It's time to leave natural gas ASAP!

Tuur

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While there's a lot here I agree with - it's going to take time.
The poor often live further out in exurbia - well away from the jobs - and pay disproportionate amounts to drive their cars much further than the rich inner city dwellers. It's unfair, but they need their cars.
Ultimately I think we can infill many highways with New Urban strips to give something for the local suburbs to plug into, but this takes decades. In the meantime they'll need cars - but this is the kind of city plan I think we need to campaign for.

If you live beyond the suburbs?
 
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timewerx

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While there's a lot here I agree with - it's going to take time.
The poor often live further out in exurbia - well away from the jobs - and pay disproportionate amounts to drive their cars much further than the rich inner city dwellers. It's unfair, but they need their cars.
Ultimately I think we can infill many highways with New Urban strips to give something for the local suburbs to plug into, but this takes decades. In the meantime they'll need cars - but this is the kind of city plan I think we need to campaign for.

At the moment, a lot of office administrative work have become work-from-home jobs due to the pandemic few years ago.

It proved to be a very effective solution. A lot less cars on the streets and the city smog literally went away!

In your situation, providing mini bus transport might work if economics prove positive. Having lots of people in one vehicle is always one way to improve gas mileage per person and to reduce carbon emissions than if one person drove on their car instead.

Not the most convenient way to get around but if we really need to fix a big problem, sacrifices has to be made.
 
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eclipsenow

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Bikes don't work that well for logging.


  • A forestry harvester in South Australia's Green Triangle will take possession of the region's first electric logging truck
  • NSW startup Janus Electric is able to convert existing diesel trucks into electric powered vehicles
  • Its electric trucks exchange batteries like a race car replaces tyres, removing the need to park and charge
    Diesel engine conversion technology sparks electric logging truck trial in SA's south-east
  • 42b8a02a80c4b7d720a27bdc7874cfbe
 
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timewerx

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Bikes don't work that well for logging.

It depends on how big the pieces are.

Seriously, you misread my post or didn't read the rest of it. Forget about trucks I said earlier. It means leave them be. If logging needs trucks then let them use trucks. The issue is not about trucks.

The issue is about millions of commuters hauling their lazy butts on their 2 ton cars or SUV without any passenger.

During the height of pandemic and lockdowns in our country, cars became very few on the road due to restrictions but trucks are given unrestricted access because their essential to the supply chain.

And to all our surprise, our city became smog-free for months!! Trucks are not the problems it's the lazy butt commuters driving by their lonesome on their 2-ton cars / SUVs!
 
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eclipsenow

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It depends on how big the pieces are.

Seriously, you misread my post or didn't read the rest of it. Forget about trucks I said earlier. It means leave them be. If logging needs trucks then let them use trucks. The issue is not about trucks.

The issue is about millions of commuters hauling their lazy butts on their 2 ton cars or SUV without any passenger.

During the height of pandemic and lockdowns in our country, cars became very few on the road due to restrictions but trucks are given unrestricted access because their essential to the supply chain.

And to all our surprise, our city became smog-free for months!! Trucks are not the problems it's the lazy butt commuters driving by their lonesome on their 2-ton cars / SUVs!
Again, Rezoning cities can have incremental but accruing benefits that not only deal with climate change - but also just make cities more fun. Suburban sprawl has a long litany of fatal flaws all well studied and documented. It creates car dependence which steals our money and traffic jams that steal our time. It increases driving and reduces walking, making us obese. It creates social injustice by isolating the elderly or infirm. It forces the poor to rent further out into exurbia while wasting even more time (and money) driving huge distances to work every day. It creates an isolated lifestyle as we drive our ton of steel alone in traffic and up our isolating driveways - only rarely waving at neighbours in the distance. It increases the epidemic of loneliness. Sprawl eats farmlands and parks on the edges of our cities, consumes 10 times the land of Urbanism. The highways are ugly. Developers slam down new suburbs, spewing out soulless McMansions by the dozen. Sprawl creates places "not worth caring about". Language warning =

We’ve forgotten what we’ve lost - a train or tram taking us home to a vibrant town square. It’s called “Rail Based Urban Development” or New Urbanism. The Metro station takes you to a culturally appropriate town square - either an English green or Italian Piazza or Australian Federation township - whatever is demanded. Shops and services and schools surround a park with an eating area. All the amenities of public life are within a 5 minute walk from your front door.

