People in their 30's

Landon Caeli

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jan 8, 2016
15,455
5,824
46
CA
✟561,158.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
I remember when I was in my 30's. I was an irrational extremist, like most all 30-something's. I believed that only Catholics went to heaven, and that the American left was run by Freemasons. I talk to other 30-something's, and 9 times out of ten, they're quick to tell me how right they are about the world, and how wrong others are who disagree with them. So yes, I'm blowing the cover off the roof here, just like people do with Biden being "old". If ageism isn't a problem, then neither is "telling the truth" about 30-something's.

Here's an article that displays the 30-something brand of extremism:

 

SloopidyBoop

I love Jesus, family, reading, and working hard.
Feb 27, 2023
50
34
44
98225
✟10,308.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
There's something kinda liberating about knowing that I don't know everything.

I love talking to people who do know everything now. S'really fun.
 
Upvote 0

Neostarwcc

We are saved purely by the work and grace of God.
Supporter
Dec 13, 2015
5,229
4,189
37
US
✟909,984.00
Country
United States
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Idk I'm still in my 30s (36) and I didn't experience any social changes. I did become a Calvinist in my early 30s but it was my 20s that I was stuck up and out of touch in life. I was an atheist for most of my 20s and hated just near everyone. I grew up, humbled myself, and made major religious changes in my 30s.
 
Upvote 0

FireDragon76

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Apr 30, 2013
30,474
18,454
Orlando, Florida
✟1,249,090.00
Country
United States
Faith
United Ch. of Christ
Marital Status
Legal Union (Other)
Politics
US-Democrat
Unless Jesus had some supernatural intervention... it's unlikely he actually fasted for 40 days (in the same way he didn't see all the corners of the world on a high mountain). Some of the IRA prisoners died on hunger strikes well before then.

40 is a symbolic number in the Bible, it represents an ideal length of time. Jesus 40 day fast is meant to represent Israel's wandering in the wilderness for 40 years. The implication is that Jesus perfectly recapitulated Israel's journey in the desert.
 
Upvote 0

RileyG

Veteran
Angels Team
Feb 10, 2013
14,081
7,987
28
Nebraska
✟235,233.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Celibate
Politics
US-Republican
There's something kinda liberating about knowing that I don't know everything.

I love talking to people who do know everything now. S'really fun.
I'm in my late 20s and I agree completely. :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: SloopidyBoop
Upvote 0

SloopidyBoop

I love Jesus, family, reading, and working hard.
Feb 27, 2023
50
34
44
98225
✟10,308.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
I'm in my late 20s and I agree completely. :)
Now that I am in my 40's I just laugh maniacally and throw my hands up "I have no idea, maybe he knows he looks neat!"
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Landon Caeli
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Br4nd0n

1986
Mar 24, 2017
153
105
Canada
✟63,997.00
Country
Canada
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Stirring the pot hard
I remember when I was in my 30's. I was an irrational extremist, like most all 30-something's. I believed that only Catholics went to heaven, and that the American left was run by Freemasons. I talk to other 30-something's, and 9 times out of ten, they're quick to tell me how right they are about the world, and how wrong others are who disagree with them.
Im glad God delivered you from that delusion
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Landon Caeli
Upvote 0

timewerx

the village i--o--t--
Aug 31, 2012
15,202
5,877
✟296,775.00
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Single
Unless Jesus had some supernatural intervention... it's unlikely he actually fasted for 40 days (in the same way he didn't see all the corners of the world on a high mountain). Some of the IRA prisoners died on hunger strikes well before then.

40 is a symbolic number in the Bible, it represents an ideal length of time. Jesus 40 day fast is meant to represent Israel's wandering in the wilderness for 40 years. The implication is that Jesus perfectly recapitulated Israel's journey in the desert.

According to science, you can survive 3 weeks without food. I'll have to assume 3 weeks would be average or median.

If you have some sort of preparation or physical conditioning, I think you can push it all the way to 40 days. Jesus did have some conditioning as some verses tells us Jesus sometimes skips on meals. Jesus was also very physically fit as he often hiked in the wilderness and up the mountains. Skipping meals + lots of physical activity + lots of fish in diet suggests that Jesus would have 'ketogenic metabolism' - getting your body's energy needs through fat stored in the body instead of carbohydrates which is more energy efficient and the body becomes even more efficient in this metabolism mode the more you practice such lifestyle

If you live the kind of lifestyle Jesus lived, I think a 40 day fast is possible as the body is able achieve the highest level of efficiency using body fat as source of energy.

