What is the difficulty of getting into heaven?

Clare73 said:

Nevertheless, it's the only choice Scripture presents (1 Corinthians 2:14; Romans 8:7-8; John 3:3), man's reasoning and objection not-with-standing.

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No, the choice isn't presented there. None of those address the question as to whether or not a person can resist becoming a child of God to begin with, or whether they can return to the flesh after having living with and by the Spirit, or die again after being born again.

Adam started the "resistance" so to speak, and God is meaning to patiently draw His beloved creation back into rectitude, back into alignment with His will and opposed to the resistance movement, one of us at a time. And that still doesn't happen overnight within us; we can bail at any time, we can grow nearer and nearer to the image and likeness of God, or turn and run away from Him. The choice remains until we're perfected, until good is absolutely chosen over evil, until we love Him with our whole heart, soul, mind, and strength to put it another way.

renniks said:

"You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace."

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All throughout the Bible, God wanted His people to repent and to return to obedience to His law, and even Jesus began his ministry with that Gospel message, so it would be absurd to interpret Galatians 5:4 as Paul warning us against obeying God and saying that we will be cut off from Christ is we repent and follow Christ. In Psalms 119:29, David wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him His law, so that is what it means to be under grace, and it would also be absurd to interpret that as David wanting God to be gracious to him by teaching him how to fall from grace. Paul's problem in Galatians was not with those who were teaching Gentiles how to obey God's commands in accordance with the example that Christ set for us to follow as if that were somehow a negative thing, but rather his problem was with those who were wanting to require Gentiles to obey their works of the law in order to earn their justification.

14 "For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”

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If we love God and our neighbor, then we won't commit idolatry, theft, murder, adultery, rape, kidnapping, favoritism, and so forth for everything else that God has commanded, so love fulfills the law because it is inclusive of everything in it and everything in it is an example of how to correctly obey the command to love, so they are all connected, which is why Jesus said in Matthew 22:36-40 that they all hang on the greatest two commandments.

Soyeong said:

If we love God and our neighbor, then we won't commit idolatry, theft, murder, adultery, rape, kidnapping, favoritism, and so forth for everything else that God has commanded, so love fulfills the law because it is inclusive of everything in it and everything in it is an example of how to correctly obey the command to love, so they are all connected, which is why Jesus said in Matthew 22:36-40 that they all hang on the greatest two commandments.

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Yes love is the fulfilling of the law, according to the commandments ( we are to believe in God is love) and love ( God is love, and he who dwells in love, dwells in God) works no ill to your neighbour.

For all who struggle to love their neighbour ( those who follow the commandments without the Spirit of God in them through the law) it is time to awake out of sleep, to cast off those works of darkness, to put on the armour of light, to walk honestly, which is without rioting and drunkenness, no chambering, or strife or envy, but to PUT ON THE LORD JESUS CHRIST and to make no provision then, to the flesh, to fulfil the lusts of it.





Romans 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.
11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.
13 Let us walk honestly, as in the day; not in rioting and drunkenness, not in chambering and wantonness, not in strife and envying.
14 BUT PUT YE ON THE LORD JESUS CHRIST, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.

Handmaid for Jesus said:

That is backward.

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Condemnation is that light came into the word, to turn us from the power of darkness to the power of God ( light) to receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritence among those who are sanctified by faith that is in Him ( Christ)



John 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

Acts 26:18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.



If anyone who thinks they are in the light, but who walks in darkness yet, they are no in the light, they are in darkness until then.




1 John 2:8 Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.
9 He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now.
10 He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.
11 But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.



So we have to cast off the works of darkness by putting on the Lord Jesus to not make any provision to the flesh to fulfil its lusts..



Romans 13:12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.
13 Let us walk honestly, as in the day; not in rioting and drunkenness, not in chambering and wantonness, not in strife and envying.
14 But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.

fhansen said:

No, that's God's religion. We cannot have or prove our righteousness by ourselves because we have none by ourselves. Only with God is righteousness possible for man, even as that is exactly what man was created for, all of this involving a plan and purpose of God's from the beginning-to get us "there".

