Why people reject the reality of Hell

Trivalee

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So His reason for being, and dying, was to remove all excuses for people so that they can be legitimately condemned? And there was I thinking He came to save, not to condemn. Silly me. You said it.

You can trivialise it if it makes you happy. Jesus came to save, but those who reject his sacrifice for their sins will have their place in the lake of fire.
 
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Hmm

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You can trivialise it if it makes you happy. Jesus came to save, but those who reject his sacrifice for their sins will have their place in the lake of fire.

And I would say the same to you. You are free to trivialise and diminish Jesus' sacrifice if you want to.
 
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Trivalee

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If God has two sides, he can't be trusted.

I think you borrowed the idea from Greek mythology. Janus-faced.

Janus - Wikipedia
Please read Deuteronomy 28. In the Mosaic law, on the one hand, is peace, joy, prosperity, etc. for obeying the law. But on the other hand, curses and judgment for failure to uphold the law. If that's not two sides to God, I don't know what it is.

Every man has two sides to him: love and kindness and anger and irritation.
 
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Der Alte

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Saint Steven said:
Will you be sinless when you enter the afterlife. Many lose their mental capacity before death. If that happens to you, you'll be toast, right?
How many dear saints have passed in that condition? How many are about to?
I thought according to UR everyone, all mankind will be saved at death?
 
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Hmm

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Every man has two sides to him: love and kindness and anger and irritation.

But God is not a man, or a woman. Unlike a human person, He does not have different sides. He is not merciful sometimes and just, as you would see it, at other times. Rather, His mercy is just and His justice is merciful at all times. He's quite unlike you and me and so you shouldn't equate Him as such.
 
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Trivalee

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My warped view beholds the Author being the Finisher. My warped view sees our God as victor over sin, death & the grave . My warped view, as one of His malista, beholds our God as the Saviour of all mankind.

Pas is not monos or monon: not!
  • God is the Author and Finisher - Agreed.
  • God has victory over sin - Agreed. However, those that continue to disdain God's victory for their sin will face eternal judgment; vide: Hebrews 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

    30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
Paul said in 1 Tim 2:4 "that God wants all men to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth". But God will not save any man who does not want to be saved. IOW, a man MUST yield to Christ to be saved. It is erroneous to assume all men will literally be saved.

The Prophet Isaiah said that even though Israel is like the sand of the sea for number, a remnant shall be saved. This is a dual prophecy in that the first part was fulfilled during the return from captivity and the second part will be in the end times. That is, only those who finally accept Jesus as messiah will be saved, and the intransigent will be destroyed.
 
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Trivalee

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But God is not a man, or a woman. Unlike a human person, He does not have different sides. He is not merciful sometimes and just, as you would see it, at other times. Rather, His mercy is just and His justice is merciful at all times. He's quite unlike you and me and so you shouldn't equate Him as such.
Care to take advice? Go and read your bible.
 
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Trivalee

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And I would say the same to you. You are free to trivialise and diminish Jesus' sacrifice if you want to.
According to the great preacher, Derek Prince, some people only see God like Santa Clause; only amiable and jovial, but shut their minds to God's other side as a Righteous Judge.
 
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Der Alte

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  • God is the Author and Finisher - Agreed.
  • God has victory over sin - Agreed. However, those that continue to disdain God's victory for their sin will face eternal judgment; vide: Hebrews 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
    30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
Paul said in 1 Tim 2:4 "that God wants all men to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth". But God will not save any man who does not want to be saved. IOW, a man MUST yield to Christ to be saved. It is erroneous to assume all men will literally be saved.
The Prophet Isaiah said that even though Israel is like the sand of the sea for number, a remnant shall be saved. This is a dual prophecy in that the first part was fulfilled during the return from captivity and the second part will be in the end times. That is, only those who finally accept Jesus as messiah will be saved, and the intransigent will be destroyed.
A remnant: is mentioned in the following vss. Ezra 9:8, Ezra 9:14; Isaiah 1:9, Isaiah 10:20-21, Isaiah 11:11, Isaiah 24:13; Jeremiah 5:10; Ezekiel 6:8; Micah 5:3-8
I don't think the UR Bibles have these vss. they evidently believe that all mankind will be saved, the righteous and unrighteous alike, even after death.
 
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Saint Steven

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A man's fate is sealed after death Hebrew 9:27. Eternal Judgement is the assessment of how an individual lived - in Christ or without - and that determines their eternal destiny.
That scripture actually supports both views, and frankly fits better with UR than ECT. We believe there will be a judgment. We also understand that mercy is an option in judgment.

Hebrews 9:27 NIV
Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment,
 
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Saint Steven

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You can trivialise it if it makes you happy. Jesus came to save, but those who reject his sacrifice for their sins will have their place in the lake of fire.
Is that anything more than "church speak"?
Only a single segment of Christianity believes that.
 