My thoughts hasn't changed much from my 30's. Though my principles have become more lenient but still quite unorthodox. People keep telling me to settle down so my mind would also settle down. But I prefer to keep my eyes open to possibilities. Still exploring the limits of our reality.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

FireDragon76

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Apr 30, 2013
30,474
18,454
Orlando, Florida
✟1,249,090.00
Country
United States
Faith
United Ch. of Christ
Marital Status
Legal Union (Other)
Politics
US-Democrat
According to science, you can survive 3 weeks without food. I'll have to assume 3 weeks would be average or median.

If you have some sort of preparation or physical conditioning, I think you can push it all the way to 40 days. Jesus did have some conditioning as some verses tells us Jesus sometimes skips on meals. Jesus was also very physically fit as he often hiked in the wilderness and up the mountains. Skipping meals + lots of physical activity + lots of fish in diet suggests that Jesus would have 'ketogenic metabolism' - getting your body's energy needs through fat stored in the body instead of carbohydrates which is more energy efficient and the body becomes even more efficient in this metabolism mode the more you practice such lifestyle

There's a conservative Evangelical apologist named David Wood who tried fasting for 40 days in prison on a dare. It he became ill, and he ended up in the infirmary with electrolyte imbalances.

If you don't eat for more than a day or so, you go into ketosis, regardless of your previous diet. Assuming no miracles, Jesus would have had to have quite a bit of body fat stored up to survive for 40 days without any food. His electrolytes would probably have been imbalanced, since you need those from food, too, as your body isn't completely efficient recycling them (and if he were sweating, it would be even worse). And in the desert, it would have been even worse in terms of electrolyte loss (soldiers that served in Iraq, for instance had to actually consume extra electrolytes because they lost water and electrolytes so fast, and it's common for cuisines that come from hot, tropical climates, such as India, to have quite a bit of salt, because people perspire so much).

That's why I think insisting on a literal reading of this story probably isn't wise (though it's possible, of course, it would be dangerous). The point is that Jesus was tempted by the seductions of greed, vanity, and power, and resisted them. Those things in the ancient world where the main temptations people faced that lead to violence and oppression.

What I think is more likely is that Jesus probably did fast after his baptism for a period of time, but we can't really know for sure how long, outside the story of his temptation, which is full of obvious symbolism. As a Jew, fasting on certain days would have been normal, anyways.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

timewerx

the village i--o--t--
Aug 31, 2012
15,202
5,877
✟296,775.00
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Single
There's a conservative Evangelical apologist named David Wood who tried fasting for 40 days in prison on a dare. It nearly killed him, and he ended up in the infirmary with electrolyte imbalances.

If you don't eat for more than a day or so, you go into ketosis, regardless of your previous diet. Assuming no miracles, Jesus would have had to have quite a bit of body fat stored up to survive for 40 days without any food. His electrolytes would probably have been imbalanced, since you need those from food, too, as your body isn't completely efficient recycling them (and if he were sweating, it would be even worse).

That's why I think a literal reading of this story doesn't seem likely (though it's possible, of course, it would be incredibly dangerous). The point is that Jesus was tempted by the seductions of greed, vanity, and power, and resisted them. Those things in the ancient world where the main temptations people faced that lead to violence and oppression.

What I think is more likely is that Jesus probably did fast after his baptism for a period of time, perhaps even in the desert. As a Jew, fasting on certain days would have been normal, anyways.

The Sea of Galilee although a freshwater lake and its water is drinkable, the salinity of the lake including the springs along its coast is significant. The water table around this area where people got their drinking water from is also a bit saline. In fact, a little bit too saline for irrigation.

If Jesus drank from these sources, it would have mitigated electrolyte imbalance due to the amount of sodium (through salt) and other minerals contained in these water sources.

Also while anyone can achieve ketosis during fasting, a person living a lifestyle that achieves ketosis on a daily basis would have superior physical adaptation to maximize energy utilization from body fat so they can get just as far with less fat.

I'm roughly living the lifestyle of Jesus. Daily intermittent fasting, limited food intake, and relatively large volume of physical activities being part of it. So I drink water with a little salt added in it the long periods between meals. Salted water helps immensely during the long periods without food. Helps fight off hunger, keeps your brain working 100%, and prevents fatigue. In time, I have acquired a taste and craving for salted water. It should taste a bit like milk but not any saltier.
 