"...not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ—the righteousness that comes from God on the basis of faith." Phil 3:9

"But now apart from the law the righteousness of God has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. This righteousness is given through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe." Rom 3:21-22

"For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God’s abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ!" Rom 5:17

"And so he condemned sin in the flesh, in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit." Rom 8:3-4

"Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live." Rom 8:12-13

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If you depend on your lifestyle in any shape or form, to be the basis, any basis at all, which determines saved or lost, your acceptance with God, you base everything on your works. Lifestyle is vain, dead works of religion if not from the right foundation.

SavedByGrace3 said:

Ohhhh... I have been fooled by open ended question before BF2.
I'll let you answer. I am sure you have a perfect answer ready to go.

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Heres why, because they are washed in Christs blood, and clothed in His Righteousness imputed.

Brightfame52 said:

If you depend on your lifestyle in any shape or form, to be the basis, any basis at all, which determines saved or lost, your acceptance with God, you base everything on your works. Lifestyle is vain, dead works of religion if not from the right foundation.

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Denying Christ is when we never received the spotless blood of Christ, that is lifestyle and it is the blood and it is faith, all are ONE.


Titus 1:15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.
16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

1 Peter 1:19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

Brightfame52 said:

If you depend on your lifestyle in any shape or form, to be the basis, any basis at all, which determines saved or lost, your acceptance with God, you base everything on your works. Lifestyle is vain, dead works of religion if not from the right foundation.

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No, the free gift of justification is the foundation, the beginning of salvation. Even at that point the human will is involved as we can say "no" to the gift of faith, and we can say "no" at any point thereafter. We're not forced to remain in Him. But to the extent that we do, to the extent that we cooperate in doing His will with His grace we're transformed into His own image and our justice or holiness grow more yet. That's man's very purpose, resulting from knowing and loving God.

God is producing something in the whole endeavor called creation, something very good, something much better than He began with: beings who love as He does and that necessarily involves choice as we embrace and act upon that love He gives. He's overcoming sin in us, reversing Adam's rebellion and cultivating holiness, growing us in love rather than just stocking heaven with some otherwise worthless sinners who nonetheless believe.

Brightfame52 said:

Heres why, because they are washed in Christs blood, and clothed in His Righteousness imputed.

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Yeah...that's not it. God's not interested in pretending that we're just, when we're not. He forgives and takes away our sins and then plants the seeds of His own righteousness in us. God, alone, can justify man, can make us who we we're created to be as we turn to Him in faith.

“I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people." Jer 31:33-34

fhansen said:

No, the free gift of justification is the foundation, the beginning of salvation. Even at that point the human will is involved, we can say "no" to the gift of faith, and we can say "no" at any point thereafter. We're not forced to remain in Him. But to the extent that we do, to the extent hat we cooperate in doing His will with His grace we're transformed into His own image and our justice or holiness grow more yet. That's mans very purpose, resulting from knowing and loving God. God is producing something in the while endeavor called creation, something very good, much better than He began with, beings who love as He does and that necessarily involves choice as we embrace and act upon that love He gives. He's overcoming sin in us, reversing Adam's rebellion and cultivating holiness, growing us in love rather than just stocking heaven with some otherwise worthless sinners who nonetheless believe.

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Who God calls, He chooses, and who He chooses He justifies, they that are with Him are called, and chosen, and faithful, a chosen generation, called out of darkness into His marvelous light...



Romans 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.


Revelation 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

1 Peter 2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

fhansen said:

Yeah...that's not it. God's not interested in pretending that we're just, when we're not. He forgives and takes away our sins and then plants the seeds of His own righteousness in us. God, alone, can justify man, can make us who we we're created to be as we turn to Him in faith.

