Would you ever vote for a lawmaker who supports murdering babies?

BNR32FAN said:

There’s a lot of ignorance or I should say intentional obtuseness in this post. Premarital sex does not cause the death of an innocent human being it actually causes the exact opposite of death. The death penalty is not the killing of an innocent person. War is typically the result of murder where one country is attacked and innocent people are killed that escalates to war. Murder is the intentional killing of an innocent person not an accidental killing of an innocent person. Selling tobacco products isn’t forcing anyone to buy them. None of your examples here make any sense whatsoever in the defense against abortion.

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If Jesus taught you should turn the other cheek and not resist evil, how is war innocence? Russians and Ukrainians are intentionally killing each other. According to your definition is that murder?

Offering abortion in the case of an ectopic pregnancy where the mother’s life is threatened is not forcing people to have abortions. In one case fornication killed the mother, the baby did not survive either. One may not assume the fetus is any more innocent than the mother. Some fetuses will grow up to become good and others bad. A child born of rape or premarital sex is not as likely to succeed. This is why Paul preached against fornication.

Most couples do not need abortions, with or without a law against it.

The premise that premarital sex resulting in the conception of life is beautiful is not valid when it was rape, incest or otherwise against the will of God. Single mothers are forced to raise children they did not ask for. Children born to prostitutes are less likely to succeed. Prostitution is illegal.

Roymond said:

Perhaps more to the point, what sacrifice is TK willing to make to help that mother? Anyone who isn't actively giving to some organization that helps expectant mothers to afford to have and raise the unborn and is claiming to be "pro-life" is a hypocrite -- that's not pro-kife, it's just pro-birth.

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I pay taxes. Perhaps more to the point, what are you going to say to God when you are responsible for supporting the murder of innocent babies?

David_S42 said:

Why should government be involve in “social program”, because you want government to force woman to have baby.

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And you think no social programs will be necessary as long as abortion is allowed? You realize, I hope, that the government funds planned parenthood, right? That abortion, in that sense, IS a government program? You can't really eliminate government programs by replacing them with other government programs.

David_S42 said:

This is where evangelical GOP completely contradict themselves. They keep saying government has no business with social welfare to help people, but they want government to enforce “a religious belief” to her citizen. If you think government has no business helping mothers then government has no business imposing your faith and morality on citizen, you can practice morality and your faith at your home and church. Leave rest of us alone.

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Aren't you the one that wants me to practice your faith and morality by forcing me to pay taxes to support your chosen government programs? And do you know what happens when I decide not to pay those taxes? Anti-tax-evader police come with guns to force me to pay taxes -- most of which will be used to impose your morality on me. Why don't you just practice your faith and morality at home and at church, hmmm?

David_S42 said:

You claim to be “pro-life” but you want to execute everyone who disagree with you.

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You're saying that rapists should live and babies should die? Are you hearing yourself?

David_S42 said:

You want to execute people for rape, you want to execute people for having sex outside wedlock. Most Americans don’t want to turn America into Pakistan and make Biblical version of Sharia law as the law of the land.

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And that makes you right, because most of the people disagree with me? I guess God was wrong to wipe out almost the whole human race with a flood.

Have you considered what God wants?
Thou shall not murder.
Thou shall not commit adultery.
Thou shall not steal.
Thou shall not even covet, "lust after", your neighbor's wife.
These things are described by Jesus as "loving your neighbor as yourself." Yet you claim Jesus wanted to implement Sharia law? Are you sure you are actually a believer in what Jesus said?

David_S42 said:

Malachi 2:16 - "For I hate divorce,” says the Lord, the God of Israel . Should we ban divorce and make it illegal?

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No Fault Divorce should be banned. Our society was much better off before it.

David_S42 said:

Amos 5:21 - “I hate, I reject your festivals, Nor do I delight in your solemn assemblies." Should we make thanksgiving illegal?

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Context? Does God just hate festivals? I don't think so.

Torah Keeper said:

I pay taxes. Perhaps more to the point, what are you going to say to God when you are responsible for supporting the murder of innocent babies?