This simple plan means instead of your car keys, you grab a nice pair of walking shoes and a granny-trolley as you head out. Buying the milk and bread means catching up with friends and local community events. It means unplanned overlapping relationships. A visit to the town square means seeing neighbours grabbing a snack, buying a book, visiting the Post Office, buying a few groceries, getting their hair done, or picking up their kids after school or karate or music lessons. We've lost spontaneous street life, the sense that it’s all happening just around the corner. The problem with suburbia is there's no ‘there’ there.
 
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timewerx

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He's just kidding.

Unfortunately, there's still no practical energy alternatives for long haul trucks. This is why I said in my few posts back to forget about them, leave them be.

In Europe, their best solution so far is use AI-driven trucks. The AI will drive the truck fleet in very close proximity (tailgating only few feet from each other) to take advantage of aerodynamic drafting to improve fuel economy of the fleet.

From first-hand experience, the biggest contributor to city smog are privately-driven cars / SUVs, NOT trucks. During the height of our pandemic lockdown, trucks are given unrestricted access but not cars. With far fewer cars and SUVs on the road, the city smog went away.

The vast majority of our trucks are diesel btw. Cars on the other hand are petrol, half of the SUVs are diesel. Diesel engines are not really the main contributor to smog. Petrol can also have same effect, it's just the sheer volume of private car /SUV users causing smog.
 
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eclipsenow

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He's just kidding.

Unfortunately, there's still no practical energy alternatives for long haul trucks. This is why I said in my few posts back to forget about them, leave them be.

In Europe, their best solution so far is use AI-driven trucks. The AI will drive the truck fleet in very close proximity (tailgating only few feet from each other) to take advantage of aerodynamic drafting to improve fuel economy of the fleet.

From first-hand experience, the biggest contributor to city smog are privately-driven cars / SUVs, NOT trucks. During the height of our pandemic lockdown, trucks are given unrestricted access but not cars. With far fewer cars and SUVs on the road, the city smog went away.

The vast majority of our trucks are diesel btw. Cars on the other hand are petrol, half of the SUVs are diesel. Diesel engines are not really the main contributor to smog. Petrol can also have same effect, it's just the sheer volume of private car /SUV users causing smog.
Yes - there are easy wins to be made with technologies that are ready to go in smaller vehicle markets. But don't give up on long-haul big rigs. This whole global civilisation has many companies and researchers working on new battery chemistries. EG: NASA are putting their hat in the ring for solid state batteries that could have 3 times the energy density of today's lithium ion.

And there are different business models - like the "Message for the king" where fresh horses were supplied rather than waiting for them to eat and rest. In other words - if today's Lithium batteries were the best we'll ever get (and I doubt it!) - there are ways we could arrange big-rig driving between Sydney and Melbourne. (About 850km). EG: Swap the trailer over to a fresh truck, or have battery pack draws that pull out and swing back in. Israeli startup Better Place used WW2 bomb-release mechanisms to hold the big car batteries in place and quickly release them when necessary.
Better Place (company) - Wikipedia

Sure they went bankrupt - but in terms of humanity weaning off fossil fuels for good - that's a mere hiccup - a teething issue. Tesla even played with battery swap for a bit.

But here's an idea! No batteries required!
high-speed-train.jpg
 
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timewerx

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Yes - there are easy wins to be made with technologies that are ready to go in smaller vehicle markets. But don't give up on long-haul big rigs. This whole global civilisation has many companies and researchers working on new battery chemistries. EG: NASA are putting their hat in the ring for solid state batteries that could have 3 times the energy density of today's lithium ion.