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That's right, nobody pretends that any injustice is yet justice, and any seed of righteousness that has not grown into a tree, has no fruit produced ( fruit to perfection)

servant7777 said:

Who God calls, He chooses, and who He chooses He justifies, they that are with Him are called, and chosen, and faithful, a chosen generation, called out of darkness into His marvelous light...

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Yes, and yet we can still return to the darkness, to injustice. God wants the will of man involved in this, for our own highest good, regardless of how weakly at first, and then more and more firmly involved as we come increasingly into alignment with His own perfect will. See post #111.

Soyeong said:

All throughout the Bible, God wanted His people to repent and to return to obedience to His law, and even Jesus began his ministry with that Gospel message, so it would be absurd to interpret Galatians 5:4 as Paul warning us against obeying God and saying that we will be cut off from Christ is we repent and follow Christ. In Psalms 119:29, David wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him His law, so that is what it means to be under grace, and it would also be absurd to interpret that as David wanting God to be gracious to him by teaching him how to fall from grace. Paul's problem in Galatians was not with those who were teaching Gentiles how to obey God's commands in accordance with the example that Christ set for us to follow as if that were somehow a negative thing, but rather his problem was with those who were wanting to require Gentiles to obey their works of the law in order to earn their justification.



If we love God and our neighbor, then we won't commit idolatry, theft, murder, adultery, rape, kidnapping, favoritism, and so forth for everything else that God has commanded, so love fulfills the law because it is inclusive of everything in it and everything in it is an example of how to correctly obey the command to love, so they are all connected, which is why Jesus said in Matthew 22:36-40 that they all hang on the greatest two commandments.

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No one ever followed the law perfectly except Jesus. No one is saying go out and sin so that you might get more grace, but that doing good and living upright doesn't save you in anyway.
"I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!”

"So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith."

renniks said:

No one ever followed the law perfectly except Jesus. No one is saying go out and sin so that you might get more grace, but that doing good and living upright doesn't save you in anyway.
"I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!”

"So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith."

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And yet Scripture is emphatic about grave deeds of the flesh (sin) keeping us from heaven. Faith accomplishes in man what the law cannot, because faith makes God our God again, He who is the very source of our righteousness. Adam thought he was right, without God, that he didn't need God. We're here to learn otherwise. Adam's presumably learned otherwise by now too, that,
"Apart from Me you can do nothing." John 15:5

fhansen said:

Yes, and yet we can still return to the darkness, to injustice. God wants the will of man involved in this, for our own highest good, regardless of how weakly at first, and then more and more firmly involved as we come increasingly into alignment with His own perfect will. See post #111.

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Not the testimony, this is the testimony:


John 12:35 Then Jesus said unto them, Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you: for he that walketh in darkness knoweth not whither he goeth.

1 John 2:10 He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.
11 But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.

renniks said:

No one ever followed the law perfectly except Jesus. No one is saying go out and sin so that you might get more grace, but that doing good and living upright doesn't save you in anyway.
"I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!”

"So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith."

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The law is to love and love is perfect.



Romans 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

Galatians 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

1 John 4:12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.

fhansen said:

God wants the will of man involved in this,

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If mans will is involved with Gods will it can only be to Gods perfect will


Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

Colossians 4:12 Epaphras, who is one of you, a servant of Christ, saluteth you, always labouring fervently for you in prayers, that ye may stand perfect and complete in all the will of God.

Hebrews 13:21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

You know your own words wont replace Gods fhansen, and you know I will show Gods word replacing your words every single time ( as I always did and do)

servant7777 said:

Not the testimony, this is the testimony:


John 12:35 Then Jesus said unto them, Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you: for he that walketh in darkness knoweth not whither he goeth.

1 John 2:10 He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.
11 But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.

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Yes, and it's a daily choice to pick up our cross and walk in the light.

servant7777 said:

You know your own words wont replace Gods fhansen, and you know I will show Gods word replacing your words every single time ( as I always did and do)

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Nah, and your misunderstandings of His Word won't replace His wisdom, including denying the truths of His Word in post #111. We must read all of the bible to have sound understanding.