Has America actually become the "Great Satan"?

Tuur · Nov 28, 2022

Landon Caeli said:
The time of judgement upon Nations is over.

Since the advent of Christ, all are judged upon their faith in Jesus:

Galatians 3:
23 Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.

26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Paul here is making the argument about the law and grace. In Leviticus 20:22-23 we find where God judged nations to whom He didn't give the law, and before He gave the law to the Israelites.

Lost Witness · Nov 28, 2022

Landon Caeli said:
There is no "we" as a country. There are only Christians and non-Christians.... Those of faith, and those without... Across the world.

can't stop what GOD has ordained but we can Come out of it as spoken of in Revelations as "think" was kind to point out

Think... · Nov 28, 2022

Belteshazzar(Daniel) said:
If it were not a mystery there would be no reason to search out what it is. God said that knowledge would be increased toward the final days. I like to seek out knowledge concerning God's word ,is it wrong to do so? Years of study have been put into my ideas concerning these things. If anyone lacks wisdom let them ask. I have compared many scriptures throughout the Bible my conclusions are not without any base. Study to find yourself worthy. If you do not wish to accept the possibilities being brought forth ,dig for yourself and see what you find.

Completely irrelevant to anything I posted.

Another person who just likes to type words on a screen based on nothing of any significance at all.

Think... · Nov 28, 2022

Belteshazzar(Daniel) said:
And yet another person who does not want to do anything to find answers for them selves. I have better things to do with my time than write you out a book explaining all the connections that I have found. I need prove nothing to one who is not interested in finding out for their self. Seems you ask alot and have nothing but insult to give. I do not care if you believe what I say or not ,Study it out for yourself. Make your own conclusions. I am not here to do Bible studying for you.

I literally don't even know who you're talking to.

Nothing you say aligns with anything I've said in this thread.

Oh well. God bless.

PloverWing · Nov 28, 2022

Tuur said:
This old man doesn't see that anymore. The US has reached the point where it proclaims as good what God has clearly says is bad. Maybe not the Great Satan, but maybe the Great Cesspool.

What's even more troubling is the resistance to the idea that since God judges nations, the US comes under judgment as well. We may already be seeing that.

I agree that there is a lot of selfishness in the US, and that it's common for people to be admired for being wealthy or powerful, when that wealth and power have come at the expense of other people. So, yes, in many ways the US proclaims as good what God's prophets clearly condemned.

But I also see ways in which the US makes pathways for people of all backgrounds to get good education, good jobs, and good homes. This doesn't happen perfectly or all the time, but it happens often enough that it's something we can be happy about.

I expect that, when it comes time to judge the nations, there will be a mix of "I didn't know you were the hungry person I helped" and "I didn't know you were the hungry person I hurt".

Think... · Nov 28, 2022

PloverWing said:
I expect that, when it comes time to judge the nations, there will be a mix of "I didn't know you were the hungry person I helped" and "I didn't know you were the hungry person I hurt".

Exactly.

And when it comes to Matthew 7:21-23, there will be a lot of "I didn't know living in habitual sin would cause me to be rejected by Christ. I was so sure calling myself a Christian, believing in Jesus and just being loving to people would get me to heaven no matter what."

hislegacy · Nov 28, 2022

Homeby5 said:
Try to keep the discussion focused on morality and not politics.
For those of us that are older...we remember this term being given to us by Muslim nations decades ago. They implied our moral values would reap a path of destruction and basically we were a tool of the Devil.
Anyway...were they right?
Just curious what you guys think?

Those are the same nations that glorify honor killing children - publicly beating women - executing homosexuals and murdering anyone outside of their faith.

RoBo1988 · Dec 4, 2022

The leadership of United States government, has been increasingly neglecting, and hostile to those who follow Christ, and IMO, our place on the world's stage has diminished because of it Proverbs 14:34 (of course the world still wants us to open our checkbook-but little else)

As a believer, my attitude is becoming more and more like those in 1 Kings 12:16 -I'm ready to "depart to my tent" because I really don't feel I have any share in the country anymore. However, I am commanded to walk in Love Ephesians 5:2

As far as The USA being the "The Great Satan", I disagree. We wrestle not against flesh and blood Ephesians 6:12 Individuals can be agents of Satan but not a nation as a whole. Just like McDonald's is known for hamburgers, some good some bad; our country can be known for different things, some good some bad.

lifepsyop · Dec 6, 2022

Fantine said:
I am glad to see that most posters agree our biggest lapse is greed and selfishness--not sexual sins.

I am not so sure they are that distinct from each other. Consider the corresponding rise of the mass-consumer society and the rise of inappropriate contentography. Both are intertwined in a shared culture of self-gratification.

And both are both promoted under the banner of individual freedoms and human liberty by our managerial elite: (government, academic, media, etc.)

RoBo1988 · Dec 7, 2022

lifepsyop said:
I am not so sure they are that distinct from each other. Consider the corresponding rise of the mass-consumer society and the rise of inappropriate contentography. Both are intertwined in a shared culture of self-gratification.