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Jesus wouldn’t ask your voting record about abortion but he will ask “ did you give food to the hungry, did you give water to the thirsty, did you give shelter to a stranger, did you give cloth to someone who needed cloths, did you look after the sick, did visit those criminal in prison”?

Matthew 25:31-40
“When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his throne in heavenly glory. All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

“Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, “I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

“Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

“The King will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.” (NIV)

David_S42 said:

Amos 5:21 - “I hate, I reject your festivals, Nor do I delight in your solemn assemblies." Should we make thanksgiving illegal?

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You misunderstand this verse. It has nothing to do with Thanksgiving. It was because the Israelites had turned the Holy Festivals into festivals of demon worship. Please read Ezekiel for a better understanding, especially chapter 9. After the return from Babylon, the Holy Festivals were reinstated. These same Festivals continue to be observed today as commanded by Yahweh.

David_S42 said:

CPCs are NPO which ...

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Enough of the Planned Parenthood Leetspeak already. Please. It's too much.

David_S42 said:

But if you want Government to force woman to give birth then Government needs to have their own program to support these women funded by taxpayer. You want to be pro-life and force your “belief system” to others, great , pay higher taxes to support these programs. If you are not willing to pay higher taxes, then go practice your morality at your home and church and leave rest of us alone.

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No government 'forces' any woman to give birth. Giving birth is a common sequel to a woman becoming pregnant. And no government is going around inseminating women, forcing them to become pregnant. However they got pregnant, the government didn't do it.

Some women actually DO have the means to raise children and do not need government assistance for eighteen years to raise them. Those that do not have the means for the most part are already connected to social welfare programs to assist them. These exist now, and have bipartisan support.

It is a fable that a woman is forced to give birth and a fable that there are no taxpayer funded programs already in existence to support needy mothers.

David_S42 said:

Jesus wouldn’t ask your voting record about abortion but he will ask “ did you give food to the hungry, did you give water to the thirsty, did you give shelter to a stranger, did you give cloth to someone who needed cloths, did you look after the sick, did visit those criminal in prison”?

Matthew 25:31-40
“When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his throne in heavenly glory. All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

“Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, “I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

“Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

“The King will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.” (NIV)

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Murder is Murder and to vote for it is to take part of it.
Evil is evil continually.
Complicity in SIN makes us accountable for those who commit those SINS,
best not to vote at all but to rebuke it and be done.
we're called to be set apart from the world,
not partake of the evils therein, best to repent and turn from something than risk it

Derf said:

And you think no social programs will be necessary as long as abortion is allowed? You realize, I hope, that the government funds planned parenthood, right? That abortion, in that sense, IS a government program? You can't really eliminate government programs by replacing them with other government programs.

Aren't you the one that wants me to practice your faith and morality by forcing me to pay taxes to support your chosen government programs? And do you know what happens when I decide not to pay those taxes? Anti-tax-evader police come with guns to force me to pay taxes -- most of which will be used to impose your morality on me. Why don't you just practice your faith and morality at home and at church, hmmm?

You're saying that rapists should live and babies should die? Are you hearing yourself?

And that makes you right, because most of the people disagree with me? I guess God was wrong to wipe out almost the whole human race with a flood.

Have you considered what God wants?
Thou shall not murder.
Thou shall not commit adultery.
Thou shall not steal.
Thou shall not even covet, "lust after", your neighbor's wife.
These things are described by Jesus as "loving your neighbor as yourself." Yet you claim Jesus wanted to implement Sharia law? Are you sure you are actually a believer in what Jesus said?

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Question my faith, may be read the TOS of the forum.
Have a nice day,

David_S42 said:

“The King will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.” (NIV)

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What have you done practically for the least of these brothers, the smallest human beings, other than deny their humanity and justify their being killed?

chevyontheriver said:

What have you done practically for the least of these brothers, the smallest human beings, other than deny their humanity and justify their being killed?

