We are Not to Speak Against the Torah

(CLV) Ja 4:11
Do not be speaking against one another, brethren. He who is speaking against a brother, or judging his brother, is speaking against law and is judging law. Now if you are judging law, you are not a doer of law, but a judge.

We are to do the Torah, not speak against it.

Omegatime said:

The doctrine of Christ takes precedence over the Torah.
2 John 1:9
Whosoever transgresseth,
and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ,
hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ,
he hath both the Father and the Son.

Click to expand...

The doctrine of Yahshua IS the Torah.

He spent his entire ministry teaching from it.

By the way, Yacob, brother of Yahshua, leader of the congregation under Yahshua, wrote this after Yahshua had ascended.

Omegatime said:

The doctrine of Christ is not the Torah and Jesus did not spend His
entire ministry teaching it.

Click to expand...

This should get you started: Jesus quotes of the Old Testament

He also quoted much scripture that is not included in the Pharisee canon that King James adopted.

Omegatime said:

The doctrine of Christ is not the Torah

Click to expand...

I already debunked this. Repeating bare assertion fallacies doesn't make them come true.

Omegatime said:

You did not debunk anything. All you did is give us another
phrase from your unproven opinion of what you perceive as the truth.

Click to expand...

I gave you a link to a short list as proof. Maybe you missed the link. So far you've provided an unsupported opinion.

Omegatime said:

This again is your unproven opinion.

Click to expand...

List of Old Testament texts quoted in the New Testament:

Gen 1:27

Matt 19:4

Gen 5:2

Mark 10:6

Gen 2:2

Heb 4:4

Gen 2:7

1 Cor 15:45

Gen 2:24

Matt 19:5, Mark 10:7-8,1 Cor 6:17, Eph 5:31

Gen 5:24

Heb 11:5

Gen 12:1

Acts 7:3

Gen 12:3

Gal 3:8

Gen 12:7

Acts 7:5

Gen 13:15

Gal 3:16

Gen 14:17-20

Heb 7:1-2

Gen 15:5

Rom 4:18

Gen 15:6

Rom 4:3,9,22, Gal 3:6, Jas 2:23

Gen 15:13-14

Acts 7:6-7

Gen 17:5

Rom 4:17

Gen 17:7

Gal 3:16

Gen 17:8

Acts 7:5

Gen 18:10

Rom 9:9

Gen 18:14

Rom 9:9

Gen 21:10

Gal 4:30

Gen 21:22

Rom 9:7, Heb 11:18

Gen 22:16-17

Heb 6:13-14

Gen 22:18

Acts 3:15

Gen 25:23

Rom 9:12

Gen 25:23

Rom 9:12

Gen 38:8

Luke 20:28

Gen 47:31

Heb 11:21

Ex 1:8

Acts 7:18

Ex 2:14

Acts 7:27-28,38

Ex 5:2

Acts 7:30

Ex 3:5-10

Acts 7:33-34

Ex 3:6

Matt 22:32

Ex 3:15

Mark 12:26, Acts 3:13

Ex 4:16

Rom 9:17

Ex 5:18

Jam 2:11

Ex 12:46

John 19:36

Ex 13:2

Luke 2:23

Ex 16:18

2 Cor 8:15

Ex 19:6

1 Pet 2:9

Ex 19:12-13

Heb 12:20

Ex 20:12-16

Matt 19:18-19

Ex 20:13

Matt 5:21

Ex 20:13-17

Rom 13:2 9

Ex 20:12

Matt 15:4

Ex 20:14

Matt 5:27

Ex 20:17

Rom 7:7

Ex 21:17

Matt 15:4, Mark 7:10

Ex 21:24

Matt 5:38

Ex 22:27

Acts 23:5

Ex 24:8

Heb 9:20

Ex 25:40

Heb 8:5

Ex 32:1

Acts 7:40

Ex 32:6

1 Co 10:17

Ex 33:19

Rom 9:15

Lev 10:9

Luke 1:15

Lev 12:8

Luke 2:24

Lev 18:5

Rom 10:5, Gal 3:12

Lev 19:2

1 Pet 1:16

Lev 19:12, Num 30:2

Matt 5:33

Lev 19:18

Mark 12:33

Lev 19:18

Matt 5:43,19:19,22:39

Lev 19:18

Mark 12:31, Gal 5:14,Jam 2:

