Saturday or Sunday Church?

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SabbathBlessings

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God's law is spiritual (Romans 7:14) in that it has always been intended to teach us spiritual principles that are aspects of God's nature of which the listed laws are just examples. For example, in Matthew 23:23, Jesus said that tithing was something that they ought to be doing while not neglecting weightier maters of the law justice, mercy, and faithfulness, so these are aspects of God's nature that the law was intended to teach us how to express. God's righteous laws are intended to teach us about a spiritual principle of righteousness that leads us to take physical actions that are examples of that principle even in situation that God's law does not specifically address. If someone thought that they understood the spiritual principle of love, so they no longer needed to take physical actions to express love for their neighbor, then they would be missing the point, so correctly understanding a spiritual principle will never lead us away from taking physical actions that are examples of that principle. A spiritual principle that has no physical expression is fruitless and learning it would not add value to us, so the Bible does not spiritualize things away from having a physical expression.

I agree with you for the most part but we are talking about the second temple and I do not think scripture is referring to a literal second temple and here’s why.

There is no scripture that says the literal temple will need to be rebuilt.

Jesus said the temple would be destroyed Matthew 24:1-2

Ephesians 2:19 Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, 20 having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone, 21 in whom the whole building, being fitted together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord, 22 in whom you also are being built together for a dwelling place of God in the Spirit.

This indicates the temple is a spiritual one not a physical one.

There is no prophecy or promise in the Bible that says the physical temple would ever be rebuilt after the Romans razed it which now sits a Muslim mosque.
 
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Carl Emerson

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Either there are correct or incorrect reasons for becoming circumcised and Paul only spoke against the incorrect reasons, or according to Galatians 5:2, Paul caused Christ to be of no value to Timothy when he had him circumcised right after the Jerusalem Council (Acts 16:3) and Christ is of no value to roughly 80% of the men in the US. In Acts 15:1, they were wanting to require all Gentiles to become circumcised in order to become saved, however, that was never the purpose for which God commanded circumcision, so the Jerusalem Council upheld God's law by ruling against requiring circumcision for an incorrect reason, which should not be mistaken as ruling against requiring circumcision for the purposes for which God commanded it, as if the Jerusalem Council had the authority to countermand God. In 1 Corinthians 5:6-8, Paul instructed them to continue to observe Passover, which requires Gentiles to become circumcised in order to eat of the lamb (Exodus 12:43-49), so are are correct reasons for which a Gentile can become circumcised.

Is it sinful for a Christian not to keep the Passover?
 
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Ceallaigh

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Christianity follows the law the way Judaism does to a large extent, such as giving to charity and loving our neighbor as ourselves, but if that is a grievous error, then I'm not sure what you would call following God's law to no extent.
The main complaint in this section is that most Christians are lawless because they're not obeying the Mosaic law and saying the law was fulfilled at the cross. And of course the chief sin of lawlessness is not observing the Saturday sabbath.
 
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Soyeong

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So does the evidence of God's character through creation.

However what you seem to miss is that the Law of the Spirit is the very voice of the indwelling Christ which is far more precise than the Written Law ever was.

I agree that the Spirit helps us to correctly keep God's law, but that is not something different from the Spirit leading us to keep it. Jesus was led by the Spirit and that did not look different than living in obedience to the Law of God, so the Law of the Spirit is not something different than it.

Paul warned against returning to accountability to the written Law and thereby loosing the walk of faith that Jesus paid such a high price that we might walk in it's freedom. In so doing we would attain to a higher level of righteousness because the result is much more than right action, it also includes right attitude.

In Titus 2:14, it does not say that Jesus gave himself to free us from God's law, but in order to free us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so the freedom that we have in Christ is the freedom from sin, not the freedom to do what God's law reveals to be sin, and becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law is the way to believe in what he accomplished through the cross (Acts 21:20). In Psalms 119:142, God's law is truth, and in John 8:31-36, it is sin in transgression of God's law that puts us in bondage while it is the truth that sets us free.

