Is the Lord's Day Saturday according to Acts of John (Apocryphal)?

SabbathBlessings said:

Amen! God is the authority of His day and He has clearly spoken.

Exodus 20:10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God
Isaiah 58:13 “If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the Lord honorable

God tells us this about all other days except the seventh day:
Exodus 20:9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work,

Sadly so many people harden their hearts from this very plain scripture.

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Simple right sis? All we need to do is to believe and follow what Gods' Word says. It is very clear. That is the choice I guess we all have. The question is coming to all of us and that is who do I believe and follow; God or man? Jesus says those who knowingly follow man-made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God are not following God in Matthew 15:3-9. Something we all need to consider very carefully.

God bless

BobRyan said:

apparently not...

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Sorry this one cracked me up. Thanks Bob

God bless

LoveGodsWord said:

Not at all. That could not be further from the truth. It means exactly what it says it means and that is Revelation 1:10 does not say John was in the Spirit on "the Lord's days" and John does not say he was in the Spirit every day of the week in Revelation 1:10. According to the scriptures no one enters into God's rest (Sabbath) by hardening their hearts in sin and unbelief according to Hebrews 3:8-19. Now what is it here from the scriptures shared in this post, that you do not believe?

Take Care.

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I do not believe YOUR TAKE on what the scripture says.

LoveGodsWord said: ↑ Not at all. That could not be further from the truth. It means exactly what it says it means and that is Revelation 1:10 does not say John was in the Spirit on "the Lord's days" and John does not say he was in the Spirit every day of the week in Revelation 1:10. According to the scriptures no one enters into God's rest (Sabbath) by hardening their hearts in sin and unbelief according to Hebrews 3:8-19. Now what is it here from the scriptures shared in this post, that you do not believe?

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Your response here...

Carl Emerson said:

I do not believe YOUR TAKE on what the scripture says.

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I see Carl so you think Revelation 1:10 is talking about "the Lords days" and not "the Lords day"? I cannot see that anywhere in the scriptures. That is just the same as I do not see anywhere in scriptures that we can harden our hearts in sin and unbelief and enter into God's rest according to Hebrews 3:8-19 that is defined in the scriptures as the "seventh day created from the foundation of the world" in Hebrews 4:3-4. Anyhow, that is fine Carl, what you believe is between you and God. I have only shared God's Word with you not mine. Our opinions do not really matter much in God's eyes. According to Jesus it is the words of God we accept or reject that become our judge come judgement day according to Jesus in John 12:47-48. The question remains however, who do we believe and follow; God or man? Sunday worship is a man-made teaching and tradition that has led many away from God and His Word to break His 4th commandments. It is Jesus not me that says if we knowingly follow man made teachings and traditions of men that lead us to break the commandments of God we are not worshiping God in Matthew 15:3-9. Something we should all at least pray about I guess.

Take Care.

LoveGodsWord said:

That is fine Carl, what you believe is between you and God. I have only shared God's Word with you not mine.

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Really - you are suggesting that your presentation of scripture is infallable???

Carl Emerson said:

Really - you are suggesting that your presentation of scripture is infallable???

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Carl that is not what I said anywhere. If I have never said or suggested any such thing then why are you pretending that I have? For me, only Gods' word is infallible and it is God's Word that has been shared with you. As posted earlier our opinions do not really matter much in God's eyes. Let's discuss the scriptures. What is it in the scriptures that have been shared with you that you are in disagreement with and why (scripture please)?

Well, that is a relief...

I have already outlined my position in the past.

I don't think the majority of believers who gather for worship on Sunday are going to hell.

I don't believe that God is calling all believers to worship on Saturday.

I do believe that God is inviting all to join Him in Sabbath Rest permanently and not just one day in seven.

Carl Emerson said:

Well, that is a relief...

I have already outlined my position in the past.

I don't think the majority of believers who gather for worship on Sunday are going to hell.

I don't believe that God is calling all believers to worship on Saturday.

I do believe that God is inviting all to join Him in Sabbath Rest permanently and not just one day in seven.

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Opinions don’t matter only God’s Word matters. Keeping the Sabbath holy is a commandment of God, not a suggestion Exodus 20:8 , just like we should not murder, lie, steal, vain God’s holy name or worship other god’s. God’s commandments came in a covenant of Ten, not nine or eight Exodus 34:28.