Upvote 0

FireDragon76

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Apr 30, 2013
30,474
18,454
Orlando, Florida
✟1,249,090.00
Country
United States
Faith
United Ch. of Christ
Marital Status
Legal Union (Other)
Politics
US-Democrat
The Sea of Galilee although a freshwater lake and its water is drinkable, the salinity of the lake including the springs along its coast is significant. The water table around this area where people got their drinking water from is also a bit saline. In fact, a little bit too saline for irrigation.

If Jesus drank from these sources, it would have mitigated electrolyte imbalance due to the amount of sodium (through salt) and other minerals contained in these water sources.

Also while anyone can achieve ketosis during fasting, a person living a lifestyle that achieves ketosis on a daily basis would have superior physical adaptation to maximize energy utilization from body fat so they can get just as far with less fat.

I'm roughly living the lifestyle of Jesus. Daily intermittent fasting, limited food intake, and relatively large volume of physical activities being part of it. So I drink water with a little salt added in it the long periods between meals. Salted water helps immensely during the long periods without food. Helps fight off hunger, keeps your brain working 100%, and prevents fatigue. In time, I have acquired a taste and craving for salted water. It should taste a bit like milk but not any saltier.

Galilee isn't a desert, it has a Mediterranean climate. Some historians believe the desert being referenced in the Gospels is the Judean desert. Which is a very hostile place. You could die there fairly quickly.

The (in)famous Episcopalian Bishop James Pike, a controversialist and skeptic, travelled into the Judean desert in the late 60's in a car, on a personal religious pilgrimage with his wife, and they became lost after making a wrong turn. They separated after their car ran into trouble and they had to get out and search for help on foot. She escaped, but they only found his remains some time later. He probably became delirious looking for water in the intense heat.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

timewerx

the village i--o--t--
Aug 31, 2012
15,202
5,877
✟296,775.00
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Single
Galilee isn't a desert, it has a Mediterranean climate. Some historians believe the desert being referenced in the Gospels is the Judean desert. Which is a very hostile place. You could die there fairly quickly.

The (in)famous Episcopalian Bishop James Pike, a controversialist and skeptic, travelled into the Judean desert in the late 60's in a car, on a personal religious pilgrimage with his wife, and they became lost after making a wrong turn. They separated after their car ran into trouble and they had to get out and search for help on foot. She escaped, but they only found his remains some time later. He probably became delirious looking for water in the intense heat.

The Greek word used in Matthew 4:1 "erémos" doesn't exclusively mean a hot, sandy place nor a place with sparse vegetation and hot. The closest word in English would be "unpopulated" or even "remote". Even a deep, dark forest would fit the description if there's no one living, nor traveling within nor owning its land.

[2048 (érēmos) in the strict sense expresses a lack of population (not merely "sparse vegetation"). This root (erēmo-) does "not suggest absolute barrenness but unappropriated territory affording free range for shepherds and their flocks. Hepworth Dixon (The Holy Land) says, 'Even in the wilderness nature is not so stern as man. Here and there, in clefts and basins, and on the hillsides, grade on grade, you observe a patch of corn, a clump of olives, a single palm' " (WS, 22).]


Sometimes, the English translations can be misleading so I often double check their Greek or Hebrew word and the analysis of its meaning in English.

We often read Jesus in the Bible retreating to these places to pray or spend time with the animals. If there's lots of wildlife in there, then it can't be fully barren like a literally a place of endless sand dunes or rocky terrain without plant life. It can still be a desert but with some trees and shrubs where you can take shelter.

Besides, at the right time of the year in those regions, the climate can be pleasant and not too hot even in the midday sun in the desert and Jesus could have brought warmer clothing to deal with the cold at night.

In mild climates at the right seasons and place, a 40 day fast looks fairly survivable. There's nothing in the Bible that tells us the conditions are unfavorable for fasting. It only tells us that Jesus was commanded to go some place without people. It could even be a forest or desert or something in between.
 
Upvote 0

dzheremi

Coptic Orthodox non-Egyptian
Aug 27, 2014
13,500
13,648
✟426,076.00
Country
United States
Faith
Oriental Orthodox
Marital Status
Private
I turn 30 in about 3 years. I'm excited to see about what more in life I can learn. Hopefully I am not as ignorant as I am now ;)

If you're lucky, you'll find new things to be ignorant about. :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: SloopidyBoop
Upvote 0

FireDragon76

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Apr 30, 2013
30,474
18,454
Orlando, Florida
✟1,249,090.00
Country
United States
Faith
United Ch. of Christ
Marital Status
Legal Union (Other)
Politics
US-Democrat
The Greek word used in Matthew 4:1 "erémos" doesn't exclusively mean a hot, sandy place nor a place with sparse vegetation and hot. The closest word in English would be "unpopulated" or even "remote". Even a deep, dark forest would fit the description if there's no one living, nor traveling within nor owning its land.

