How to prove that GOD exists from a scientific point of view?

Tinker Grey said:

I was a Christian for 44 years. My last few years will filled with tears and turmoil begging God to reveal himself. You know what I got? Silence.

And if you are going to respond that I wasn't doing it right, don't.

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I'm sorry that this was your experience... I don’t exactly know how it works, all I know is from my own experience I was in a very dark place and my question to God was "what's the point of my life"? I didn't ask him to reveal himself, I earnestly was over life and the world and myself that I was at the end. He was the one I turned to at last.... I think this is what scripture means that we have to come to "the end of ourselves" before the Lord will truly step in and show us HE is the only way to true life.

I know you might not want to hear it, but I will pray for your eyes to be opened to the truth of Jesus... I never prayed much growing up but when I did, God never really answered my prayers either. I think this is his way - he waits for us to get to a certain point, where we understand we have no hope of anyone saving us and realise we can no longer try to save ourselves either.

Estrid said:

It's the other way around. People who
look at everything and think they are
seeing "god" have their eyeballs looking
back at their own lil brains

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Do you see (and hear) God in the greeting, "Merry Christmas"?

Pipp@ said:

I'm sorry that this was your experience... I don’t exactly know how it works, all I know is from my own experience I was in a very dark place and my question to God was "what's the point of my life"? I didn't ask him to reveal himself, I earnestly was over life and the world and myself that I was at the end. He was the one I turned to at last.... I think this is what scripture means that we have to come to "the end of ourselves" before the Lord will truly step in and show us HE is the only way to true life.

I know you might not want to hear it, but I will pray for your eyes to be opened to the truth of Jesus... I never prayed much growing up but when I did, God never really answered my prayers either. I think this is his way - he waits for us to get to a certain point, where we understand we have no hope of anyone saving us and realise we can no longer try to save ourselves either.

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You might reconsider your "guarantee".

Pipp@ said:

Who's dominating?

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I am not 'dead in transgressions and sin' now .. and neither was I, before being dominated and forced into 'coming to Christ' when I was a child.
Telling people they're 'dead in transgressions and sin' is part of 'domination racketeering' and is acted out by those who feel insecure about themselves and serves only one selfish purpose of giving them a 'buzz' (at the expense of others).
(Its hard to think of a bigger 'sin' that that, actually).

Tinker Grey said:

You might reconsider your "guarantee".

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It's not my guarantee it's HIS.

SelfSim said:

I am not 'dead in transgressions and sin' now .. and neither was I, before being dominated and forced into 'coming to Christ' when I was a child.
Telling people they're 'dead in transgressions and sin' is part of 'domination racketeering' and is acted out by those who feel insecure about themselves and serves only one selfish purpose of giving them a 'buzz' (at the expense of others).
(Its hard to think of a bigger 'sin' that that, actually).

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OK now I understand your reservations...
I completely understand where you're coming from because I was also "forced" into religious ideology as a child. I ended up with my own beliefs about what and who I thought God was, but I eventually was shown the truth when I truly humbled myself.

People don't like to hear it, but the traditional church as humans have created it to be was never Gods intention. HE hated religious hypocrisy. This is why Jesus came into the world, to reveal to us the error of our ways and the truth about HIM and what it is supposed to look like when we follow Gods design as he intended it from the beginning.

That being said, we're not supposed to apply the bible to our lives and follow Jesus' "example", we're meant to have a relationship with him via the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, to surrender to Gods will so we can be sanctified and conformed to the image of his Son.

Pipp@ said:

It's not my guarantee it's HIS.

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Allegedly.

Kylie said:

Allegedly.

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I find it fascinating that there are non-believers on a Christian website trying to discredit the Bible...

Tell me, do you also troll sites dedicated to other religions? No, I doubt you would because they don't challenge the internal dialogue in the same way do they. Isn't that interesting.

Pipp@ said:

I find it fascinating that there are non-believers on a Christian website trying to discredit the Bible...

Tell me, do you also troll sites dedicated to other religions? No, I doubt you would because they don't challenge the internal dialogue in the same way do they. Isn't that interesting.

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we're just hanging out waiting for scientific evidence for god.

Hans Blaster said:

we're just hanging out waiting for scientific evidence for god.

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Who knows, maybe one of these days your eyes will be opened to the truth and you won't have to rely on your mind or science to "work it all out" or "provide evidence"...it's this side of human nature we all struggle with. (The ego self).