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Jipsah

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The problem with your warped view is that you inexplicably refuse to consider the other side of God - as the righteous Judge that exacts vengeance on his intransigent enemies (Romans 12:19).
The "other side" being the side that is spiteful and merciless. None of that "Father, forgive them" stuff, it's torturing time! And of course, anyone who was never persuaded that Christianity is true is an "intransigent enemy" and deserves no mercy, right? Thinks Christianity is just another strange foreign religion? He's a malevolent God-hating fiend who deserves to be roasted over a slow fire forever. How about a Sikh, who devotedly observes the virtues of truth and truthful living, compassion and patience taught by the 10 gurus, and who studies their scriptures to learn the truths of God? Nope, he's a diabolical idolater who leads people to destruction (in hell, of course) and deserves to be tortured for all eternity. The agnostic who thinks there may be a God but he's not sure because he sees nothing tangible to make him believe? Well he can consider the tangible evidence of being racked by demons for the rest of forever; that'll persuade him! How about the old boy who grew up around Christians, and found too many of them to be sanctimonious frauds and decided their religion was as phony as they are? Into hell with him to be flayed alive forever and ever and ever and ever because that'll show him, won't it? How many examples would you like? Sorry, the "intransigent enemies" of God are strawmen intended to make painting God as a heartless find who inflicts eternal pain on those who have offended Him for no discernble reason whatsoever seem less ghastly.

Justice? Not even a pretense of it. He Who set limits on human punishments (an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, and no more) to insure that the punishment fit the crime, now metes out infinite punishment for decidedly finite crimes, like having not paid attention to preachers ,or being of a skeptical turn of mind that causes one to not to believe in anything supernatural at all.

Justice? Hardly! But your lot says we must call it justice because otherwise there's no way to believe such things and and not believe that God is simply the worst conceivable oriental despot raised to ruling the universe nstead of an obscure principality somewhere.

If your errant view of eternal judgment makes you sleep easy, so be it.
Fair play, if you're comfortable with the concept of God torturing (or having them tormented, He has people who do it for Him) people forever for having chosen the wrong religion, or none, and for no possible reason other than for His own gratification, and desire to see Him for any reason other than stark fear, wear yourself out.

But woe betides the sinner (whether they professed Christ with the lip while their heart is far from God or the outright rebel who gave God the finger despite receiving the gospel of salvation again and again) their place is eternal burning in the lake of fire.
That'll teach them! Bwahahahahah!

[quoteAs I said, if you wish to turn this into an academic debate and undermine the severity of eternal punishment to feel good, so be it.[/quote] And by all means, feel free to do the opposite, and assure yourself that you're going to be ridin' high with the saints in Heaven while all those rotten sinners who disrespected you, oops, I mean who disrespected God, will be writhing and screaming in the fire forever. Bet they're not laughing now, huh?

But don't tell others that eternal judgment in hell is a sham
Good job God doesn't really destroy anyone in hell, isn't it? I mean, just because our Lord said He could do it doesn't mean He ever really does, does it? Nah, it was just a figure of speech. And that stuff about the wages of sin being death isn't true at all, is it? Neither is the part about eternal life being a gift of God. Everybody has eternal life anyway, so it's not really a gift, so no one ever actually dies. So the wages of sin isn't, and cannot be, death, it's eternal torture, and you have to be alive to be tortured. And eternal life isn't a gift, it's a design feature, something everyone has by default. St. Paul got it totally wrong. Shame your lot wasn't there to set him straight

God will hold you accountable for every soul that is lost by believing you (Rev 22:18-19).
And also with you.
 
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Jesse Dornfeld

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I am agnostic on "Hell," that is, ECT, and am undecided between that and Annihilationism, but I'm open to being convinced either way! Universalism is an idea I categorically reject, so you won't get anywhere with me on that.

I have actually had a dream of hell. It was quite surreal. The dream was basically that I saw a man who was in hell who had this kind of yellow glow coming from him and he was totally unbothered by being there. The place itself was pitch black except for, what I can only identify as, "spiritual flames." But my dreams are fallible and the Word of God is not. I was not in hell myself, but I was witnessing it from an outside PoV. It still gave me the impression that no one would ever want to go there. The holy man I saw there was a different story. He didn't seem bothered by it at all.
 
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wendykvw

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I am agnostic on "Hell," that is, ECT, and am undecided between that and Annihilationism, but I'm open to being convinced either way! Universalism is an idea I categorically reject, so you won't get anywhere with me on that.

I have actually had a dream of hell. It was quite surreal. The dream was basically that I saw a man who was in hell who had this kind of yellow glow coming from him and he was totally unbothered by being there. The place itself was pitch black except for, what I can only identify as, "spiritual flames." But my dreams are fallible and the Word of God is not. I was not in hell myself, but I was witnessing it from an outside PoV. It still gave me the impression that no one would ever want to go there. The holy man I saw there was a different story. He didn't seem bothered by it at all.
What is it you reject in Universalism?
 
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Jesse Dornfeld

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What do you mean by warnings of no reality?

Feel free to exeget this. Good luck, you are going to need it.

Luke 16:23 NAS20
““And in Hades he raised his eyes, being in torment, and *saw Abraham far away and Lazarus in his arms.””
 
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FineLinen

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  • God is the Author and Finisher - Agreed.
  • God has victory over sin - Agreed. However, those that continue to disdain God's victory for their sin will face eternal judgment
There is simply no passage of Scripture that speaks of "eternal judgment/aidios kolasis. NONE!

Every knee, every tongue, every dimension of heaven, earth & underworld IN union within the Name.
 
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FineLinen

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My warped view sees our God as victor over sin, death & the grave . My warped view, as one of His malista, beholds our God as the Saviour of all mankind.

My warped view beholds our God losing nothing, not leftover fish and morsels of bread.

AND

Not one broken and bruised sinner for whom He is the at-one-ment.
 
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