Under what circumstances is the Scripture the 'Word of God'

Graceisgraceworksareworks said:

every word in the Bible is the word of God. It is either all Gods words that can be trusted

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But the bible quotes the devil ... actually speaking.

Re-analyze that statement.

Michael Collum said:

But the bible quotes the devil ... actually speaking.

Re-analyze that statement.

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If I'm telling you a story and quote someone speaking it doesnt make me that person or the story not mine. The Bible quotes a lot of people. The Bible is a selection of world events told through the filter of God by the Holy Spirit.

Graceisgraceworksareworks said:

If I'm telling you a story and quote someone speaking it doesnt make me that person or the story not mine. The Bible quotes a lot of people. The Bible is a selection of world events told through the filter of God by the Holy Spirit.

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That's not what the bible says about itself.

Michael Collum said:

That's not what the bible says about itself.

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That's exactly what the Bible says about itself

2 Peter 1 (KJV)
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²⁰ Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
²¹ For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

2 Timothy 3 (KJV)
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¹⁶ All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
¹⁷ That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

Graceisgraceworksareworks said:

That's exactly what the Bible says about itself

2 Peter 1 (KJV)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
²⁰ Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
²¹ For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

2 Timothy 3 (KJV)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
¹⁶ All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
¹⁷ That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

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2 Peter 1 says people were moved by God and wrote, God did not write Himself.

2 Timothy 3:16 speaks of that "being moved" thus "inspiriation"

The bible also says this about the scriptures:

How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain. (Jeremiah 8:8)

This illustrates that God noted in the time of Jeremiah, that the scribes copying down the bible of their day, were liars and were handling the pen deceitfully.

The idea you are putting forth about the scriptures is not supported by the scripture.

Michael Collum said:

2 Peter 1 says people were moved by God and wrote, God did not write Himself.

2 Timothy 3:16 speaks of that "being moved" thus "inspiriation"

The bible also says this about the scriptures:

How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain. (Jeremiah 8:8)

This illustrates that God noted in the time of Jeremiah, that the scribes copying down the bible of their day, were liars and were handling the pen deceitfully.

The idea you are putting forth about the scriptures is not supported by the scripture.

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Ironically Jermiah 8 is speaking of those of you in this thread do not know what the words of God are.

“Yea, the stork in the heaven knoweth her appointed times; and the turtle and the crane and the swallow observe the time of their coming; but my people know not the judgment of the LORD.”
— Jeremiah 8:7 (KJV)

Do you also not know the judgement (words of the Lord) are? Even animals know their course and they way which they go without doubt.

Jeremiah 8 (KJV)
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⁸ How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain.

This verse isnt about men writing corrupt words but men openly rejecting the words of the Lord not knowing them and substituting their own judgment in place of Gods

⁹ The wise men are ashamed, they are dismayed and taken: lo, they have rejected the word of the LORD; and what wisdom is in them?

Have you also rejected the words of the Lord? With what wisdom? Did God tell you to not believe his words?

Graceisgraceworksareworks said:

Have you also rejected the words of the Lord? With what wisdom? Did God tell you to not believe his words?

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I have a far more reliable method of testing and approving as the scripture says to do.

There are multiple variants on the texts, some of which are significant when it comes to "do I apply Variant A or Variant B?"

Jesus said in the word, those who do the Father's Will, know if I am speaking the truth or not.

So apply it, see the fruit of all possibilities, then know which one God has blessed more.

The bible that is translated by humans, tells us that humans are deceitful and mess up translating the bible. So testing a prophecy based on fruit is the biblical approach. Placing one's head in said sand is not recommended.

Michael Collum said:

I have a far more reliable method of testing and approving as the scripture says to do.

There are multiple variants on the texts, some of which are significant when it comes to "do I apply Variant A or Variant B?"

Jesus said in the word, those who do the Father's Will, know if I am speaking the truth or not.

So apply it, see the fruit of all possibilities, then know which one God has blessed more.