Lev 23:29

Acts 3:23

Lev 24:20

Matt 5:38

Lev 26:12

2 Co 6:16

Num 16:

2 Tim 2:19

Num 27:17

Matt 9:36

Deut 5:16-20

Mark 10:1, Luke 18:20

Deut 24:14

Mark 10:19

Deut 5:16

Mark 7:10, Eph 6:2-3

Deut 5:17

Jas 2:11

Deut 4:24

Heb 12:29

Deut 4:3

Mark 12:32

Deut 6:5

Luke 10:27

Deut 6:4-5

Mark 12:29-30

Deut 6:5

Matt 22:37

Deut 6:13

Matt 4:10, Luke 4:8

Deut 6:16

Matt 4:7, Luke 4:12

Deut 8:3

Matt 4:4, Luke 4:4

Deut 9:4

Rom 10:6

Deut 30:12-14

Rom 10:6-8

Deut 9:19

Heb 12:21

Deut 17:7

1 Co 5:13

Deut 18:15-16

Acts 7:37, 3:12

Deut 19:15

Matt 18:16,2 Co 13:1

Deut 21:23

Gal 3:13

Deut 24:1,3

Matt 5:31, Matt 19:7, Mark 10:4

Deut 25:4

1 Co 9:9,1 Tim 5:18

Deut 25:5,7

Matt 22:24, Mark 12:19

Deut 27:26,

Gal 3:10

Deut 29:3

Rom 11:8

Deut 30:12-14

Heb 13:5

Deut 32:21

Rom 10:19

Deut 32:35-36

Rom 12:19

Deut 32:43

Rom 15:10

1 Sam 12:22

Rom 11:2

1 Sam 13:14

Acts 13:22

2 Sam 7:8

2 Co 6:18

2 Sam 7:14

Heb 1:5

2 Sam 22:50

Rom 15:9

1 Ki 19:10,12

Rom 11:3

1 Ki 19:`8

Rom 11:4

2 Ki 1:10,11

Luke 9:54, Rev 20:9

1 Chr 17:13

Rev 21:7

2 Ch 18:16, 30:2

Mark 6:34

Job 5:13

1 Co 3:19

Job 16:19

Mark 11:10

Job 41:3

Rom 11:35

Ps 2:7

Acts 13:33, Heb 1:5,5:5

Ps 2:9

Rev 2:26-27

Ps 4:5

Eph 4:26

Ps 5:10

Rom 3:13

Ps 6:9

Matt 7:23

Ps 8:2

Matt 21:16

Ps 8:5-7

Heb 2:6-8, 1 Co 15:27

Ps 10:7

Rom 3:14

Ps 14:1-3

Rom 3:10-12

Ps 16:8-11

Acts 2:25-28, 2:31,13:35

Ps 19:5

Rom 10:18

Ps 22:1

Matt 27:46, Mark 15:34

Ps 22:18

John 19:24, Matt 27:35, Mark 15:24, Luke 23:24

Ps 22:23

Heb 2:12

Ps 24:1

1 Co 10:26

Ps 31:6

Luke 23:46

Ps 32:1-2

Rom 4:7-8

Ps 34:9

1 Pet 2:3

Ps 34:13-17

1 Pet 3:10-12

Ps 34:21

Joh 15:25

Ps 36:2

Rom 3:18

Ps 40:10

Heb 10:5-7

Ps 41:10

Joh 13:18

Psa 42:5,11

Matt 26:38

Ps 43:5

Mark 14:34

Ps 44:23

Rom 8:36

Ps 45:7-8

Heb 1:8-9

Ps 51:6

Rom 3:4

Ps 62:12

Matt 16:27

Pro, 24:12

Rom 2:6

Ps 68:19

Eph 4:8

Ps 69:10

Joh 2:17

Ps 69:23-24

Rom 11:9-10

Ps 69:26

Acts 1:20

Ps 78:2

Matt 13:35

Ps 78:24

Joh 6:31

Ps 82:6

Joh 10:34

Ps 86:9

Rev 15:4

Ps 91:11-12

Matt 4:6, Luke 4:10-11

Ps 94:11

1 Co 3:20

Ps 95:7-11

Heb 3:7-11, 3:15,4:3,5,7

Ps 102:26-28

Heb 1:10-12

Ps 104:4

Heb 1:7

Ps 104:12

Matt 13:32, Mark 4:32, Luke 13:19

Ps 110:1

Matt 22:44, Mark 12:36, Luke 20:42-43, Acts 2:34-35, Heb 1:13

Ps 110:4

Heb 5:6,-10, Heb 7:17,21

Ps 111:2

Rev 15:3-4

Ps 112:9

2 Co 9:9

Ps 116:10

2 Co 4:13

Ps 117:2

Rom 15:11

Ps 118:6

Heb 13:6

Ps 118:22-23

Matt 21:42, Mark 12:10-11, Luke 20:17

Ps 118:22

Acts 4:11, 1 Pet 2:7

Ps 118:25-26

Matt 21:9,Mark 11:9-10, Joh 12:13, Matt 23:39

Ps 118:26

Luke 13:35, Luke 19:38

Ps 132:11

Acts 2:30

Pro 3:11-12

Heb 12:5-6

Pro 3:34

Jam 4:6, 1 Pet 5:5

Pro 11:31

1 Pet 4:18

Pro 25:21-22

Rom 12:20

Pro 26:11

2 Pet 2:22

Isa 1:9

Rom 9:29

Isa 6:9-10

Matt 13:14-15, Mark 4:12, Acts 28:26-27

Isa 6:9

Luke 8:10

Isa 6:10

Joh 12:40

Isa 7:14

Matt, 1:23

Isa 8:12-13

1 Pet 3:14-15

Isa 8:17-18

Heb 2:13

Isa 9:1-2

Matt 4:15-16

Isa 11:10

Rom 15:12

Isa 13:10

Matt 24:29, Mark 13:24-25

Isa 34:4

Luke 21:26

Isa 22:13

1 Co 15:32

Isa 25:8

1 Co 15:54, Rev 7:17

Isa 26:19

Matt 11:5

Isa 35:5-6

Luke 7:22

Isa 26:20