Paul spoke about multiple different categories of law other than the Law of God, such as works of the law and the law of sin. For example, in Romans 3:27, he contrasted a law of works with a law of faith, and in Romans 7:25-8:2, he contrasted the Law of God with the law of sin and contrasted the Law of the Spirit of Life with the law of sin and death. So while Paul warned against works of the law and the law of sin, he was a servant of God, so he never warned us against obeying what God has commanded as if obedience to God was somehow a negative thing.

If the New Covenant is only made with the Nation of Israel then the Body of Christ including the Gentiles is non-existant.

In Exodus 12:38, there was a mixed multitude that came up out of Egypt, so there were Gentiles as the foot of Sinai. In Joshua 8:33, Israel was inclusive of both the foreigner and the native born, so there have always been righteous Gentiles who have affiliated themselves with the God of Israel who have sought by faith to learn how to walk in His way. In Acts 15:16-17, they saw the inclusion of Gentiles as being part of the restoration of Israel in fulfillment of prophecy, not as a brand new entity. In Ephesians 2:19, through faith in Christ, Gentiles are no longer strangers or aliens to the covenants of promise, but now fellow citizens of Israel along with the saints in the household of God. In Romans 9:6-8, Israel is made up of those who have faith in the promise. In 1 Peter 2:9-10, Gentiles are included as part of God's chosen a people, a holy nation, a royal priesthood, and a treasure of God's own possession, which are terms used to describe Israel (Deuteronomy 7:6), so Gentiles also have the delight of getting to obey the instructions that God gave for how to fulfill those roles. So it is only through faith in Christ that Gentiles are able to become joined to Israel and partakers of the New Covenant.

This is false logic that you are compelled to construct.

The Law of the Spirit and the Written Law are entirely different.

God is not in disagreement with Himself about which laws we should follow, so the Law of Christ is the same as the Law of the Spirit and the Law of the Father, which was given to Moses. The Spirit would lead us to do something other than what the Father has instructed, so you keep unjustifiably insisting that they are different while handwaving verses that equate them.

The New Covenant was made with the spiritual descendants of Abraham the Father of all who have faith, not the Nation of Israel.

I'll quote Jeremiah 31:31 to support that it was made with the house of Judah and the house of Israel. What can you quote from the Bible to support your claim?

Why pull believers back to a Yoke that is unbearable ???

Acts 15

9 and He made no distinction between us and them, cleansing their hearts by faith. 10 Now therefore why do you put God to the test by placing upon the neck of the disciples a yoke which neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear? 11 But we believe that we are saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, in the same way as they also are.”

In Deuteronomy 30:11-14, God said that His law is not too difficult to obey, so you claiming that it is an unbearable yoke is in direct disagreement with God. Likewise, in 1 John 5:3, to love God is to obey His commandments, which are not burdensome, yet you are essentially interpreting Acts 15 as ruling that Gentiles shouldn't love God because His commandments are too burdensome. Jesus set a sinless example for us to follow of how to walk in obedience to God's law, and Matthew 11:28-30, he invited people to come to him for rest and to learn from him and that his yoke was easy and his burden was light.

The Psalms express an extremely positive view of God's law, such as with David repeatedly saying that he loved it and delighted in obeying it, so if we consider the Psalms to be Scripture and to therefore express a correct view of it, then we will share it, as Paul did (Romans 7:22), and will not interpret Paul as speaking against doing something that he delighted in doing. For example, in Psalms 1:1-2, blessed are those who delight in the law of the law and who meditate on it day and night, so we can't believe in the truth of these words as Scripture while not allowing them to shape our view of God's law, and anything less than the view that we ought to delight in obeying it is incompatible with the view that the Psalms are Scripture. Furthermore, the authors were in complete agreement with everything said about God's law in the Psalms and should not be interpreted as holding a view of God's law that is incompatible with the view that the Psalms are Scripture.

Why do you think that it makes perfect sense to interpret God's word as speaking against obeying God's word?
 
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Soyeong

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Is it sinful for a Christian not to keep the Passover?