The bible that is translated by humans, tells us that humans are deceitful and mess up translating the bible. So testing a prophecy based on fruit is the biblical approach. Placing one's head in said sand is not recommended.

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This is not what the word says. The word says this

“Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.”
— Proverbs 3:5 (KJV)

You have made youreself the judge based on what you want to hear. If any part of Gods word cant be trust then none of it can. As far as manuscripts the Majority text all agree so there are no discrepancies or need to make your own judgements. God promised to give us his word and he did

Carl Emerson said:

When Satan quoted the Scripture during the temptation in the wilderness, did he deliver God's Word if it wasn't inspired by the Holy Spirit?

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Gods word is inspired by the Holy Spirit its not that when you yourself speak it you are inspired directly by the Holy Spirit. The Bible says no man speaking by the Holy Ghost calls Jesus accursed or that no man can say Jesus is the Lord but by the Holy Ghost. The profession of the truth in Christ Jesus is directly inspired by the Holy Spirit not any being or person speaking a part of Gods words. Even the devils believe and tremble

Carl Emerson said:

Maybe we can process this issue better by considering the statement...

God's Word is perfect...

But the Scripture is not perfect (and doesn't need to be for Him to establish His perfect purpose through it...)

Same story with Humans...

He Knows that we are but dust but this doesn't frustrate His perfect purpose among us or His Love.

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This statement and thinking is not only Satanic but illogical. Your whole basis of what you know about God comes from the very word you reject as being reliable. So how do you know God and with what reliable instrument do you hear or measure him?

Carl Emerson said:

Just responding to these three statements.

I might explain that many come onto CF expounding weird ideas quoting Scripture and claiming to be presenting the very Word of God. In such cases the Holy Spirit is clearly not the motivator in their presentation.



Are you saying this can never be the case?



This statement would seem to contradict the previous one.



So are you claiming your statements are coming direct from the Holy Spirit and not you yourself?

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Not to be rude but I dont get your confusion in this matter. None of what I said was contradictory. The word of God was inspired by God

“For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.”
— 2 Peter 1:21 (KJV)

Gods words can be both verbal and written but Gods words are usually recorded so all men can hear it.

You are basing you own vain ideas on your own judgement and not Gods word cause you dont believe in Gods word you only believe what you call Gods word if you agree with it thus making yourself a god or greater than God. This is foolishness. This is doubt is exactly what Satan did in the Garden

“Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?”
— Genesis 3:1 (KJV)

"Yea hath God said" is your ideology that you are framing as coming from God but in reality it's from the serpent. God is not the author of confusion

Carl Emerson said:

I have presented something for you to think about and suggested your response is contradictory and you respond by saying I am confused and satanic !!!!!!!

May the readers decide.

You may in fact be in breach of CF rules...

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There is only 2 spirits of the world that men communicate with: the Spirit of God and of Satan. Casting doubt on Gods word is the work of Satan and if that puts me in breach of the rules than I stand guilty in telling the truth

Graceisgraceworksareworks said:

There is only 2 spirits of the world that men communicate with: the Spirit of God and of Satan. Casting doubt on Gods word is the work of Satan and if that puts me in breach of the rules than I stand guilty in telling the truth

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Carl Emerson said:

I have presented something for you to think about and suggested your response is contradictory and you respond by saying I am confused and satanic !!!!!!!

May the readers decide.

You may in fact be in breach of CF rules...

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It is a much greater offense to cause weak brethren to stumble with such doctrine and thoughts than breaking any supposed forum rules

“But when ye sin so against the brethren, and wound their weak conscience, ye sin against Christ.”
— 1 Corinthians 8:12 (KJV)

Graceisgraceworksareworks said:

This is not what the word says. The word says this

“Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.”
— Proverbs 3:5 (KJV)

You have made youreself the judge based on what you want to hear. If any part of Gods word cant be trust then none of it can. As far as manuscripts the Majority text all agree so there are no discrepancies or need to make your own judgements. God promised to give us his word and he did

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Look in the mirror.

Thanks for the convo.