And there are different business models - like the "Message for the king" where fresh horses were supplied rather than waiting for them to eat and rest. In other words - if today's Lithium batteries were the best we'll ever get (and I doubt it!) - there are ways we could arrange big-rig driving between Sydney and Melbourne. (About 850km). EG: Swap the trailer over to a fresh truck, or have battery pack draws that pull out and swing back in. Israeli startup Better Place used WW2 bomb-release mechanisms to hold the big car batteries in place and quickly release them when necessary.
Better Place (company) - Wikipedia

Sure they went bankrupt - but in terms of humanity weaning off fossil fuels for good - that's a mere hiccup - a teething issue. Tesla even played with battery swap for a bit.

But here's an idea! No batteries required!

That would work but can be improved.

One idea I have with long haul electric trucks, electric charging stations that typically recharge electric cars can also hold freshly charged truck batteries.

When a nearby truck requests for freshly charged batteries, a small AI truck in the charging station delivers the freshly charged batteries to the truck. Makes a rendezvous on the road without stopping nor even diverting. They link together like two spaceships docking with robotic arms or probe / whatever and swap depleted batteries for freshly charged ones.

They can also stop at rest stops at the side of the road if needed in order to link up. This idea would require hot-swappable battery technology (allowing swaps without having to turn off the engine nor stop the vehicle) and extensive use of AI or "autopilot" tech.

This will help save energy and help reduce traffic congestion because the huge long haul truck doesn't need to drive all the way to the charging station. A much smaller delivery truck can meet the truck right on the freeway or motorway without deviating from its route.

The small AI truck zig-zagging across town to meet the truck to deliver fresh batteries takes much less energy than if the truck left the freeway and zig zagged across town to get to the charging station. This will also help reduce travel time for the truck.

We could expect electric trucks to stop more often to recharge or swap fresh batteries or freshly charged semi.

Delivering hot swappable batteries right to them would totally eliminate downtimes and save a lot of energy.

One minor problem I seen in extremely remote regions with charging stations too far in between. I suppose, we can simply place more charging stations near truck routes to make sure the trucks are never too far away from any charging stations.

It would also be quite helpful if the system is made fully automated so the truck never runs out of juice. A human driver monitoring charge levels could get distracted and run out juice in the middle of the journey. They can always request for AI truck to deliver fresh batteries to them but running out of juice can cause serious downtime and delay so it would be better if everything is automated with or without a human driver.
 
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eclipsenow

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That would work but can be improved.

One idea I have with long haul electric trucks, electric charging stations that typically recharge electric cars can also hold freshly charged truck batteries.

When a nearby truck requests for freshly charged batteries, a small AI truck in the charging station delivers the freshly charged batteries to the truck. Makes a rendezvous on the road without stopping nor even diverting. They link together like two spaceships docking with robotic arms or probe / whatever and swap depleted batteries for freshly charged ones.

They can also stop at rest stops at the side of the road if needed in order to link up. This idea would require hot-swappable battery technology (allowing swaps without having to turn off the engine nor stop the vehicle) and extensive use of AI or "autopilot" tech.

This will help save energy and help reduce traffic congestion because the huge long haul truck doesn't need to drive all the way to the charging station. A much smaller delivery truck can meet the truck right on the freeway or motorway without deviating from its route.

The small AI truck zig-zagging across town to meet the truck to deliver fresh batteries takes much less energy than if the truck left the freeway and zig zagged across town to get to the charging station. This will also help reduce travel time for the truck.

We could expect electric trucks to stop more often to recharge or swap fresh batteries or freshly charged semi.

Delivering hot swappable batteries right to them would totally eliminate downtimes and save a lot of energy.

One minor problem I seen in extremely remote regions with charging stations too far in between. I suppose, we can simply place more charging stations near truck routes to make sure the trucks are never too far away from any charging stations.

