Who Justifieth the Ungodly

Faithful777 said:

The opposite is said, they are required to suffer dearly for being chosen ( in obligation of works.).


Acts 9:15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:
16 For I will shew him how great things he must suffer for my name's sake.

1 Corinthians 9:16
For though I preach the gospel, I have nothing to glory of: for necessity is laid upon me; yea, woe is unto me, if I preach not the gospel!



It is also confirmed in the same Eph 1, how they need the Spirit, or they are given NOTHING..


Ephesians 1:17 That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give unto you the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him:
18 The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

Click to expand...

I dont know what you talking about. Did you want to discuss the points of the post ?

What is Justification ?

One writer wrote and I quote:

Justification is an act of God's Sovereign pleasure constituting persons Righteous in the Righteousness of Another and eternally promising to the Lord Redeemer, a discharge to them upon his engagement to perform Covenant conditions perfectly for them. This sovereign Will and Compact of God that unalterably fixes the end, fixes the means conducing thereunto; and this is one of the principal means, that they should of themselves lose their own personal righteousness in Adam their Head, so that they might be alone completely Righteous in the Righteousness of the Redeemer. So far as they are to be understood to have a Representative being in their Everlasting Head, so far as considered in Him they were never otherwise than righteous. Richard Davis {Vindication of the Doctrine of Justification and Union before Faith, 1698.}

Click to expand...

Now Two Points of note here. That is all the conditions for Justification before God, hath been fulfilled by Christ, for each Person He knew and died for Isa 53:11

11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many;[Why?] for he shall bear their iniquities.

It was also said of Old of Him to them I have given thee a Covenant unto the People/ Gentiles Isa 42:6-7

6 I the Lord have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

This scripture passage informs us a Mystery, that some Gentiles were partakers of the Covenant's of Promise made to Israel Eph 2:11-12

11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;

12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. Which Blood is that of the New Covenant Matt 26:28

Isa 42:6 is such Covenant Promise to Israel

Also this Covenant is the Everlasting Covenant, known in time as the New Covenant.

Secondly ,It should not be ignored that the blessed effects of the Covenant, which Christ fulfilled, that these effects are made good to the Heirs of the Covenant, not for their sakes primarily, but for the sake of Him who fulfilled all the conditions of the Covenant, on their behalf, Christ ! For instance, forgiveness of all their sins [Justification] is for HIS SAKE as stated here 1 Jn 2:12

12 I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake.

This is a bullet to the head to all conditionalist, who falsely teach one is forgiven upon conditions, such as faith or repentance, thats not Truth, they are forgiven for His Names Sake. More scripture to confirm this point Eph 4:32

32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

And since Christ is also God it reads Isa 43:25

25 I, even I, am he that blotteth out thy transgressions for mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins.

Thats remission of sins also. Sins can never be charged to anyone Christ died for as a matter of condemnation, that is why forgiveness of sins is also a branch of Justification !

This should stop the mouth's of those false teachers who conditions forgiveness or Justification before God on the sake of mens performances, such as Faith or Repentance!

The Difference !

There is a big difference in Justification before God by the Death of Christ, and Justification before our conscious by the Gift of Faith given in the New Birth. Yes even conscious Justification which brings purification and peace of heart or mind, however receiving those blessings are not Justification itself, that fact is purely and solely accomplished by the Work of Christ, His Blood, which took away our sins, before the Law and Justice of God ! His Blood cleanses us from all sin, whether we believe it or not or know it or not, that fact still remains and is credited solely to the Blood of Christ ! Rom 5:9

9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Notice Justification while being saved is future !

What is Justification by Faith ?

Justification by faith is God's declaring personally to a person, in their consciousness, that by Christ, His Blood, they are made just, they are forgiven of all their sins, have no condemnation in Christ, so that the person perceives and lays hold of this Divine declaration by Holy Spirit given Faith. Faith or believing in Christ is not an act man performs as an condition in order to their Justification before God, for that automatically defaults to Justification by my works, and not by faith in its proper sense. Therefore faith is the primary instrument by which God declares or makes known to the Justified, that he or she is Justified, so faith is the substance of things hoped for , the reality of things [spiritual] not seen.77

The Resurrection of Christ declares Justification before God !

Rom 4:25

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Thats Right, Christ's Resurrection equals our Justification if He died for our offences !

That all those for whom Christ died, being that all their offenses were imputed to His account, so that for them He was delivered to death, so it was, that when He was raised again, it was for or because of their Justification, that is to say, that His Resurrection was a declaration of His and their Justification before God. It does not say that He rose again for the future purpose of their Justification, but because of, for that reason, was He raised again, because of their [The Ones He died for] Justification ! If Christ had not risen, faith would be vain, because those He died for would yet still be in their sins, unjustified before God.

