THE EVANGELICAL CHURCH IS BREAKING APART Christians must reclaim Jesus from his church

renniks

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The progressive leaders don't last either. It's not a conservative problem... it's a problem with people wanting truth and not being given it. Blaming all this on politics is naive. I actually think it has more to do with the internet taking over culture. It's creating division over every little unimportant thing, and the church should be coming together around Jesus instead of bickering over side issues.
 
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ottawak

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So, do you think the only Good Christians will agree with you, and never vote Republican?
I sometimes vote Republican myself, but I would never vote for one of those Repuublicans who have added the Gospel according to Tucker Carlson to their Canon.
 
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Opdrey

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I know you haven't been here for very long, but you need to realize that discussions on these boards aren't always linear.

Whatever excuse you need. I know now that you want people to treat your points like trash since that is what you do. Luke 6:31
 
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childeye 2

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Regarding your last paragraph--I don't see the goal of politicians to be the punishing of sinners, but more of a maintaining of law and order. If a guy goes into a Walgreens and opens up a trash bag and just loads it up with merchandise and walks out, the police would be called because he just robbed the place which is a loss to the owner, and needs to be held accountable. If he isn't, then it sends a message to society that it's ok to just steal whatever you want without consequence. Society wouldn't hold up very well if that was allowed. However, I wouldn't call the police and say, "A guy just committed a sin and I need an officer to punish him for being a sinner." That's not the basis the law operates on. At the same time, the law and scripture both agree that theft is wrong. Republicans are in favor of law and order, and therefore are in agreement with scripture in that way.
As I said, I'm talking about those who think and speak the hypocrisy of a self-righteous view of sin like the Pharisees. And I showed a different view towards sin exhibited by a righteousness according to the Spirit of Christ. If you recall, you commented that "encouraging sin is what we do if we sit back and not even vote for a candidate who wants to stop whatever actions is being addressed". And to elaborate on those actions, you referenced the sin and therefore the perversity of child inappropriate contentography.

You also say Republicans are in favor of law and order and you give examples of stealing. Trump University was sued for false advertising, taking people's money for something it never delivered. Trump was openly saying that he walked in on teen beauty pageant contestants to view their nakedness simply because he could. And he also liked grabbing women because he could. Republicans voted for this guy.

You say Republicans are for law and order, but simply claiming that doesn't make it so, nor does it make Democrats against law and order. Surely every politician wants to be seen as righteous and for law and order and against child inappropriate content. Just saying how tough on crime they will be compared to their opponent is the typical carnal rhetoric and does not deserve my vote, even because it projects an ignorance that stealing and other sins are only stopped by fear of strict punishment.
 
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Opdrey

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Whatever excuse you need. I know now that you want people to treat your points like trash since that is what you do. Luke 6:31

Hey @Aldebaran , I loved the "laughing" icon. So you think the words of Jesus are a joke? Yikes.

EDITTED TO ADD: I NOTED YOU CHANGED YOUR RATING! Hilarious!

Caught ya! ;)

Don't worry, no one will notice.
 
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Aldebaran

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As I said, I'm talking about those who think and speak the hypocrisy of a self-righteous view of sin like the Pharisees. And I showed a different view towards sin exhibited by a righteousness according to the Spirit of Christ. If you recall, you commented that "encouraging sin is what we do if we sit back and not even vote for a candidate who wants to stop whatever actions is being addressed". And to elaborate on those actions, you referenced the sin and therefore the perversity of child inappropriate contentography.

You also say Republicans are in favor of law and order and you give examples of stealing. Trump University was sued for false advertising, taking people's money for something it never delivered. Trump was openly saying that he walked in on teen beauty pageant contestants to view their nakedness simply because he could. And he also liked grabbing women because he could. Republicans voted for this guy.

You say Republicans are for law and order, but simply claiming that doesn't make it so, nor does it make Democrats against law and order. Surely every politician wants to be seen as righteous and for law and order and against child inappropriate content. Just saying how tough on crime they will be compared to their opponent is the typical carnal rhetoric and does not deserve my vote, even because it projects an ignorance that stealing and other sins are only stopped by fear of strict punishment.

What would you rather have: A government with people who aren't perfect, but still implement laws that keep law and order? Or would you rather have people who talk so much about unity and peace, but them sow division between people based on their skin color, their beliefs, their income level, who they associate with, their vaccination status, and any number of other things?
I choose the first one.
 
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Aldebaran

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Hey @Aldebaran , I loved the "laughing" icon. So you think the words of Jesus are a joke? Yikes.

Oh, I thought you were making a joke. That whole thing you did with the "So you won't respond to my post, huh? Well I'll show you! I'm not gonna be treating you very nice anymore. You'll see!"

I mean, WOW! ^_^

I did get a good laugh out of it, so the post rating was quite accurate and sincere.
 
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Sketcher

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Do you think the evil atheists are using space lasers and using Nanobots in vaccines???
I don't, no. I don't think the Jews are using space lasers either.
I sometimes vote Republican myself, but I would never vote for one of those Repuublicans who have added the Gospel according to Tucker Carlson to their Canon.
OK, but do you think someone who would vote for say, Mike Pence, Nikki Haley, or Liz Cheney could be a good Christian, or not?
 