Sin is the transgression of God's law (1 John 3:4) and God's law instructs to keep Passover, so it is therefore a sin not to keep it. Furthermore, in Deuteronomy 4:2, it is a sin to add to or subtract from God's law, so it is also a sin for someone claim that it is not sinful for a Christian to not keep Passover.

In Matthew 4:15-23, Christ began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which was a light to the nations, and God's law is how his audience knew what sin is (Romans 3:20), so repenting from our disobedience to it is an integral part of the Gospel of Christ, which he prophesied would be proclaimed to all nations (Matthew 24:12-14). Furthermore, Christ set a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to God's law, and as his followers we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22) and that those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way he walked (1 John 2:6). So Christ spent his ministry teaching his followers how to obey God's law by word and by example and Christians should follow what Christ taught, and the NT authors should not be interpreted as speaking against Christians following Christ.
 
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Ceallaigh

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Sin is the transgression of God's law (1 John 3:4) and God's law instructs to keep Passover, so it is therefore a sin not to keep it. Furthermore, in Deuteronomy 4:2, it is a sin to add to or subtract from God's law, so it is also a sin for someone claim that it is not sinful for a Christian to not keep Passover.
That's not what Christianity teaches. So that's counter-Christianity or "restored" Christianity as the Momons euphemistically call it.
 
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Aussie Pete

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Speaking of bondage. Seventh-day Adventists teach that the near the end of time the "mark of the best" of Revelation 14 will be placed upon those who worship on Sunday instead of Saturday.

Mark of the Beast
Yes. It's absurd. The mark of the beast is obvious and has nothing to do with the day Christians choose to worship.
 
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Aussie Pete

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Sin is the transgression of God's law (1 John 3:4) and God's law instructs to keep Passover, so it is therefore a sin not to keep it. Furthermore, in Deuteronomy 4:2, it is a sin to add to or subtract from God's law, so it is also a sin for someone claim that it is not sinful for a Christian to not keep Passover.

In Matthew 4:15-23, Christ began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which was a light to the nations, and God's law is how his audience knew what sin is (Romans 3:20), so repenting from our disobedience to it is an integral part of the Gospel of Christ, which he prophesied would be proclaimed to all nations (Matthew 24:12-14). Furthermore, Christ set a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to God's law, and as his followers we are told to follow his example (1 Peter 2:21-22) and that those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way he walked (1 John 2:6). So Christ spent his ministry teaching his followers how to obey God's law by word and by example and Christians should follow what Christ taught, and the NT authors should not be interpreted as speaking against Christians following Christ.
I know what the NT says about the Law and it is nothing like your interpretation.
 
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Soyeong

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The main complaint in this section is that most Christians are lawless because they're not obeying the Mosaic law and saying the law was fulfilled at the cross. And of course the chief sin of lawlessness is not observing the Saturday sabbath.

If someone followed 80% of what God has commanded, then perhaps they could be considered lawless to the degree to which they are not obeying what God has commanded, but I would not consider them to be completely lawless either next to someone who was obeying 0% of what God has commanded. If someone needed to have perfect doctrine in order to enter heaven, then it would be rather empty, but I think that there is a line somewhere where people can have such as poor understanding of what it means to have faith in Jesus that they don't actually have faith in him in spite of thinking that they do. I don't know if not keeping the Sabbath is sufficient to bar someone from heaven, or if it is something more, but I pray that it is not sufficient, and thankfully I'm not the judge, through I can assure people that they would be far better off repenting and obeying God. SDA's tend to focus on just the Sabbath as part of the Ten Commandments, but Jesus taught more than that both by word and by example.

"To fulfill the law" means "to cause God's will as made known in His law to be obeyed as it should be” (NAS Greek Lexicon pleroo 2c3). After Jesus said he came to fulfill the law in Matthew 5, he proceeded to fulfill it six times throughout the rest of the chapter by teaching how to correctly obey it or by completing our understanding of it. In Galatians 5:14, loving our neighbor fulfills the entire law, so it refers to something that countless people have done, not to something unique that only Jesus did. In Galatians 6:2, bearing one another's burdens fulfills the Law of Christ, so that should be interpreted in the same way as fulfilling the Law of Moses. Nothing that Jesus said in Matthew 5 indicates that he was speaking about the cross and he had not yet started talking about his death at that stage of his ministry, so he should not be interpreted as speaking about something else instead of what he immediately proceeded to do next. Furthermore, the Talmud contains much discussion about how to fulfill the law by correctly doing what it commands.
 