It would also be quite helpful if the system is made fully automated so the truck never runs out of juice. A human driver monitoring charge levels could get distracted and run out juice in the middle of the journey. They can always request for AI truck to deliver fresh batteries to them but running out of juice can cause serious downtime and delay so it would be better if everything is automated with or without a human driver.
Coupling on the roads sounds like a potential hazard. If we're talking true AI, I imagine there being off-road points where the trucks would meet and just swap the trailer over. The empty truck would charge, and then be ready to drive off and meet some other truck and take it's trailer. Algorithms and AI are cool, hey? IF we can get it to work.
 
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timewerx

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Coupling on the roads sounds like a potential hazard. If we're talking true AI, I imagine there being off-road points where the trucks would meet and just swap the trailer over. The empty truck would charge, and then be ready to drive off and meet some other truck and take it's trailer. Algorithms and AI are cool, hey? IF we can get it to work.

DARPA has succeeded with similar system intended for in-flight refueling of UAVs. Goals would be similar, but instead of compensating for winds, turbulence, and wake from another aircraft, the truck version would compensate for road bumps and turns instead.

A fully articulated, fully automated linking probe would be critical for the link up and the articulated probe would also serve as flexible link between two vehicles to compensate for road irregularities.

Running battery swaps is quite advantageous for long haul trucking. Electric long hauls are to be expected to make more frequent "refueling stops" than diesel trucks.

So even if we do freshly charged truck/tractor swaps, you can still save significant time and energy if you did running battery swaps.
 
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eclipsenow

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I'm not saying it can't be done - just that I think it might not pass muster with various road safety laws. Like nuclear power (which I'm a fan of) anything that the public doesn't understand just does not get through. The overall economic gains on saving say half an hour over a 24 hour trip might not get a lot of attention if a few families get caught up in accidents with them - even if those accidents are due to other causes.

Also, I thought we'd have robot ubers by now. AI gains seemed to be exponential - but now they're on declining logarithmic returns. Elon's said they have to learn to ask new questions before they even trigger new learning opportunities. It's about programming in those things they don't know that the car doesn't know. I'm getting increasingly sceptical about whether AI will be able to do this - and I was a true believer just 5 years ago!

Also, I can see situations where the public will just demand the vehicles head over to a truck-swap stop - whatever that looks like. (EG: Would the trucks be human-driven still? Would they be completely robotic? Would they have their own robotic arms decoupling and swapping over the trailer - or would it be more efficient to have a special nominated truck stop station that also performed other functions as it swapped over the trailer?)
 
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timewerx

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I'm not saying it can't be done - just that I think it might not pass muster with various road safety laws. Like nuclear power (which I'm a fan of) anything that the public doesn't understand just does not get through. The overall economic gains on saving say half an hour over a 24 hour trip might not get a lot of attention if a few families get caught up in accidents with them - even if those accidents are due to other causes.

Also, I thought we'd have robot ubers by now. AI gains seemed to be exponential - but now they're on declining logarithmic returns. Elon's said they have to learn to ask new questions before they even trigger new learning opportunities. It's about programming in those things they don't know that the car doesn't know. I'm getting increasingly sceptical about whether AI will be able to do this - and I was a true believer just 5 years ago!

Also, I can see situations where the public will just demand the vehicles head over to a truck-swap stop - whatever that looks like. (EG: Would the trucks be human-driven still? Would they be completely robotic? Would they have their own robotic arms decoupling and swapping over the trailer - or would it be more efficient to have a special nominated truck stop station that also performed other functions as it swapped over the trailer?)

I'm still hoping they succeed in AI drivers. Their common goal is that AI drivers will be safer than human drivers and even make the driving experience safer for all road users including pedestrians.

With so many drivers heavily distracted by their phone these days or often driving in a manner with no respect and consideration for others causing major accidents or making the experience a lot more stressful for everyone. Sure, I'd like AI drivers all the way if they can achieve those goals.
 