Sunday keeping is a tradition from man, hence why no one can find scripture about Sunday being God’s holy day or a day that God wants us to keep holy like we have with Saturday-Sabbath keeping Exodus 20:8-11 which is a commandment of God, personally written by the finger of God! This exact scenario came up in scripture where people were keeping mans traditions over the commandments and Jesus gave this warning and said when you keep traditions over commandments you are worshipping in vain. Matthew 15:3-9. There are lots of warnings in scripture but sadly people choose their ways instead of Christ ways. Christ kept the Sabbath and all of the commandments as our example to follow. Luke 4:16, 1 Peter 2:21 God bless

Carl Emerson said:

Let's face it - clearly a clash of spirits.

I will not sit back and see folks robbed of God's rest and come under legal obligation.

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Is it your claim that Christ is at war with His own Word??? seriously?

Shall we really say that "not taking God's name in vain" is robbing God and to be condemned as "legal obligation"??

Heb 8:6-12 tells us that it is Christ speaking at Sinai - your argument that Honoring His Word - regarding His own memorial of His own act as Creator - is robbery - speaks for itself. Your argument goes to extremes.

Kilk1 said:

Hello! The other day, I was discussing Sabbatarianism on a thread, and @Torah Keeper said that the Acts of John (Apocryphal) supports the view that the Lord's Day is Saturday. Here's the text in question:

And on the seventh day, it being the Lord's day, he said to them: Now it is time for me also to partake of food. And having washed his hands and face, he prayed, and brought out the linen cloth, and took one of the dates, and ate it in the sight of all.​

To that, @Leaf473 replied, "To me, it's unclear if it refers to the 7th day of the week or the 7th Day of John's fast." Is @Leaf473's interpretation correct, or does the text support the idea that the Lord's Day is on the seventh day of the week? If the latter, then when was this text written? Thanks!

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Are you asking when the entire document was written?

The best guess is that it is a collection of stories, some dating from the early 100's AD. That's not too long after John himself lived.

Acts of John - Wikipedia

LoveGodsWord said:

"The Lords' day" is not Sunday according to the scriptures and never has been.

So what day is "the Lords day" according to the scriptures or Jesus?

Matthew 12:8 For the son of man is Lord even of the Sabbath day.

Well there you have it. According to Jesus he is the Lord of the Sabbath day. That is the Sabbath is "the Lords day from the very words of Jesus. Now who should we believe and follow; God or man? (Romans 3:4; Acts of the Apostles 5:29).

Take Care all

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The thread title is asking according to the Acts of John.

Why does it matter? Because those who lived close to the time of the apostles, those who grew up with the same culture and language, may have valuable insights into what the apostles meant.

One can compare the passage from the Acts of John to Ignatius of Antioch, who was a disciple of the apostle John (or possibly a disciple of a disciple).

"...no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord’s Day..."

Quotes from Early Church Fathers: the Sabbath, Lord's Day, and Worship - Apostles Creed

JSRG said:

Looking at the text, it is not entirely clear whether the seventh day refers to the seventh day of the week or John's fast. I don't think any conclusion one way or the other is warranted. However, if I absolutely had to go one way or the other, I would guess that it means the seventh day of John's fast. In the early Christian texts I have seen--though I admit I am far from an expert on them--when referring to Saturday, saying "the seventh day" seems very rare outside of when referring to the creation narrative. Normally "Sabbath" is used to refer to Saturday, and when you see "seventh day" (outside of statements regarding the creation narrative) it refers to the seventh day of some other time period. To say "seventh day" without adding "of the week" for specification would therefore be, at least from what I have seen, unusual.

But with what we have, I don't think we can say one way or the other for sure.

What is the other thread you are referring to? It would be useful to have context for this topic.

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I can't find it, for sure.

It may be this one
Church Fathers support early date of Revelation

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Edit:
Okay, so @Kilk1 posted again on that thread and gave links to the section where we discuss it. (And thank you for that, @Kilk1)
The Sabbath: Universal law or Mosaic shadow?

The discussion on that particular topic starts about here
The Sabbath: Universal law or Mosaic shadow?

It just goes on for a few posts, if I remember right. It's mixed in among other posts from the thread.

If you've already read that section of the Acts of John, I think you're pretty much up to speed on that discussion.

SabbathBlessings said:

Opinions don’t matter only God’s Word matters. Keeping the Sabbath holy is a commandment of God, not a suggestion Exodus 20:8 , just like we should not murder, lie, steal, vain God’s holy name or worship other god’s. God’s commandments came in a covenant of Ten, not nine or eight Exodus 34:28.