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Soyeong

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I know what the NT says about the Law and it is nothing like your interpretation.

If you point is simply that there are people on the internet who disagree with me, then I'm well aware of that. Otherwise, by all means please explain why you think my interpretation is wrong. God's word should not be misinterpreted as speaking against obeying God's word.
 
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Soyeong

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That's not what Christianity teaches. So that's counter-Christianity or "restored" Christianity as the Momons euphemistically call it.

So then do you think that the verses that I cited to support my position are against what Christianity teaches?
 
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SabbathBlessings

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SDA's tend to focus on just the Sabbath as part of the Ten Commandments, but Jesus taught more than that both by word and by example.
I don’t think you are accurately portraying the teachings of the SDA church. The church teaches the whole bible. At church there might be a sermon on the Sabbath every several months, if that. The Sabbath might be mentioned here or there because of course its the holy day of the Lord thy God. If anything the church focuses a lot on bible prophesy on the book of Daniel and Revelation, which I hear way more than the Sabbath.

We tend to get in more discussion on the forum over the Sabbath because its the one commandment people want to forget and debated more than the other commandments or laws.

Here are the official church beliefs What do Seventh Day Adventists Really Believe? - Adventist.org. The Sabbath is one of 28 fundamental beliefs. Our focus is on the Word of God which consist of the whole bible. Hope this helps.
 
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Ceallaigh

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So then do you think that the verses that I cited to support my position are against what Christianity teaches?
It's not the verses, it's the doctrine. Every doctrine and theology, no matter how false it is, uses verses to back it up.
 
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Ceallaigh

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So Paul was wrong ???

And Peter:

"Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear?" Acts 15:10

Of course the usual claim is that Peter was only talking about circumcision, which is pure balderdash.
 
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Carl Emerson

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Gal 3
before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed. 24 Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor. 26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s descendants, heirs according to promise.
 
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guevaraj

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Gal 3
before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed. 24 Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor. 26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s descendants, heirs according to promise.
Brother, Paul speaks of the avoidance laws of Judaism, the human laws of avoidance to protect against breaking God's law. Like, not to pronounce God's name at all, "He is", so as not to use God's name in vain. Now that we have Jesus' faster cycle of forgiveness, we can use God's name with the confidence of gaining victory over the misuse of His name without the need of the human avoidance law of not saying His name at all. Now we are bolder to approach God's law to gain victory over sin by wanting to say His name without using it in vain.

Let me put it another way. The law (of Judaism) was our guardian (avoidance) until Christ came; it protected us until we could be made right with God through faith. And now that the way of faith has come (Jesus' faster cycle of forgiveness), we no longer need the law (of Judaism) as our guardian (avoidance). (Galatians 3:24-25 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Soyeong

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So Paul was wrong ???

And Peter:

"Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear?" Acts 15:10

Of course the usual claim is that Peter was only talking about circumcision, which is pure balderdash.

If your interpretations of Acts 15:10-11 were correct that Peter was referring the Law of Moses as being a heavy burden that no one could bear, then Peter would have been in direct disagreement with God in Deuteronomy 30:11-14 and he would have therefore been wrong. However, he was not wrong because Acts 15:11 makes it clear that what Acts 15:10 describes as a heavy burden that no one could bear is a position that is opposed to saying that we will be saved be grace, namely the position raised in Acts 15:1 by those from Judea who were wanting to require all Gentiles to become circumcised in order to become saved. The purpose for which God commanded circumcision was never as a means of earning our salvation, so the issue being discuss was the means of salvation, not the issue of whether followers of God should follow what He has commanded in accordance with the example that Jesus set for us to follow, as if the Jerusalem Council had the authority to countermand God. In Acts 15:5, a group of believers from among the Pharisees opposed the group from Judea in Acts 15:1 by saying that it is necessary for Gentiles to become circumcised and obey the Law of Moses, but they did not see it as a means of earning our salvation. So neither of the groups there made the case that Gentiles do not need to obey the Law of Moses, but rather they were discussing the means of salvation, and the Jerusalem Council arbitrated between the two groups and correctly upheld the Law of Moses by ruling in favor of the group in Acts 15:5 and against the group in Acts 15:1 who were wanting to require circumcision for an incorrect purpose.