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That is exactly the point some of us are trying to make, You want to make abortion illegal and force mother to have baby. But then what? What is the next step? What kind of social program do you support so the mother can take care the baby? If we think just forcing people to give birth, and then we can wash our hand and think “ we did our part for the smallest human being” then it is not taking care “one of the least of these brothers” or taking care the poor, give water to the thirsty or cloth them those who are naked. Most GOP politicians might be pro-life , but that’s it. They don’t support universal health care or paid family leave or free education, none of the policy to help the needy, or poor or those who are in prison. None of the GOP policy to help the foreigner or widow. It is like a empty brass making empty noise “ saving the unborn.. protecting baby from killer”. At the end the Lord will say “ I never knew you”

dqhall said:

If Jesus taught you should turn the other cheek and not resist evil, how is war innocence? Russians and Ukrainians are intentionally killing each other. According to your definition is that murder?

Offering abortion in the case of an ectopic pregnancy where the mother’s life is threatened is not forcing people to have abortions. In one case fornication killed the mother, the baby did not survive either. One may not assume the fetus is any more innocent than the mother. Some fetuses will grow up to become good and others bad. A child born of rape or premarital sex is not as likely to succeed. This is why Paul preached against fornication.

Most couples do not need abortions, with or without a law against it.

The premise that premarital sex resulting in the conception of life is beautiful is not valid when it was rape, incest or otherwise against the will of God. Single mothers are forced to raise children they did not ask for. Children born to prostitutes are less likely to succeed. Prostitution is illegal.

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I can’t count how many times you wrong in this post. It’s just like your last post where literally EVERY SINGLE SENTENCE is incorrect. First of all I never said war is innocent I said war is often the result of the killing of the innocent where typically one side is attacked and innocent lives are lost then they retaliate and now you have a war. Yes Jesus advocated forgiveness, He didn’t however say that we must stand by idol while innocent people are being killed nor did He say that we should allow an attacker to kill us. As for the war between Ukraine and Russia I don’t know how it got started. As for the mother who’s life may be in danger or the pregnancy that is a result of incest or rape their fate is in God’s hands whatever that may be. Every fetus is innocent because they are incapable of sin before they are born. And no that has nothing to do with why Paul preached against fornication, and by the way the word fornication means sexual immorality not just premarital sex. Paul taught against sexual immorality because it is a commandment of God. Single mothers are absolutely not forced to raise unwanted children that’s why they have adoption centers all over the country.

David_S42 said:

That is exactly the point some of us are trying to make,

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You dodged answering my question.

David_S42 said:

You want to make abortion illegal and force mother to have baby. But then what? What is the next step? What kind of social program do you support so the mother can take care the baby?

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So it's all about government programs? You can claim there are not enough government programs and until there are enough to suit your fancy you can comfortably support abortion? There are all sorts of government programs already in existence.

David_S42 said:

If we think just forcing people to give birth, and then we can wash our hand and think “ we did our part for the smallest human being” then it is not taking care “one of the least of these brothers” or taking care the poor, give water to the thirsty or cloth them those who are naked.

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How does supporting the offing of any innocent human beings equate to taking care of “one of the least of these brothers”?

David_S42 said:

Most GOP politicians might be pro-life , but that’s it. They don’t support universal health care or paid family leave or free education, none of the policy to help the needy, or poor or those who are in prison. None of the GOP policy to help the foreigner or widow. It is like a empty brass making empty noise “ saving the unborn.. protecting baby from killer”.

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I'm not GOP. You make this political. And then you have the oh so correct politics to be proud of. Do you do anything for the poor or just push for government programs? And complain about the GOP? Such politicking solves nothing and helps nobody.

David_S42 said:

At the end the Lord will say “ I never knew you”

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The sheep and the goats, the Democrats and the Republicans, the pushers of government programs vs the heartless? I don't think it's that simple. But I wonder how you exclude the tiniest human beings from “one of the least of these brothers”? You have implied that I will hear "I never knew you”. Are you so sure?

David_S42 said:

“ I never knew you”

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That's more likely to be heard if someone doesn't obey his voice and have a genuine relationship with him.
He doesn't condone murder as that violates one of the 10 commandments of Almighty GOD.
the Supreme Authority and Absolute Sovereign of all Creation.