Those who teach that Christ's Death alone does not satisfy God's Law and Justice for their Justification before God, but a subsequent work of the Spirit is needed or any type of application of it is needed to the ones Justified by Christ's Blood, they are liars and Antichrist ! Thats taking away from the Accomplishment of Christ's Blood alone !

When one is Justified by Faith in time, it is when God has made known to them the Mystery of His Will or Decree of their Eternal Justification, it is then they are being made consciously aware of God's Justifying sentence, that was from Eternity due to His Eternal Purpose in Christ Eph 3:11 and that Eternal Compact or Agreement in the Everlasting Covenant between the Father and Son, the Spirit bearing witness, for God makes the Covenant known to Spiritual Faith 2 Sam 23:5 81

Although my house be not so with God; yet he hath made with me an everlasting covenant, ordered in all things, and sure: for this is all my salvation, and all my desire, although he make it not to grow.

Ps 25:14

14 The secret of the Lord is with them that fear him; and he will shew them his covenant.

So being Justified by Faith in Time is nothing less than being made known to us our Eternal Interest in God's Eternal Covenant with His Son, and our interest in the Blood of the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13:20, and this was before being revealed to us a Mystery of God's Will Eph 1:7-9

7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;

9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

Thats Justification by Faith !

Christ Resurrection and Justification !

Rom 4:25

25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

Justification by or at the resurrection of Jesus Christ, those who are most ignorant of the accomplishment of Christ's Death, that it did in fact Justify those He died for, they are guilty of denying the very witness of the Resurrection of Christ ! Let me explain, The Life and Death of Christ has fulfilled God's Law in its entirety, all of its Holy Requirements, Obedience to all of its precepts, and even Death for its Transgression, so all for whom He died is Justified by His Death ! Isa 53:11

11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

Now what does knowledge here mean in context of the subject of the verse ? Many believe that it refers to the knowledge of the one being Justified by Christ's Death, their Faith ! Even though I can see that, yet the verse says by His Knowledge, that is by the Knowledge of the Righteous Servant shall He Justify many ! This Knowledge must be connected somehow to His Death. The word for knowledge here is the Hebrew Word da`ath and means:


knowledge

a) knowledge, perception, skill

b) discernment, understanding, wisdom

This word is derived from the Hebrew Word yada which means:


to know by experience

So its by His experience with Death or by His Tasting of Death Heb 2:9

9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

The word taste here is the greek word geuomai and means:


to taste, to try the flavour of

2) to taste

a) i.e. perceive the flavour of, partake of, enjoy

b) to feel, make trial of, experience

3) to take food, eat, to take nourishment, eat

So by His Experiencing Death, experiencing its flavor, by it He Justified many, because He bare their sin, again pointing to His Death !

GWT He will see and be satisfied because of his suffering. My righteous servant will acquit many people because of what he has learned [through suffering]. He will carry their sins as a burden.

This Translation compares to what the Writer of Hebrews Wrote here Heb 5:8

8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;

The word learned here means:

to learn, be apprised

a) to increase one's knowledge, to be increased in knowledge

b) to hear, be informed

c) to learn by use and practice

1) to be in the habit of, accustomed to

So, Isa 53:11 is a clear proclamation that the Death of Christ alone, made those whom sins He bare Justified before God !

And so their Justification here is not their Justification by Faith, which will occur at a later time, because the promise is " The Just [or Justified] shall live by Faith.

Now that we know from scripture that we were Justified by His Death, that is what His Resurrection Proves Rom 4:25

25 Who was delivered for our offences [ He bare our Sins Isa 53:11], and was raised again for[Because of ] our justification.

The Resurrection of Christ is God's Testimony public ally that those Christ died for, bare their sins, that they were Justified, and faith shall later receive the Testimony of God !

So to say that one for whom Christ died was not solely Justified before God by Christ's Death, is to Call God a Liar and the Resurrection a Liar !

More on Justification Rom 8:30

Rom 8:30

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Those here in this context that God calls, its an effectual call, and all those thus called are Justified, no exceptions, this Justification that follows the call in time is making known Justification by the revealing of imputed Righteousness by the Gospel Rom 1:16-17, its when the called receives by faith a consciousness of the imputed obedience and satisfaction of Christ unto them as their Righteousness. They now receive and rest on Christ and His Righteousness revealed, by Faith, which faith they have not of themselves, this faith is also the Gift of God, Phil 1:29, Yes this faith accompanies Salvation Heb 6:9

9 But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak.83

Believeth on Him that Justifies the Ungodly !