In Acts 15:6-9, Peter said that Gentiles should hear the Gospel and believe and that God who knows the heart bore witness to them by giving them the Holy Spirit and cleansed their hearts by faith. In Matthew 4:15-23 and Matthew 24:12-14, the Gospel that Jesus said was a light to the Gentiles and prophesied would be proclaimed to them called for them to repent and obey the Law of Moses. In Acts 2:38, when Peter calls for his audience to repent and be baptized for the forgiveness of sins, the Law of Moses was how they knew was sin is. Likewise, in Romans 15:4, Paul said that OT Scripture was written for our instruction and in 15:18-19, his Gospel message involved bringing Gentiles to obedience in word and in deed, so his Gospel message was on the same page about teaching repentance from our sins. Furthermore, Romans 10:16, 2 Thessalonians 1:8, and 1 Peter 4:17 all speak against those who do not obey the Gospel, so the Gentiles who heart the Gospel and believed were obeying the Law of Moses.

In Acts 5:32, the Spirit has been given to those who obey God. In Romans 2:25-29, the way to recognize that a Gentile has a circumcised heart is by observing their obedience to the Law of Moses, which is the same way to tell for a Jew (Deuteronomy 10:12-16, 30:1-8), and circumcision of the heart is a matter of the Spirit, which is in contrast with Acts 7:51-53, where those who have uncircumcised hearts resist the Spirit and do not obey the Law of Moses. In Ezekiel 36:26-27, the Spirit has the role of taking away our hearts of stone, giving us hearts of flesh, and leading us to obey the Law of Moses, in John 16:13, the Spirit has the role of leading us in truth, and in Psalms 119:142, the Law of Moses is truth. In John 16:8, the Spirit has the role of convicting us of sin and the Law of Moses is how we know what sin is (Romans 3:20, 1 John 3:4). In Romans 8:4-7, those who walk in the Spirit are contrasted with those who have minds set on the flesh, who refuse to submit to the Law of Moses. In Galatians 5:19-22, everything listed as works of the flesh that are against the Spirit are also against the Law of Moses while all of the fruits of the Spirit are aspects of God's nature that are in accordance with it. So the Gentiles who had received the Spirit and had their hearts cleansed were obeying the Law of Moses.

In Psalms 119:29-30, David wanted to put false ways far from him, for God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey the Law of Moses, and he chose the way of faithfulness, so this has always been the one and only means of salvation by grace through faith, which was the means of salvation that that the Jerusalem Council was ruling in favor of in Acts 15:11. Our salvation is from sin (Matthew 1:21) and again the Law of Moses is how we know what sin is, so while we do not earn our salvation by obeying the Law of Moses, living in obedience to it is inherently is nevertheless inherently the content of the gift of Jesus saving us from from not living in obedience to it.
 
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Soyeong

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It's not the verses, it's the doctrine. Every doctrine and theology, no matter how false it is, uses verses to back it up.

If you disagree with my position in lieu of explaining why you disagree, then you are also disagreeing with the verses that I used to support my position, but if you think that I've misunderstood those verses, then by all means please explain why.
 
