes they will say “well you interfered”. To have a free will society with fair and equal justice than what GOD did for one HE would have to do for all and that would lead to dictatorship. GOD wants your love by you freely and willingly loving HIM. If HE ordered all to love HIM; HE might as well of just created robots. Your choice to except HIM or Satan.

Sorry but you are not responding to the subject of this post at all. You're talking about our behavior, that which we can control. But I'm talking about things we can't control. Like your child is playing and hits their head against something rather hard causing brain damage. Or you're out driving with your family and you're sitting at a red light with cars in front and to your side and the drunk driver behind you passes out and plows into you killing everyone in the back seat. Or say terminal cancer that hits a young child. There are lots of instances where the rain falls on the just as well as the unjust.

Human nature usually wants to cast blame when we cry out in anguish, especially men. If there is no simple explanation they often blame God or at least blame Him for "letting it happen" ignoring the fact that challenging things happen to both the good and bad people of the world because we live in a complex world where a lot of different things can happen.

The challenge for a Christian is how to approach this extremely difficult topic, especially as the chances are we haven't experienced anything like this ourselves so we come from ignorance so they don't feel we have any right to even suggest anything to them.

Its a tough one.

I's2C · Mar 25, 2023

Richard.20.12 said:
Sorry but you are not responding to the subject of this post at all. You're talking about our behavior, that which we can control. But I'm talking about things we can't control. Like your child is playing and hits their head against something rather hard causing brain damage. Or you're out driving with your family and you're sitting at a red light with cars in front and to your side and the drunk driver behind you passes out and plows into you killing everyone in the back seat. Or say terminal cancer that hits a young child. There are lots of instances where the rain falls on the just as well as the unjust.

Human nature usually wants to cast blame when we cry out in anguish, especially men. If there is no simple explanation they often blame God or at least blame Him for "letting it happen" ignoring the fact that challenging things happen to both the good and bad people of the world because we live in a complex world where a lot of different things can happen.

The challenge for a Christian is how to approach this extremely difficult topic, especially as the chances are we haven't experienced anything like this ourselves so we come from ignorance so they don't feel we have any right to even suggest anything to them.

Its a tough one.

Dont get you saying it doesn't reply to subject? I was responding to the title without reading your post but now I have read your post and I basically said the same thing you said. May have a bit off topic but the whole point was man causes problems that could be avoided if fallowed GODS law. People keep blaming GOD when it is not GOD you should blame but man. Many things could have ceased among us if we just did things the way GOD tells us. JESUS taught us that accidents WILL happen for no other reason in the wrong place at wrong time. The story HE references in Lk 13:1-5; Is they were in wrong place at wrong time and everyone needs to be saved and repent often, for such accidents will happen. As far as you saying that someone being hit by a drunk driver- whose fought is that? there are laws on the books that if strictly fallowed the drunk driver would do it once either thrown and jail with strict laws or he will keep doing it. As far as children having cancer again; mans doing, they have polluted the earth so bad that people get cancer. GOD put scavengers on earth to clean up a lot of pollution but what does man do? They don't fallow GODS law and eat the scavengers GOD put on the earth to clean it up. Many things could of been avoided if we all fallowed GODS laws. Common sense can sway many things from happening, Take earthquake victims; If you build a house on a known fault line and a earthquake destroys and people in side die whose fought is that?. Accidents do happen but so many can be avoided by common sense and fallowing GODS laws.

peaceful-forest · Mar 25, 2023

I have certainly noticed this. I can't say if it's more common now than in previous years.

It's rooted in selfishness. Sometimes I get angry at God; and there have been times when I've thought about becoming a non-believer.

What bothers me is when it's a child that decides God isn't real. For example, I had an acquaintances years ago that told me that she was an atheist because there was one incident growing up where she didn't get her way; she was sent off to a religious school and she was mad that she couldn't be with her friends.

I think you just have to wonder about the mentality of some of these people.

Aussie Pete · Mar 26, 2023

Richard.20.12 said:
I notice this an awful lot. Of course people have always used the "if there was a loving God He wouldn't have let this happen" excuse but it seems to be more common than ever today. It's probably because we have so much bad news every day because we have so much news in general so it's easy to see tragedy and especially "bad things happening to good people". But if God gave nice people an instant pass and nothing bad ever happened to them how fair would that be to the rest of the population? It has to rain on the just and the unjust for true equality. Anything else would require God's constant intervention which wouldn't be a free world really. Basically it's an excuse to turn away from who they need the most.

There is nothing new about this. It's the go-to excuse for those who want to wallow in sin and rebellion. God does not have to intervene in human affairs. He leaves us to create our own disasters. (Romans 1)

The reason it more prevalent is because people increasingly turn away from God and reject His ways. They have to justify their conscience somehow, so they lie to themselves and slander God. Satan is happy to feed the flames of such wickedness. He incites people to rebel in the first place. There is no excuse. God has revealed Himself and demonstrated His love.

I tell those who raise this point that if God wanted to rid the world of evil, no one would be spared. God would have to kill everyone, starting with the person I'm talking to. The trouble is that everyone considers themselves to be "good". That's the first self-deception that has to be undone.

DragonFox91 · Mar 27, 2023

I’d say it’s more the rules that people don’t like.
I also think ‘science’ plays a huge role.
& believers that act hypocritical.

I’d place those 3 over ‘the problem of evil.’ ‘The problem of evil’ has existed for generations. But man walking away from religion in large numbers may be more new.

Unqualified · Apr 25, 2023

There are those who are mad at God because of a tragedy. I have heard them say they hate God. Say they contracted schizophrenia and it stole a successful life and left it scattered all over the city. It is very hard for anyone to understand even with faith. With faith you can get over your anger if you want to. But the bitter might always be bitter and have a hard time dealing with it.

Do you notice a lot of anger at God for a tragedy being the stumbling block for many non-believers today?

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