[2048 (érēmos) in the strict sense expresses a lack of population (not merely "sparse vegetation"). This root (erēmo-) does "not suggest absolute barrenness but unappropriated territory affording free range for shepherds and their flocks. Hepworth Dixon (The Holy Land) says, 'Even in the wilderness nature is not so stern as man. Here and there, in clefts and basins, and on the hillsides, grade on grade, you observe a patch of corn, a clump of olives, a single palm' " (WS, 22).]


Sometimes, the English translations can be misleading so I often double check their Greek or Hebrew word and the analysis of its meaning in English.

We often read Jesus in the Bible retreating to these places to pray or spend time with the animals. If there's lots of wildlife in there, then it can't be fully barren like a literally a place of endless sand dunes or rocky terrain without plant life. It can still be a desert but with some trees and shrubs where you can take shelter.

Besides, at the right time of the year in those regions, the climate can be pleasant and not too hot even in the midday sun in the desert and Jesus could have brought warmer clothing to deal with the cold at night.

In mild climates at the right seasons and place, a 40 day fast looks fairly survivable. There's nothing in the Bible that tells us the conditions are unfavorable for fasting. It only tells us that Jesus was commanded to go some place without people. It could even be a forest or desert or something in between.

People actually do live in the Judean desert, there are monasteries there, and there are also oases (like Ein Gedi, near the Dead Sea). The Qumran community of the Essenes was also located there, and it's where the Dead Sea Scrolls were found back in the 40's. Sporadic vegetation also exists. But it's still a hostile place, not a place you'ld just wander around casually.

My main concern is, "Don't try this at home, kids", not in historical quibbles. People have died attempting to imitate the 40-day fast and wanderings in the desert, inspired by religious zeal and not taking heed of the dangers.
 
Upvote 0

timewerx

the village i--o--t--
Aug 31, 2012
15,202
5,877
✟296,775.00
Faith
Christian Seeker
Marital Status
Single
People actually do live in the Judean desert, there are monasteries there, and there are also oases (like Ein Gedi, near the Dead Sea). The Qumran community of the Essenes was also located there, and it's where the Dead Sea Scrolls were found back in the 40's. Sporadic vegetation also exists. But it's still a hostile place, not a place you'ld just wander around casually.

My main concern is, "Don't try this at home, kids", not in historical quibbles. People have died attempting to imitate the 40-day fast and wanderings in the desert, inspired by religious zeal and not taking heed of the dangers.

If you wish to dissuade anyone from doing a 40-day fast. I totally understand your pure and good intentions. Feel free to do so.

But you have to understand "erémos" in Matthew 4:1 is not exclusively a desert which brings up the possibility that Jesus literally did a 40-day fast in a more hospitable but otherwise, unpopulated environment. Do not allow your intentions to discourage people against 40 day fasts from influencing your interpretation of Matthew 4:1. As you are starting to sound like a skeptic.

There's quite a few ways Jesus would have done it and survive even if He didn't use His powers of healing.

There's lots of areas around the Sea of Galilee that can be called "erémos". The ground water in these areas is a bit salty. Not too salty to drink but too salty for irrigation. If Jesus drank from springs sourced from these ground water, He would be getting sufficient electrolytes, at least enough to last Him 40 days.

People who were dying doing 40 day fast is either not drinking or not taking electrolytes or both. And as you said, also wandering the desert. Like you, they probably assumed that "erémos" is a desert, not possibly a place with plenty of vegetation, trees, and a pleasant climate. They also probably assumed that Jesus did not drink water nor any liquids at all (The Bible did not explicitly mentioned it). And they didn't know the areas where Jesus could have gotten water contains good amount of electrolytes. A little learning can be a dangerous thing!
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Blade

Veteran
Supporter
Dec 29, 2002
8,165
3,989
USA
✟629,996.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
You know about two days ago I said to my wife....we were talking about something I said your 45! She laughs says "as if 45 is young". To that I said "yeah hello were in our 60's" haha. Now I LOOK old gray blah blah blah her? Shes Chinese (1st gen meaning born here) so yeah no gray hair looks young.. going to go cry now.. haha
 
Upvote 0