Pipp@ said:

Who knows, maybe one of these days your eyes will be opened to the truth and you won't have to rely on your mind or science to "work it all out" or "provide evidence"...it's this side of human nature we all struggle with. (The ego self).

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Seems a rather unreliable path to not have evidence or hypothesis testing.

You claimed we were here to "discredit the bible". I am not. I don't think Kylie is either. Nor are we here for "trolling". I (in particular) am here to discuss science and in this thread, alleged scientific evidence for god. If your bible has science in it, then we can discuss that. Otherwise I'm not sure of what use it will be in this thread.

Hans Blaster said:

Seems a rather unreliable path to not have evidence or hypothesis testing.

You claimed we were here to "discredit the bible". I am not. I don't think Kylie is either. Nor are we here for "trolling". I (in particular) am here to discuss science and in this thread, alleged scientific evidence for god. If your bible has science in it, then we can discuss that. Otherwise I'm not sure of what use it will be in this thread.

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Regardless of what the discussions are, you're still on a Christian forum.
Perhaps find a separate forum that discusses scientific evidence for God if you don't like the bible being mentioned? But of course God works in mysterious ways and his drawing of people to him is not always in the obvious ways.

Peace

FrumiousBandersnatch said:

OK, let me put it this way - consciousness creates subjective reality, not objective reality. Knowledge (what we think we know) is fundamental to our subjective reality (i.e. our internal model).

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Can you elaborate. So if consciousness creates subjective reality what creates objective reality. And how do we know that objective reality is not really minds way of understanding the interface of something deeper. Maybe knowledge is fundamental to reality full stop. It comes before ontology. We know reality directly through our conscious experience before we create any models. That's when the subjective creeps in to ad their ideas. The level of knowledge one has and the type of knowledge one chooses to have determines reality.

FrumiousBandersnatch said:

Sorry, that seems quite incoherent. A Boltzmann brain is necessarily conscious - that's the whole point of it. The observer effect is dependent on observers, it doesn't create them.

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But it seems the defining feature of consciousness is assumed into the Boltzmann brain on a material view. If Boltzmann brains don't create consciousness then where did that consciousness come from. It seems the universe would have been programmed to create a Boltzmann brain but not consciousness as that is beyond any natural process.

Hans Blaster said:

we're just hanging out waiting for scientific evidence for god.

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lol as if that is ever going to happen.

Estrid said:

It's the other way around. People who
look at everything and think they are
seeing "god" have their eyeballs looking
back at their own lil brains

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Ah that's all we have our own direct experience and Minds. I think it could be quite possible that the materialist view has it back the front. Its not the material/objective world that is fundamental, its consciousness and Mind. They come before objective reality.

As well, I think God is above science and this world. Religion is based on Revelation and Grace. Human efforts alone are not sufficient in order to know God and His Will. Science or any human field cannot go out of themselves in order to reach God. Prayer, Faith , Hope, Love are closer ways perhaps to finding God and His Will.

Pipp@ said:

It's not my guarantee it's HIS.

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Odd. You literally said 'I guarantee':

Pipp@ said:

Do your own seeking, I guarantee for those with a heart earnestly seeking the Lord, he will reveal himself.

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Tinker Grey said:

Odd. You literally said 'I guarantee':

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Yes because the Cross is Gods guarantee of Salvation to those who believe in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior.
I said if a person has the right heart posture toward God (seeking to know HIM and the truth) he will reveal himself to them.

Acts 17:27

27 “His purpose was for the nations to seek after God and perhaps feel their way toward him and find him—though he is not far from any one of us.

Matthew 11:27

27 “My Father has entrusted everything to me. No one truly knows the Son except the Father, and no one truly knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.”

Hans Blaster said:

we're just hanging out waiting for scientific evidence for god.

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That's the problem, though, Hans.......... when it comes, you might not like what you find.

Moreover, what I find interesting is that so many of you Ex-Christians who are waiting for scientific evidence are also the ones who formerly hail from evangelical/fundamentalist backgrounds. It's almost like many Ex-Christians have been essentially setup (by their respective denominations) to be disappointed ...

Tinker Grey said:

I was a Christian for 44 years. My last few years will filled with tears and turmoil begging God to reveal himself. You know what I got? Silence.

And if you are going to respond that I wasn't doing it right, don't.

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A lot of us (and I'd surmise that most of us) have gotten "silence" in one way or another, Tinker. I can understand the angst in that.