Rom 4:5

5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

The fact of the matter is this, ones believing [active] is the fruit of God's Justifying. Lets look at Acts 13:38-39

38 Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins:

39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

In Vs 39 lets understand, Now all that by Him [ His Cross Work] all that believe, which in the greek is a present active participle, which means "is believing" they are in a present state of believing [ see also Jn 3:16 believe there in greek] are Justified, which word is present passive indicative which means: are being Justified, So everyone believing is Justified, by this here Paul gives us the results of being Justified, for a person cannot be Justified by his faith which is active, while Justification before God is passive, so conclusion, mans active Faith or believing is the fruit of or result of being Justified ! God was Justifying them while Ungodly, not while they were believing. For when one is believing, he is not being ungodly but pleasing God !

Rom 8:33

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

Paul here means non imputation as in Rom 4:7-8

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute or sin or lay sin to his charge.

Rom 8:33 says that one is Justified !

Now if God justifies the elect legally because of non imputation of sin, and Justification also means to be declared righteous; then it stands to reason that at the same hour of non imputation, there was imputation of Christ's Righteousness, since God must first see us as Righteous legally in order to declare us Righteous legally, which Righteousness is not our own Rom 4:6-8 !

For Christ's Righteousness is ever before God's Law and Justice on behalf of The chosen ones; and this Righteousness is objective Righteousness, for its based entirely from without the Elect, they are not even born again, its solely based upon the Perfect Work of Christ !

Note: Christ's Righteousness became the Elects Righteousness by imputation when their sins became His by imputation !

What is application of Justification ?

Many today, false teachers, hath willfully mistaken Justification before God from ones sins by non imputation, and instead they were imputed to Christ, for non imputation automatically means imputation to Christ 2 Cor 5:19-21


19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

Now when we come to believe by faith that our sins were laid upon Christ, its not the same time as when our sins were laid upon Him. For God before we believed, had already imputed our sins on Christ, first He did in His Eternal Purpose Rev 13:8

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain [In God's Purpose] from the foundation of the world.

Now if Christ was slain in God's Purpose from the foundation of the world, then it was that He was slain for the sins of those sins that had been imputed to Him from the foundation of the world ! Also see 1 Pet 1:20

Secondly, in time at the Cross of Christ when the Father did forsake Him because of our sins imputed.

Now faith is that which embraces the Truth of the Gospel of ones Salvation, if indeed it is God given Faith. The word of Truth informs us of a past transaction of imputation 2 Cor 5:19-21 which faith embraces, faith looks to things already a reality in the Mind of God and the Purpose of God, of when the transaction took place, whether in the compact agreement in the everlasting covenant and or at the actual in time event at the Cross when the Father for the first time forsook His Son for sin imputed;

It was then that God hath done His act of imputing our sin to Christ; However it is not until in time, and in our own personal temporal history, by the Grace of God, do we believe after having revealed to us, this eternal transaction Ps 25:14, which at believing has been made manifest, and becomes the application of the blessing to our consciousness and brings us experimental peace, knowing that God has been made peace with us by the Blood of His Cross ! Col 1:20

And, having made peace[for us] through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

The matter of the Elects Justification before God, it had nothing to do with anything they did, and to say or imply otherwise is a false gospel ! Now Paul did demonstrate how the elect or those Christ died for [ the same] are Justified or declared Righteous by a comparing of Adam and Jesus Christ, that is Adam's disobedience and Christ's obedience i.e Phil 2:8; Heb 5:8 ,now lets read Rom 5:1987

19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so[likewise] by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Now Paul teaches here in this verse and in this context that Adam's disobedience was the cause of the elect sinning, that very sin of Adam being charged or imputed to the Elect as they were in Union with him, and that also without any personal or actual sin of their own or their own volition or freewill, but yet in God's Reckoning the Elect became sinners !

Now the word so a adverb houtō(s) which means = in this manner, thus, so

The obedience of Christ [alone] in offering himself [Heb 10:10,14] a sacrifice [ 1 Cor 5:7] for their sins, and so by doing, giving satisfaction to God's law and Justice against their sins, in obedience to God's will and command Jn 10:17-18


17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.

18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.

Now it [ Christ's obedient Offering alone] became the cause of Righteousness imputed to them, as they were in Union with Christ, without any personal obedience of theirs, such as faith, repentance added to it, and by that, the Elect are made Righteous and Justified in God's Reckoning !

Now any teaching on this matter of the Elects Justification before God, that fails to adhere to this rule Paul hath demonstrated via Adam and Christ Headship, it is a false teaching ! To add an act of obedience by the person made Righteous or Justified, is a false teaching and condemned by God !

Experimental Justification !

Experimental Justification is by Faith, of which is the application and execution of God's Eternal Decree from Everlasting, yes even the Everlasting Covenant. It is the effect of one's Eternal Justification [That which was made in Christ, foundationed upon the Covenant made between the Father and the Son, which was Immanent in God]

Along with that was also in God's Eternal Purpose the decree to give evidence and to declare in the consciousness of the Elect, their Justification. This aspect would be performed by the Holy Spirit's Work, He being sent to Justify them in Time in the Name of the Lord 1 Cor 6:11

11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

And so by the Work of the Spirit God does work faith in all the Eternally Justified, so causing them to believe in Jesus, and then its evidenced to themselves that they are Justified, and this is experimental Justification by Faith Rom 5:1

Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

Justification leads to Justification !