And both are both promoted under the banner of individual freedoms and human liberty by our managerial elite: (government, academic, media, etc.)

I agree. Oswald Chambers, in My Utmost for His Highest says that sin is not wrong doing, but wrong being-you are a simply product of where you are at, in your fellowship with God, or whoever you fellowship with.

If you are walking with Him, and in The Spirit, the you will abstain from greed, selfishness, and sexual sin.

The country's representation, gives lip service to His Word, so we shouldn't be surprised when it's manifested in greed, selfishness, and sexual sin.

Belteshazzar(Daniel) · Dec 7, 2022

Tuur said:
Paul here is making the argument about the law and grace. In Leviticus 20:22-23 we find where God judged nations to whom He didn't give the law, and before He gave the law to the Israelites.

The perspective of the other countries, especially those of the Islamic faith, of our country is we are evil. Could God not use these nations to punish America for her sin? Is it possible that America could possibly be the harlot of Babylon? Tell my people to get out of Babylon. For God has set it in the hearts of three kings to destroy the harlot.
God is warning His people to leave before He uses these men to destroy Mystery Babylon. Is this not judgement upon a nation in this world?
I agree that there will be a judgement in Heaven upon the nations. I also know that God is just, should he punish the nations of old while they existed on earth and allow those that now are escape any consequences for their actions?
I can hear the other nations saying you didn't let us get away with it why are they? Tha's not just or fair you changed.

lifepsyop · Dec 7, 2022

RoBo1988 said:
I agree. Oswald Chambers, in My Utmost for His Highest says that sin is not wrong doing, but wrong being-you are a simply product of where you are at, in your fellowship with God, or whoever you fellowship with.

If you are walking with Him, and in The Spirit, the you will abstain from greed, selfishness, and sexual sin.

The country's representation, gives lip service to His Word, so we shouldn't be surprised when it's manifested in greed, selfishness, and sexual sin.

Republican and Democrat establishment both unified in their upholding of a mass inappropriate contentographic culture. inappropriate contentography keeps modern society going. A demoralized atomized society doesn't care too much about political corruption as long as they have access to inappropriate contentography and other base instant gratification that comes with a mass-consumer society. It's the unspoken agreement between the masses and the ruling class. "We'll let you run the country however you want as long as you protect us from social forces that might take our inappropriate contentography away."

The politics of sexual liberation.

RoBo1988 · Dec 7, 2022

lifepsyop said:
Republican and Democrat establishment both unified in their upholding of a mass inappropriate contentographic culture. inappropriate contentography keeps modern society going. A demoralized atomized society doesn't care too much about political corruption as long as they have access to inappropriate contentography and other base instant gratification that comes with a mass-consumer society. It's the unspoken agreement between the masses and the ruling class. "We'll let you run the country however you want as long as you protect us from social forces that might take our inappropriate contentography away."

The politics of sexual liberation.

I remember listening to Michael Savage on the radio years ago; one of his callers was talking about a revolution. He told the caller that revolutions are born out of desperation, starvation. He said (yelling, of course)"you'll never have a revolution in this country with your mouth filled with hot dogs, and pie!" I would add: and with your computers and phones filled with inappropriate content, and gambling(which will be legal in my state this month) too. It's one of the pacifiers of this country.

Belteshazzar(Daniel) said:
I agree that there will be a judgement in Heaven upon the nations. I also know that God is just, should he punish the nations of old while they existed on earth and allow those that now are escape any consequences for their actions?

I've heard it said: "If God doesn't punish America for her sins, He will have to apologize to Sodom and Gomorrah" However, I believe that the new covenant kind of changes that. Ezekiel 18:21-23 and Ezekiel 18:30 touches upon that

Belteshazzar(Daniel) · Dec 7, 2022

Those are for the individual not the nation as a whole. If a nation cannot be judged by God now than why would God tell His people to get out of Babylon? He is not passing judgement on those who believe but a nation as a whole. Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed after Lot left. If My people Who are called by My name will humble themselves and TURN FROM THEIR WICKED WAYS then I will hear from Heaven and heal their land.
I guess the real question to me would be are their enough Christians praying humbly and not for self gain? Are there enough to take a stand against the sin of this nation and quit accepting it? Will God heal a land I feel is full of watered down; make me feel good; cotton candy preaching; God is Santa Claus "gospel?

Belteshazzar(Daniel) · Jan 2, 2023

If the foundation is not solid is not the nation as a whole corrupted at its' roots? To say America was found with the ideal of choice and free will is an innaccurate response to what was truly the reasonning behind the people responsible for its creation.
For instance how many american colonist actually wanted to overthrow Britain Rule? Why was there so much empathy toward the rebels from the british army? Why would Lafayette a master of the French madonic lodge come to fight for our independence then France have its own revolution?
No, I still believe America was and is a ruse a promise of freedom without persecution for Christians. That allowed Christianity to become weak and now those who truly believe in the Word are being persecuted and considered hateful.
Satan saw that persecution of the church made it stronger. Give them freedom and they become weak in their faith; compliant to the world; and a dim light hidden under a bushel.