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Opdrey

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What would you rather have: A government with people who aren't perfect, but still implement laws that keep law and order? Or would you rather have people who talk so much about unity and peace, but them sow division between people based on their skin color, their beliefs, their income level, who they associate with, their vaccination status, and any number of other things?
I choose the first one.

The people who sow division based on skin color and beliefs are abhorrent. They fight to disenfranchise black votes, they decree their own religion the one that entire country is based on and they legislate against things that their holy book calls "sins" like homosexuality. They find ways to limit those "sinners" access to marital rights and try to make them second class citizens.

And many of the voters for these people who sow division based on skin color march with tiki torches and chant "Jews will not replace us" while they defend statues of traitorous defenders of slavery. Some of them drive cars into crowds of protestors killing people!

And the "income level" thing! Wow! The folks who fight against increasing the minimum wage and mock the poor for being poor, they are the worst! They show their true colors when they vote for tax breaks for the wealthy and eliminating help for the poor.

The worst.
 
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Opdrey

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Oh, I thought you were making a joke. That whole thing you did with the "So you won't respond to my post, huh? Well I'll show you! I'm not gonna be treating you very nice anymore. You'll see!"

No, I was pretty clear on the point. You just find the words of Jesus funny apparently.

I did get a good laugh out of it, so the post rating was quite accurate and sincere.

Well, I can't agree with you on this point. I don't find Jesus' words to always be so hilarious.
 
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Aldebaran

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The people who sow division based on skin color and beliefs are abhorrent. They fight to disenfranchise black votes, they decree their own religion the one that entire country is based on and they legislate against things that their holy book calls "sins" like homosexuality. They find ways to limit those "sinners" access to marital rights and try to make them second class citizens.

"Poor kids are just as bright and just as talented as white kids"---joe
"If you have a problem figuring out whether you're for me or Trump, then you ain't black."--joe
“You cannot go to a 7-Eleven or a Dunkin’ Donuts unless you have a slight Indian accent.”--joe
“They are used to being experimented on—the Tuskegee Airmen and others,”--joe
 
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Aldebaran

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No, I was pretty clear on the point. You just find the words of Jesus funny apparently.



Well, I can't agree with you on this point. I don't find Jesus' words to always be so hilarious.

You aren't Jesus.
 
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lsume

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This belongs in the American Politics forum, but if it needs to be moved, I'm indifferent. The article is dated but the problem ain't.

The basic argument is that many evangelicals have embraced their politics with religious fervor and have ditched the teachings of Jesus. And, perhaps it's an issue of catechism, i.e. their catechesis comes from media. Here are some lines from the article:

The root of the discord lies in the fact that many Christians have embraced the worst aspects of our culture and our politics. When the Christian faith is politicized, churches become repositories not of grace but of grievances, places where tribal identities are reinforced, where fears are nurtured, and where aggression and nastiness are sacralized.

The first step was the cultivation of the idea within the religious right that certain political positions were deeply Christian

“When Trump was able to add open hatred and resentments to the political-religious stance of ‘true believers,’ it crossed a line,” Marsden said. “Tribal instincts seem to have become overwhelming.”

“What we’re seeing is massive discipleship failure caused by massive catechesis failure,” James Ernest

Many Christians, though, are disinclined to heed calls for civility. They feel that everything they value is under assault, and that they need to fight to protect it

Fear has played a central role in the explosion of conflict within American evangelical churches


https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/10/evangelical-trump-christians-politics/620469/

Discuss.
The problem is most don’t follow the teachings of Jesus including some who appear to be angels of light. Lowly and meek is but one example Christ gave us.
 
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childeye 2

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What would you rather have: A government with people who aren't perfect, but still implement laws that keep law and order? Or would you rather have people who talk so much about unity and peace, but them sow division between people based on their skin color, their beliefs, their income level, who they associate with, their vaccination status, and any number of other things?
I choose the first one.
To follow Christ I need to love others as myself, and this means I have to see other's as myself. Therefore I don't accept any insinuation that Democrats are against law and order. Nor do I accept that people who want to do something about income inequality are divisive. It's perfectly reasonable to say that there is something wrong when so many people can work fulltime and yet can't afford a home.
 
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perplexed

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OK, but do you think someone who would vote for say, Mike Pence, Nikki Haley, or Liz Cheney could be a good Christian, or not?

yes , I think so

they can vote for Trump if they think the alternative is worse


I am beyond amazed at people why everyone does not recoil from Trump in the same way Ben Shapiro and Charles Krauthammer did when they did not vote for him in 2016 even though they knew Clinton was horrible
 
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ViaCrucis

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FWIW, I have never been to a service like that on July 4 or otherwise, and I would agree that is excessive.

What happened in that "service" wasn't excessive. It was an abomination. No less grotesque and abhorrent than offering a sacrifice of swine's blood in the Holy of Holies would have been.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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