Heb 10:37-38

Isa 28:11-12

1 Co 14:21

Isa 29:13

Matt 15:8-9, Mark 1:3, Joh 1:23

Isa 40:6-8

1 Pet 1:24-25

Isa 40:13

Rom 11:34, 1 Co 2:16

Isa 42:1-4

Matt 12:18-21

Isa 45:23

Rom 14:11

Isa 49:6

Acts 13:47

Isa 49:8

2 Co 6:2

Isa 52:5

Rom 2:24

Isa 52:7

Rom 10:15

Isa 52:11

2 Co 6:17

Isa 52:15

Rom 15:21

Isa 53:1

Joh 12:38, Rom 8:17

Isa 53:7-8

Acts 8:32-33

Isa 53:9

1 Pet 2:23

Isa 53:12

Luke 22:37

Isa 54:1

Gal 4:27

Isa 54:13

Joh 6:45

Isa 55:3

Acts 13:34

Isa 55:10

2 Co 9:10

Isa 56:7

Matt 21:13

Jer 7:11

Mark 11:17, Luke 19:46

Isa 59:7-8

Rom 3:15-17

Isa 59:20-21

Rom 11:26-27

Isa 61:1-2

Luke 4:18-19

Isa 62:11

Matt 21:5

Isa 64:3

1 Co 2:9

Isa 65:1-2

Rom10:10-21

Isa 65:17

2 Pet 3:13

Isa 66:1-2

Acts 7:49-50

Jer 5:21

Mark 8:18

Jer 9:23

1 Co 1:31, 2 Co 10:17

Jer31:15

Matt 2:18

Jer 31:31-34

Heb 8:8-12

Ezk 11:20

Rev 21:7

Ezk 37:5, 10

Rev 11:11

Dan 3:6

Matt13:42, 50

Dan 7:13

Matt 24:30, 26:64, Mark 13:26,14:62, Luke 21:27,22:69

Dan 9:27

Matt 24:15

Dan 11:31

Mark 13:14

Hos 2:1, 3

Rom 9:25-28

Hos 6:6

Matt 9:13, Matt 12:7

Hos 10:8

Luke 23:30, Rev 6:16

Hos 11:1

Matt 2:15

Hos 13:14

1 Co 15:55

Joel 3:1-5

Acts 2:17-21, Rom 10:13

Amos 5:25-27

Acts 7:42-43

Amos 9:11-12

Acts 15:16-17

Jonah 2:17

Matt 12:40

Mic 5:2

Matt 2:6

Mic 7:6

Matt 10:35-36

Hab 2:3-4

Rom 1:17, Gal 3:11

Hab 1:5

Acts 13:41

Hag 2:6, 21

Heb 12:26

Zac 8:16

Eph 4:25

Zech 9:9

Joh 12:15

Zac 11:12-13

Matt 27:9-10

Zac 12:10

Joh 19:37

Zac 13:7

Matt 26:31, Mark 14:27

Mal 1:2-3

Rom 9:13

Mal 3:1

Matt 11:10, Mark 1:2,Luke 7:27

Mal 4:5-6

Matt 17:10-11

A list of Old Testament books quoted by Jesus and other New Testament writers.

Again this is a short list. It doesn't include any of the quotes from the books that were rejected by the Pharisees.

Carl Emerson said:

Faith Brings Righteousness
3 You foolish Galatians, who has bewitched you, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was publicly portrayed as crucified? 2 This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by works of the Law, or by hearing with faith? 3 Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh? 4 Did you suffer so many things in vain—if indeed it was in vain? 5 So then, does He who provides you with the Spirit and works miracles among you, do it by works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?

6 Just as Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness. 7 Therefore, recognize that it is those who are of faith who are sons of Abraham. 8 The Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, “All the nations will be blessed in you.” 9 So then, those who are of faith are blessed with Abraham, the believer.

10 For all who are of works of the Law are under a curse; for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not abide by all the things written in the book of the Law, to do them.” 11 Now, that no one is justified by the Law before God is evident; for, “the righteous one will live by faith.” 12 However, the Law is not of faith; on the contrary, “The person who performs them will live by them.” 13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law, having become a curse for us—for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”— 14 in order that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham would come to the Gentiles, so that we would receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