David_S42 said:

Exodus 21 12-35 is about “ personal injury” including if someone harm a unborn baby. It’s not about abortion. The same passage says “If a bull gores a man or woman to death, the bull is to be stoned to death,”.

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The point of quoting that passage was to indicate that God is opposed to harming unborn infants.

David_S42 said:

Those laws were given by God in O.T, but then when His Son came down on earth he teach “You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’[a] 39 But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. 40 And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well.”

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Your comparing a slap on the cheek to the murder of an innocent infant. I notice you declined to comment on the other two verses pertaining to killing the innocent.

David_S42 said:

If we still practice “eye for an eye” and “ tooth for tooth” then Christ died on the cross for in vain

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Christ died to pay for our sins, that has nothing to do with the punishment of the wicked according to the law. Should murderers, rapists, thrives, etc be pardoned of the crimes based solely on Christ’s sacrifice?

David_S42 said:

That is exactly the point some of us are trying to make, You want to make abortion illegal and force mother to have baby. But then what? What is the next step? What kind of social program do you support so the mother can take care the baby? If we think just forcing people to give birth, and then we can wash our hand and think “ we did our part for the smallest human being” then it is not taking care “one of the least of these brothers” or taking care the poor, give water to the thirsty or cloth them those who are naked. Most GOP politicians might be pro-life , but that’s it. They don’t support universal health care or paid family leave or free education, none of the policy to help the needy, or poor or those who are in prison. None of the GOP policy to help the foreigner or widow. It is like a empty brass making empty noise “ saving the unborn.. protecting baby from killer”. At the end the Lord will say “ I never knew you”

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Adoption center.

David_S42 said:

Question my faith, may be read the TOS of the forum.
Have a nice day,

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I wasn't questioning your faith so much as your faithfulness to Jesus' teachings. Jesus was the one that applied it to whether or not one has saving faith. You know this, because you used Jesus' teachings to question anyone's faith who doesn't support social welfare programs, like here:

David_S42 said:

That is exactly the point some of us are trying to make, You want to make abortion illegal and force mother to have baby. But then what? What is the next step? What kind of social program do you support so the mother can take care the baby? If we think just forcing people to give birth, and then we can wash our hand and think “ we did our part for the smallest human being” then it is not taking care “one of the least of these brothers” or taking care the poor, give water to the thirsty or cloth them those who are naked. Most GOP politicians might be pro-life , but that’s it. They don’t support universal health care or paid family leave or free education, none of the policy to help the needy, or poor or those who are in prison. None of the GOP policy to help the foreigner or widow. It is like a empty brass making empty noise “ saving the unborn.. protecting baby from killer”. At the end the Lord will say “ I never knew you”

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I suppose you'll be turning yourself in on TOS violations now. No? Then you really are a hypocrite, by your own admission.

But I'll say this for you: you stayed with it a long time for someone who had no logic or reason or even scripture to support his view.

BNR32FAN said:

Actually I think the reason many politicians advocate abortion is because Christians are the minority in America and immorality has constantly been on the rise. So their entire plan is to appeal to the majority in order to win elections.

Oh and in answer to the title, no I would never vote for anyone who supported abortion.

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I agree.. In fact.. many a good leader has been kept from actually helping the country and the people who voted against them... for simply standing up against abortion...

The media has it hyped so much that people go blind to the damage that they are doing to themselves and their country.. all based on one thing.

It's to the point where evil destructive leaders, like our PM, Justin Trudeau, probably won because the opposition stated that even though they would not attempt to change the standing of law on abortion in the country... they were personally against it.....

People heard that.. and it was over...

Today most people are ignorant to who the leader of the state, province or country are.. who the VP is or leader of the opposition.. totally ignorant...

So, when the media states.. "So and So is personally against abortion" The people run the other way.. Even though there is such a slim chance that they would ever be in the situation to get an abortion themselves...

The topic is Kryptonite.