The truth is all lives matter

rambot said:

What about the people who think that terrible police officers do not face significant punishments for their malfeasence? Or the people who think that police training has created a reactionary force that too often does not use proper scale of force? Or the people who think that police shouldn't even be sent to mental health calls without a psychologist or trained counsellor? What about the people who think the police don't need to be involved in moving homeless encampments when necessary? Or those oddballs who think that police unions protect some pretty terrible cops?

Do we need to watch those videos?

Click to expand...

Yes we do. And you know why we don't have more dead cops? It's because they are trained properly. And studies absolutely prove that cops do use reasonable force in over 99% of the cases.

How many trained psychologists are out there who are trained to respond to people in mental health crisis who have weapons and are threatening to harm people? Most psychologists are trained to speak to people I. A nice comfortable office. They won't go out in the street. They demand officers bring the people to them in a hospital or a mental health facility. In most places cops have sit on the people for hours and hours before a mental health person will see them.

Just where are we going to.get all these trained people to go with the cops at a moments notice in these situations? You know a lot of counselors that are willing to do that? We sure don't have any around here that are. And we have these professionals who work with these mentally ill folks. But they will NOT go to a scene. And if you to try and make them? Well, they would.go do something else. We have a hard enough time just finding people who are willing to see someone in a crisis at the hospital hours upon hours after the police have already dealt with the person and brought them in. It's pretty obvious you have no idea how these things work.

I challenge you to actually go out and find these councillors and get them to go to the police and sign up for doing what you think they should do.

Believe me, the police would be thrilled to have them. In my area the police would absolutely give their right arm to have someone along who would do that. But no one will.

rjs330 said:

Yes we do. And you know why we don't have more dead cops? It's because they are trained properly. And studies absolutely prove that cops do use reasonable force in over 99% of the cases.

How many trained psychologists are out there who are trained to respond to people in mental health crisis who have weapons and are threatening to harm people? Most psychologists are trained to speak to people I. A nice comfortable office. They won't go out in the street. They demand officers bring the people to them in a hospital or a mental health facility. In most places cops have sit on the people for hours and hours before a mental health person will see them.

Just where are we going to.get all these trained people to go with the cops at a moments notice in these situations? You know a lot of counselors that are willing to do that? We sure don't have any around here that are. And we have these professionals who work with these mentally ill folks. But they will NOT go to a scene. And if you to try and make them? Well, they would.go do something else. We have a hard enough time just finding people who are willing to see someone in a crisis at the hospital hours upon hours after the police have already dealt with the person and brought them in. It's pretty obvious you have no idea how these things work.

I challenge you to actually go out and find these councillors and get them to go to the police and sign up for doing what you think they should do.

Believe me, the police would be thrilled to have them. In my area the police would absolutely give their right arm to have someone along who would do that. But no one will.

Click to expand...

Stop buying the bravado.
Of course they will. You think people are too scared to deescalate someone in a mental crisis?

Pffft. You have no idea guy.

Yes, all lives do matter, absolutely. However, when former MD Governor Martin O'Malley made said statement in a Dem nomination debate with Hillary and Bernie in 2016, he was shouted down and/or booed by some in the audience. They were not happy with him saying that all lives matter.

rambot said:

Stop buying the bravado.
Of course they will. You think people are too scared to deescalate someone in a mental crisis?

Pffft. You have no idea guy.

Click to expand...

I'm afraid it's you who don't really know. I know how it works. I've seen the process at work many many times. I just described it to you.

Why don't you start working it out with them. Maybe you can make difference. Since you are so sure. We actually have a program in place in my county for crisis counselors to come to the scene. You know how many we have who are willing to do it? Two. And they are not willing to do it all the time. Only specific hours and only under certain conditions.

But maybe if you start the process by going to all the psychologists and councillors in your area you can get them all in board and create a program. Let us know how it works out.

coffee4u said:

This is a perfect example of how the left operates. Any diversion to take focus off the facts.

Click to expand...

You are not promoting facts, you are promoting conspiracies. I learned long ago it is useless to try to reason someone out of such as position.

rambot said:

Stop buying the bravado.
Of course they will. You think people are too scared to deescalate someone in a mental crisis?

Pffft. You have no idea guy.

Click to expand...

How do you deescalate a gun in your face? If you don't shoot you might get shot. How do you deescalate that situation?

rambot said:

But if all lives matter, then Black Lives matter.

So why fight so hard against it?

Click to expand...

Who is fighting against it?

It looks like the all lives matter people want included in the discussion and the black lives matter people don't want them.

If you're not talking about the slogan, then frankly, I don't see why anyone would support it. Have they helped any black people? For an organization that takes in millions, you'd think we'd have all kinds of examples of black lives they helped.

Instead they show up after the viral video....march and occasionally riot. They do something between minor to major damage to the police department. Then pat themselves on the back, and move on to the next town. There's no real goal or even legitimate problem, just outrage and made up excuses for it.