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Ceallaigh

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If your interpretations of Acts 15:10-11 were correct that Peter was referring the Law of Moses as being a heavy burden that no one could bear, then Peter would have been in direct disagreement with God in Deuteronomy 30:11-14 and he would have therefore been wrong. However, he was not wrong because Acts 15:11 makes it clear that what Acts 15:10 describes as a heavy burden that no one could bear is a position that is opposed to saying that we will be saved be grace, namely the position raised in Acts 15:1 by those from Judea who were wanting to require all Gentiles to become circumcised in order to become saved. The purpose for which God commanded circumcision was never as a means of earning our salvation, so the issue being discuss was the means of salvation, not the issue of whether followers of God should follow what He has commanded in accordance with the example that Jesus set for us to follow, as if the Jerusalem Council had the authority to countermand God. In Acts 15:5, a group of believers from among the Pharisees opposed the group from Judea in Acts 15:1 by saying that it is necessary for Gentiles to become circumcised and obey the Law of Moses, but they did not see it as a means of earning our salvation. So neither of the groups there made the case that Gentiles do not need to obey the Law of Moses, but rather they were discussing the means of salvation, and the Jerusalem Council arbitrated between the two groups and correctly upheld the Law of Moses by ruling in favor of the group in Acts 15:5 and against the group in Acts 15:1 who were wanting to require circumcision for an incorrect purpose.

In Acts 15:6-9, Peter said that Gentiles should hear the Gospel and believe and that God who knows the heart bore witness to them by giving them the Holy Spirit and cleansed their hearts by faith. In Matthew 4:15-23 and Matthew 24:12-14, the Gospel that Jesus said was a light to the Gentiles and prophesied would be proclaimed to them called for them to repent and obey the Law of Moses. In Acts 2:38, when Peter calls for his audience to repent and be baptized for the forgiveness of sins, the Law of Moses was how they knew was sin is. Likewise, in Romans 15:4, Paul said that OT Scripture was written for our instruction and in 15:18-19, his Gospel message involved bringing Gentiles to obedience in word and in deed, so his Gospel message was on the same page about teaching repentance from our sins. Furthermore, Romans 10:16, 2 Thessalonians 1:8, and 1 Peter 4:17 all speak against those who do not obey the Gospel, so the Gentiles who heart the Gospel and believed were obeying the Law of Moses.

In Acts 5:32, the Spirit has been given to those who obey God. In Romans 2:25-29, the way to recognize that a Gentile has a circumcised heart is by observing their obedience to the Law of Moses, which is the same way to tell for a Jew (Deuteronomy 10:12-16, 30:1-8), and circumcision of the heart is a matter of the Spirit, which is in contrast with Acts 7:51-53, where those who have uncircumcised hearts resist the Spirit and do not obey the Law of Moses. In Ezekiel 36:26-27, the Spirit has the role of taking away our hearts of stone, giving us hearts of flesh, and leading us to obey the Law of Moses, in John 16:13, the Spirit has the role of leading us in truth, and in Psalms 119:142, the Law of Moses is truth. In John 16:8, the Spirit has the role of convicting us of sin and the Law of Moses is how we know what sin is (Romans 3:20, 1 John 3:4). In Romans 8:4-7, those who walk in the Spirit are contrasted with those who have minds set on the flesh, who refuse to submit to the Law of Moses. In Galatians 5:19-22, everything listed as works of the flesh that are against the Spirit are also against the Law of Moses while all of the fruits of the Spirit are aspects of God's nature that are in accordance with it. So the Gentiles who had received the Spirit and had their hearts cleansed were obeying the Law of Moses.

In Psalms 119:29-30, David wanted to put false ways far from him, for God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey the Law of Moses, and he chose the way of faithfulness, so this has always been the one and only means of salvation by grace through faith, which was the means of salvation that that the Jerusalem Council was ruling in favor of in Acts 15:11. Our salvation is from sin (Matthew 1:21) and again the Law of Moses is how we know what sin is, so while we do not earn our salvation by obeying the Law of Moses, living in obedience to it is inherently is nevertheless inherently the content of the gift of Jesus saving us from from not living in obedience to it.

I knew you'd claim it was only about circumcision. Which no matter how wordy and drawn out the explanation with verse links added, it doesn't make sense and doesn't follow the course of what all is said and decided in Acts 15. It's Judaizing plain and simple.
 
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