All the persons that are Justified before God and His Justice solely by the death and or blood of Christ Isa 53:11

11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

Rom 5:9

Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Each of them as an evidence of that, shall be Justified by faith before their own consciousness Rom 5:1, and so bringeth to pass the old saying of truth, the Just [made so by Christ's obedience unto death] shall live by faith Rom 1:16-17

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Now, the Justification by faith is not Justification before God, but its the fruit and effect of already having been made Righteous by the blood of Christ Rom 5:19b. Justification by faith is the fruit of one's New Birth, however Justification before God is the fruit and result of the blood of Christ and the imputation of His Righteousness, and the Non Imputation of their condemnation and sin.

Non of God's elect could have been Justified by faith, without #1 Justification before God based solely and entirely upon Christ's Blood, and #2 The New Birth, for without an spiritual birth, their is no fruit of faith that pleases God Gal 5:2289

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

To be Redeemed means to be Justified !

That the Elect, those Christ died for are Justified before God before they believe, this is True in that they are redeemed before they believe, and they are redeemed solely by the Blood of Christ.

Rev 5:9

And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

1 Pet 1:18-19

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

Eph 1:7

In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

Col 1:14

In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

Heb 9:12

Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

Now scripture says this in Gal 3:13

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

Those Christ died for were redeemed from the curse of the law, How ? By Being made a Curse for them, by His Death on the Tree 1 Pet 2:24a

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree,

Nothing the redeemed did redeemed them, but only what Christ did !

Now Paul says here Rom 3:24

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Thats saying that they were Justified by His Death because it Redeemed them from the Curse of the Law !

They were Justified by Redemption !

In fact, the Gospel Call goes out to only those that have been Redeemed Notice Isa 44:22

I have blotted out, as a thick cloud, thy transgressions,or forgiveness and, as a cloud, thy sins: return unto me; for I have redeemed thee.

In other words, their subjective returning to Him, Or Reconciliation Subjectively is premised on already having been redeemed and already having been forgiven of their Transgressions !

Justification and Union with Christ !

In order to ever be Justified by Faith in time, there must have been a Pre existing Union with Christ before Faith in order to faith, in fact this Union needed to exist with Christ ever before He could die for our sins: For the scripture doeth indicate that those Justified by Christ's Righteousness and Obedience, twas due to the fact that they had a Oneness with Him as His Body, a legal Oneness and a Mystical Oneness, and by this Mystical Union or Oneness, all for whom He died were members of His Body of which He is the Saviour of Eph 5:23,30

23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the Saviour of the body.

30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

Also they were members of His Flesh and Blood [Mystically] Heb 2:14

14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

This in that it was them that He specifically Identified with in Flesh and Blood !

They are the Body of Christ 1 Cor 12:12

12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.

And that [His Body] even before they become believers, which is indicated that He is the Saviour of The Body Eph 5:23 and also here Col 1:24

24 Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:

Paul here even though writing believers in Colosse at the time, did remind them of His present afflictions he must endure, for the Gospel's Sake in reaching with the Gospel the unconverted portion of Christ's Body, that is the Church; for this is very similar to his words to Timothy 2 Tim 2:10

10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's or His Body's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

For it is only in view of this Union Christ had with His Mystical Body that their sins could legally be charged to Him, simply because they are the sins of His Body, and so God is Just in not imputing the Body's sins unto them 2 Cor 5:19, because He hath charged them to their Head! And also the Head's Righteousness is also freely imputed to His Body. Now as His Mystical Body, we are crucified with Him Gal 2:20, are dead with Him Rom 6:8 are risen with Him Eph 2:6, and we are Newly Created in Him Eph 2:10; However none of this can be our reality and experience except it be through that Eternal Mystical Union we had in Christ before the foundation of the World Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us[His Body the Church] in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Any and everyone Christ died for [which was not for all without exception] must be by God Justified ! Rom 3:24

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Rom 8:33-34

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

Now this is True because Christ by His Redemptive Blood has paid for their sins, and by this has fulfilled God's Law and Justice and Holy demands upon them. For in His Death of the Cross, it is written this Col 2:14

14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

Now listen, all legal guilt by our law breaking and sin has been blotted out of the record books as these here were not Rev 20:12

12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

All that could ever be written against them for their guilt and condemnation and to occasion God's Wrath, was taken out of the Way, having been nailed to the Cross of Christ; and so because God is just, He must justify freely [free from sin], all for whom Christ died, and that solely upon the basis of redemption in His Blood, and not for their faith or works or repentance !