If we were just talking about unarmed black men shot in completely unjust situations....at the rate that happens, it would take somewhere between 200 and 400 years for police to kill as many black men as black men do in 1 year.

A legitimate movement has a goal...this movement walks in a circle and hasn't really improved anything.

C'mon. Someone else must have seen that first draft BLM demands manifesto they put out before they hired PR people. It's a bunch of communist nonsense mixed with racist black nationalism. If that's the goal of defunding police, decriminalizing crime, and abolishing prisons....they shouldn't have to hide it behind a veneer of moral righteousness.

White people say can we be represented too? Liberals stomp feet and storm out of the room.

Parmallia said:

Police are highly trained professionals whose entire job is making this exact kind of decision. It's why they are so often heroes.

Tamir Rice was not a professional anything. He was a 12 year old boy which means he's probably doing something stupid most of the time.

Police have a right to live, this is true. But so do stupid 12 year old boys playing with toy guns.

Only ONE of them has the requisite training, experience and professionalism.

Click to expand...

When criminals behave as Tamir Rice behaved, the police are professionally trained to kill them. They did what they were trained to do.

rambot said:

But if all lives matter, then Black Lives matter.

So why fight so hard against it?

Click to expand...

Because it's a racist organization. History will tell you anytime you have an organization based on race, that organization will attract racist; and from what I've seen, BLM is no exception. If someone started an organization called (for example) white and proud, even if it's intention were innocent, it would only be a matter of time before white racists would become a part of that organization and the entire country will recognize it as a racist organization. Black people are no exception. Besides, when you tell somebody something they already know (like black lives matter) especially when it is done with a holier than thou attitude, it is condescending and insulting and nobody likes being insulted that way. All lives matter includes black lives as well; nobody needs to be told black lives matter. That's why so many fight against it.

Ken-1122 said:

When criminals behave as Tamir Rice behaved, the police are professionally trained to kill them. They did what they were trained to do.

Click to expand...

Our military is trained to kill, not our police force. Police are trained in the use of force only in self defense. The police being trained to kill criminals would be a betrayal of our entire view of jurisprudence. It would turn our police force into judge/jury/ and executioner rather then investigators.

IWalkAlone said:

How do you deescalate a gun in your face? If you don't shoot you might get shot. How do you deescalate that situation?

Click to expand...

Trying to get the drop on someone if their gun is already in your face is a losing proposition.

At that point, deescalation might be your only option.

In the meantime, you might want to Google "hostage negotiators" and learn about the people whose job it is to deescalate situations when the guns are already out and pointed in someone's face.

Ken-1122 said:

When criminals behave as Tamir Rice behaved, the police are professionally trained to kill them. They did what they were trained to do.

Click to expand...

You train killers, you get killers.

TLK Valentine said:

Trying to get the drop on someone if their gun is already in your face is a losing proposition.

At that point, deescalation might be your only option.

In the meantime, you might want to Google "hostage negotiators" and learn about the people whose job it is to deescalate situations when the guns are already out and pointed in someone's face.

Click to expand...

But the cop didn't lose.

Belk said:

Our military is trained to kill, not our police force. Police are trained in the use of force only in self defense. The police being trained to kill criminals would be a betrayal of our entire view of jurisprudence. It would turn our police force into judge/jury/ and executioner rather then investigators.

Click to expand...

That's what he's saying. When a criminal points a gun at you, or someone else police are trained to "stop the threat". It's just a more PC way of saying they are trained to kill them. So Rice pointed a gun at the and they responded appropriately. They had no idea it was a toy until later. Police are not trained to know how to determine if a realistic you gun is real or not in a split second of time.

Police are not trained to allow people to shoot them first before returning fire.

IWalkAlone said:

But the cop didn't lose.

Click to expand...

...this time.

Getting lucky once is a poor excuse to make it a habit -- especially when the consequence of your luck running out is death.

TLK Valentine said:

...this time.

Getting lucky once is a poor excuse to make it a habit -- especially when the consequence of your luck running out is death.

Click to expand...

You run a risk by not shooting too.

IWalkAlone said:

White people say can we be represented too? Liberals stomp feet and storm out of the room.

Click to expand...

You are free to appoint yourself as a champion of the white race -- but I would strongly suggest you take a good long look at the other self-appointed "champions" before deciding you want to be lumped in with them.

Think it over...

TLK Valentine said:

You are free to appoint yourself as a champion of the white race -- but I would strongly suggest you take a good long look at the other self-appointed "champions" before deciding you want to be lumped in with them.

Think it over...

Click to expand...

I'm just saying. Our lives matter too. No reason to get upset.

IWalkAlone said:

You run a risk by not shooting too.

Click to expand...

Indeed -- and I feel for any officer who finds themselves in that rare situation... because the truth is the majority of police can go years, even entire careers, without drawing their service weapon, let along firing it.

Personally, I think not firing should be the default training -- be we have people around here who seem to believe (or perhaps prefer) the police to be trained killers.