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eclipsenow

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With so many drivers heavily distracted by their phone these days or often driving in a manner with no respect and consideration for others causing major accidents or making the experience a lot more stressful for everyone. Sure, I'd like AI drivers all the way if they can achieve those goals.

I hear you!
But here's a thing. Do you want to make a cancer cell attractive to its host?

Basically many of the young people in my world are surprisingly more New Urbanist than I am. They see the need for some cars, but think relying on them is a failure of good city design. Cars are a cancer on our cities - a symptom of a design mistake we made after WW2. They're an American fad. They're why most European countries have a per capita oil consumption about half that of Americans.

Maybe there's a place for robot-cars to help give us time to design better cities, and bring people from suburbia to the nearest railway in a transport-as-service model (rather than individual car ownership.)

This isn't a hardship. Getting the city designed right is a bonus - it helps us thrive, not just survive.
 
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timewerx

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I agree so many good things can come moving away from cars like lowering nationwide energy consumption (hence, emissions too).

And will much less cars on the road, we could even reduce the # of lanes in very wide multi-lane roads that will free up land we can use for housing, parks, or for planting trees.

In some countries in Europe like Netherlands and Denmark, A LOT of people commute by bicycle, a good % chunk of the population. They even use bikes to take their kids to school or even move bulky items.

But they did have excellent infrastructure devoted to cycling and their laws favor cyclists over motorists to provide utmost safety for cyclists and effective deterrence against motorists from endangering cyclists and pedestrians.

It actually results to far more positive and nurturing environment on the road than what you have in America where many motorists behave like bloodthirsty mass murderers because their laws doesn't have real deterrence against accidentally killing someone on the road with your car.
 
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eclipsenow

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I agree so many good things can come moving away from cars like lowering nationwide energy consumption (hence, emissions too).

Did you watch this 5 minute video? One line is "We'll burn less oil.... and more calories."
When you design cities that are attractive and walk-able, we do better.
If we design cities for people, not cars, we do better. Imagine that?

3 minutes - and turn it up and groove to the vibe.

We'll get 8 to 9 times the land back!
That's a lot of extra parks and gardens and local produce.
 
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timewerx

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Did you watch this 5 minute video? One line is "We'll burn less oil.... and more calories."
When you design cities that are attractive and walk-able, we do better.
If we design cities for people, not cars, we do better. Imagine that?

3 minutes - and turn it up and groove to the vibe.

We'll get 8 to 9 times the land back!
That's a lot of extra parks and gardens and local produce.

I think that's how Amsterdam is designed as well as many cities in Belgium, Denmark, etc.

If you look at pictures of Amsterdam and Denmark, you'll see way more more cyclists and pedestrians than motorists!

Indeed those countries produce some of the best endurance athletes in the world!

Here's pedestrian video tour of Copenhagen. Deemed as the "Happiest City in the World". It's not just a saying, they really are happy and not as miserable as the Americans!

I have relative in Copenhagen and tells me people there are not trying to get rich. They are lacking in greed and lust of money, and thefts are far few in between. You can even leave your bicycle unlocked outside and nobody would steal it (I'm not sure how true is that, I'll have to take his word for it!!). And I think poverty doesn't exist among its citizens.

It would seem a nation's level of greed, love of money is directly responsible for causing some of their people to live in poverty. If there is no greed, no one has to live in poverty, no one has to be homeless.

Is obsession with cars makes people miserable or obsession with cars a symptom of a much bigger problem than just unintelligently designed cities?

We often criticize some Euro countries for being pagan, Godless, however, they seem to be less evil than many Christian nations for actually taking care of the poor. The fundamental aspect of being a true follower of Christ.

 
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eclipsenow

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Is obsession with cars makes people miserable or obsession with cars a symptom of a much bigger problem than just unintelligently designed cities?
Cars were once a status symbol - but don't feature in the top 20 "must have" consumer items on European youth surveys. Americans grow up in American suburbia and instinctively KNOW they need a car - and they do! It's going to take decades for American cities to get public transport. But once it starts amazing things can happen in just a decade or so. (EV's will just have to do until then.)