Click to expand...

Yes it does. The Hebrew word for faith is not so abstract as the Greek. Faithfulness would be a closer rendering.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:6
Everyone who is remaining in Him is not sinning. Everyone who is sinning °sees Him not, neither knows Him.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:7
Little children, let no one be deceiving you. He who is doing righteousness is just, according as He is just.

Kylism said:

When I look at James 4:11 and the verse above and below it seems to me that the main focus here is we are not to [slander, speak against, evil of] another fellow believer because we are making our self to be the judge of a person's heart, intentions, the final say on a person, etc. So verses 10,11, and 12 mention "humbling", "judging the Law", "one Lawgiver and Judge".

When "HARK" wrote "We are to do the Torah, not speak against it." I think you have lost the focus. Change "it" to "fellow believers".

Click to expand...

I completely recognized the focus of the message; but that facet is built on the deeper underlying principle. The subject is qualified by that principle.

Oscarr said:

Paul was clear in Romans 3 that if a person is going to live by the Law, he is obligated to follow it without fault. Once infraction, however small, is a breach of the Law and therefore the person cannot be justified by keeping the Law because he, by his infraction, has shown that he cannot keep it.

Click to expand...

Let's review what Paul said about the Torah.

(CLV) Ro 3:31
Are we, then, nullifying law through faith? May it not be coming to that! Nay, we are sustaining law.

Christ, our Lord. Consequently, then, I myself, with the mind, indeed, am slaving for God's law, yet with the flesh for Sin's law.

(CLV) Ac 25:8
Paul defending that "Neither against the law of the Jews, nor against the sanctuary, nor against Caesar did I any sin."

(CLV) Php 3:6
in relation to zeal, persecuting the ecclesia, in relation to the righteousness which is in law, becoming blameless.

(CLV) 1Co 11:1
Become imitators of me, according as I also am of Christ.

Oscarr said:

This is why Paul says that there is none righteous, no, not one; and we all have gone our own way. This is because no one has been able to keep the Law without fault, and inability to keep the whole Law without fault brings condemnation to the person who lives by and teaches that others need to keep the Law.

Click to expand...

Paul was quoting the TaNaK when he said that.

There you will find the context.

No One is Just?

myst33 said:

The New Testament did not quote the today's Jewish Bible, though. They quoted the Greek one, mostly.

Click to expand...

They quoted the LXX more often than the Masoretic Text; but they did quote both. They also quoted books not found in either of those texts such as the Book of Jubilees.

Is the Book of Jubilees Torah?

MJ Only - Jubilees is Torah According to 4Q266