Sunday keeping is a tradition from man, hence why no one can find scripture about Sunday being God’s holy day or a day that God wants us to keep holy like we have with Saturday-Sabbath keeping Exodus 20:8-11 which is a commandment of God, personally written by the finger of God! This exact scenario came up in scripture where people were keeping mans traditions over the commandments and Jesus gave this warning and said when you keep traditions over commandments you are worshipping in vain. Matthew 15:3-9. There are lots of warnings in scripture but sadly people choose their ways instead of Christ ways. Christ kept the Sabbath and all of the commandments as our example to follow. Luke 4:16, 1 Peter 2:21 God bless

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Thank you for your opinion.

BobRyan said:

Is it your claim that Christ is at war with His own Word??? seriously?

Shall we really say that "not taking God's name in vain" is robbing God and to be condemned as "legal obligation"??

Heb 8:6-12 tells us that it is Christ speaking at Sinai - your argument that Honoring His Word - regarding His own memorial of His own act as Creator - is robbery - speaks for itself. Your argument goes to extremes.

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Thank you for you opinion.

Leaf473 said:

The thread title is asking according to the Acts of John.

Why does it matter? Because those who lived close to the time of the apostles, those who grew up with the same culture and language, may have valuable insights into what the apostles meant.

One can compare the passage from the Acts of John to Ignatius of Antioch, who was a disciple of the apostle John (or possibly a disciple of a disciple).

"...no longer observing the Sabbath, but living in the observance of the Lord’s Day..."

Quotes from Early Church Fathers: the Sabbath, Lord's Day, and Worship - Apostles Creed

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No. The thread title says .. Is the Lord's Day Saturday according to Acts of John (Apocryphal)? These so called "Church fathers" are not scripture and many of them in my view if they teach tradition over the scriptures they have no weight with me if your trying to put them before Gods' Word. My claim would simply be where is the scriptures that teach "Sunday" is "the Lords day"? - There is none.

Sunday worship is a teaching and tradition of some in the early Church (many continued keeping the Sabbath) that has led many away from God and His Word to break God's 4th commandment. Jesus in Matthew 15:3-9 says that if we knowingly follow man-made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God we are not worshiping God. If we are not worshiping God by breaking Gods' commandments through tradition who are we worshiping God or man? This is the test that will becoming to everyone of us.

God's people according to the scriptures I believe are in every Church (John 10:16) and in times of ignorance when we do not know any better God winks at but when he gives us a knowledge of the truth of His Word calls all men every where to believe and follow it (Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31; James 4:17; Hebrews 10:26-31). Jesus says that the hour is coming and now is that the true worshipers wherever they might be must worship the father in Spirit and in truth for God is a Spirit and those who worship Him must worship Him in Spirit and in truth (Mark 4:23-24).

BABYLON has fallen *Revelation 14:7-12; Revelation 17:1-5 and God is calling His people out from following man made teachings and traditions to return to the pure Word of God *Revelation 18:1-5. According to Jesus, God's sheep will hear His Voice (the Word) and follow him. Those who do not hear will not follow because they are not His sheep (John 10:26-27).

Jesus is calling us back to His Word. "Fear God therefore and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters." - Revelation 14:7. God's 4th commandment "seventh day" Sabbath *Exodus 20:8-11 is one of Gods' 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken according to Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4 and according to James if we knowingly break anyone of them we stand guilty before God of sin in James 2:10-11.

Take Care

Torah Keeper said:

Genesis 1-2 tells us which Day it is.

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It tells us God rested on the seventh day, but obviously the universe was not made in six literal days. The idea He did that is scientifically proven to be utter nonsense. So the word "day" in those chapters can't be the same amount of time as the seventh day commandment in Exodus.

Carl Emerson said:

Romans 14:6
He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

There is clearly no sin either way.

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. . .

Carl Emerson said:

I do not believe YOUR TAKE on what the scripture says.

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. . .

Carl Emerson said:

Really - you are suggesting that your presentation of scripture is infallable???

Click to expand...

. . .

Carl Emerson said:

Well, that is a relief...
I have already outlined my position in the past.
I don't think the majority of believers who gather for worship on Sunday are going to hell.
I don't believe that God is calling all believers to worship on Saturday.
I do believe that God is inviting all to join Him in Sabbath Rest permanently and not just one day in seven.

Click to expand...

. . .

Our full-time Sabbath rest from our own work to save, and in Jesus' work which saves to the uttermost.

Jesus is the fulfillment of the law (Matthew 5:17), including the Sabbath.