We often criticize some Euro countries for being pagan, Godless, however, they seem to be less evil than many Christian nations for actually taking care of the poor. The fundamental aspect of being a true follower of Christ.
They're not as binary politically. In the US you're either a God & Guns Trumpist, or an out and out Communist! :doh::doh: In Europe they use terms like "Ordo-Liberal" and realise there are a thousand other positions on the political-economic dial than just "HARD LEFT and HARD RIGHT".
 
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NinjaPirate777

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Banks are picky about who they lend to. That is why we have credit scores. Banks hate to lose money on loans. Banks are still making loans on beachfront property, all over the world. There is not one single country I know of where this is not the case. Would banks be doing that if they were concerned about the sea levels rising?

When banks start worrying about return on such investments, I will start taking global warming seriously.

Until then I'll bundle up in the winter and strip down in the summer.
 
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eclipsenow

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Would banks be doing that if they were concerned about the sea levels rising?
Banks?

Climate change affects banks because of the impact it has on the value of assets used as collateral for loans and the incomes borrowers use to repay their loans. There is significant uncertainty about the magnitude of risks to banks from climate change. This is because of the uncertainty about how climate change will alter future weather patterns, how policies will change globally and how economies adapt. This article uses one approach to provide preliminary estimates of the possible scale of risks climate change poses to banks' housing and business exposures. This approach suggests that a small share of housing in regions most exposed to extreme weather could experience price falls that might subsequently result in credit losses, but the overall losses for the financial system are likely manageable. Banks are also exposed to transition risks from their lending to emissions-intensive industries, but their portfolios appear to be less emissions-intensive than the economy as a whole. Further estimates of the impact of climate change on banks will be provided by the Climate Vulnerability Assessment currently being undertaken by the Australian Prudential Regulation Authority and the five largest banks.
Climate Change Risks to Australian Banks | Bulletin – September 2021

Also, our insurance agencies are thinking of not insuring certain Aussie towns in the bush as they are either too fire prone or too flood prone. The government recently helped pay for parts of our country town of Lismore to migrate up a hill because of the increased flooding risks due to climate change. It's just a fact of physics that for every degree of extra average regional temperature the atmosphere can carry 5 to 7% more water vapour. It carries more water - increasing droughts here and floods over there.
 
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I feel like something has changed in Australia. A whole bunch of big and small government projects have been announced.

SMALL
Walpole is a little Aussie country town living off farming and tourism. It’s down the end of a LONG transmission line. That means fires and storms and gum trees coming down cause frequent power outages. How to fix that? A farmer is getting some money having 2 dams built to PHES specs. It will be unobtrusive - it's his property. And dams are things farmers tend to have anyway.

It's small. They've broken ground, and it's going to be finished by the end of 2023. When finished, if a tree comes down and severs the line, the little town of Walpole will have nearly 3 days of power to get them through until that line can be repaired.

ABC news story Snowy Hydro 2.0 — but 'much, much' smaller

Western Power promo - Walpole looks like many coastal Aussie towns. Makes me nostalgic and need a holiday. Kick back and enjoy - 3 minutes.

WILL THEY GO OFF GRID? There's enough free country there for Walpole to one day get ideas about generating their own solar and wind and maybe building another pumped hydro dam. Will the Shire of Walpole take them off grid into their own little micro-grid? Will they go into some sort of local worker's co-op? Community owned power rather than Corporation owned power? Here are the specks. It's a cute little thing! Only a 90 metre head! http://www.westernpower.com.au/media/6094/wp_walpole_minipumpedhydro_brochure_apr22.pdf

HUGE
BUT on the other end of the scale here's a report on Queensland’s HUGE $62 billion pumped hydro & renewable energy hubs that aim to reduce state wide emissions over the next decade or so.
 
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