RoBo1988 · Jan 2, 2023

Belteshazzar(Daniel) said:
If the foundation is not solid is not the nation as a whole corrupted at its' roots? To say America was found with the ideal of choice and free will is an innaccurate response to what was truly the reasonning behind the people responsible for its creation.
For instance how many american colonist actually wanted to overthrow Britain Rule? Why was there so much empathy toward the rebels from the british army? Why would Lafayette a master of the French madonic lodge come to fight for our independence then France have its own revolution?
No, I still believe America was and is a ruse a promise of freedom without persecution for Christians. That allowed Christianity to become weak and now those who truly believe in the Word are being persecuted and considered hateful.
Satan saw that persecution of the church made it stronger. Give them freedom and they become weak in their faith; compliant to the world; and a dim light hidden under a bushel.

"From bondage to spiritual faith,
From spiritual faith to great courage,
From great courage to liberty,
From liberty to abundance,
From abundance to complacency,
From complacency to apathy
From apathy to dependence,
From dependence back to bondage."
-Alexander Fraser Tytler

Belteshazzar(Daniel) · Jan 3, 2023

Belteshazzar(Daniel) said:
No nation has it right nor any form of government known to man. To compare the sin of a nation to that of another is irrelevant. God is the judge not man. Therefore, let us look at the possibility that the U.S. could be Mystery Babylon. The criteria for the mother of harlots is she has made the rulers drunk, she has drank from the cup full of blasphemy; she rides upon a scarlet beast; she is destroyed by three kings, who despise her, because God put it in their hearts to destroy her.
America was not found on a base of Christianity. It was found upon the base of an order derived from many pagan religions rolled into one, that of freemasonry. Many of the founders were of the order and cared not which, if any, religion anyone followed, thus we have the freedom of religion. Upon much research I have finally found that Washington preformed the masonic ritual at the laying of the cornerstone of the capital building that copied that same ritual, tools and all, that was done at the laying of the cornerstone at the tower of Babel.
Babylon was founded upon the ideals that man could build his way to heaven without the need of God. America was born out of the ideals that man could have freedom without God. Freedom without God leads to bondage in SIN.

True Christianity is not dominate in the United States. Prosperity preaching and tickle my ears so I can feel good about being in sin

Belteshazzar(Daniel) · Jan 3, 2023

Landon Caeli said:
Everybody wants to play prophet.

Realistically though, the United States has a much higher percentage of Christians than *all* the other European countries, China is Godless, and many places in Africa, the ME, and South-Central America are plagued with bloodshed, senseless wars, and a multitude of other abominable sins.

...If you're trying to suggest that America is the Great Satan or "mystery babylon", you'll need to explain how that is, outside of baseless prophetic insinuations.

China is not any more Godless than any other nation. God goes after individuals not nations. The Christians in those nations that kill those who follow Jesus are stronger Christians.
American Christians are not hard core. We need our coffee and donuts; our soft padded chairs; our ac and heat; our big worship teams to get us worked up. No true Christians are found in the places where life is on the line. Where SIN is called out as what it is regardless of who may be offended and the effects on the offering box. What God says is what He meant and it is not up to man to change it so everyone feels all warm and fuzzy.
I can stand in a garage it does not make me a car likewise, I can stand in a church it does not make me a Christian.
Last I heard Christianity percentages in this nation were on a downward spiral.

Landon Caeli · Jan 4, 2023

Belteshazzar(Daniel) said:
China is not any more Godless than any other nation. God goes after individuals not nations. The Christians in those nations that kill those who follow Jesus are stronger Christians.
American Christians are not hard core. We need our coffee and donuts; our soft padded chairs; our ac and heat; our big worship teams to get us worked up. No true Christians are found in the places where life is on the line. Where SIN is called out as what it is regardless of who may be offended and the effects on the offering box. What God says is what He meant and it is not up to man to change it so everyone feels all warm and fuzzy.
I can stand in a garage it does not make me a car likewise, I can stand in a church it does not make me a Christian.
Last I heard Christianity percentages in this nation were on a downward spiral.

I'm not aware of Christianity in the US giving sin a free pass within any of the denominations... Unless what you're talking about is Christians approaching known sinners in society, and confronting them, which in that case, no we don't typically do that.

...What actually is it that you're talking about?

Landon Caeli · Jan 4, 2023

Belteshazzar(Daniel) said:
True Christianity is not dominate in the United States. Prosperity preaching and tickle my ears so I can feel good about being in sin

I disagree that a "feel good about being in sin" type of Christianity dominates the United States. I've never seen it.

...But I do know of Christians who protect known sinners from harassment and violence... But that doesn't mean they condone a sinful lifestyle. There are levels of nuance that exist - it's not all black and white.

Has America actually become the "Great Satan"?

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