I am speaking of a great mystery in the bible. Some things are very deeply spiritual in their understanding. This mystery of the Light of Christ, the Seed, the word of God is one of those mysteries.
Something deep and hard to understand is not the NT meaning of mystery.
In the NT, mystery is simply something formerly hidden but now revealed, not something hard to decipher; mysteries such as the incarnation, the death of Christ, God's purpose to sum up all things in Christ, to include both Jews and Gentiles in the NT church, etc.
And no matter how deep they are, they are still
defined by the Biblical text, which boundaries you transgress.
This is connected to pose to include oh Jews and GEntiles in the NT church, the change that will take place at the resurrection the mystery of Christ in you the hope of glory.
I don't believe I said anyone has to teach a child to lie. And I did say that a child is born with a sin nature. But that child hasn't actually sinned until they transgress a known law. Their sin nature is as i understand it, dormant or not revived until the commandment comes to their understanding.
And yet they lie at a young age, before the commandment comes to their full understanding.
"As you understand it" is contrary to NT teaching (
Romans 5:18).
This some call the age of accountability. Paul says he was alive once without the law. This "alive I believe is speaking of spiritual life in Christ as he had as a child.
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Where in the NT is it taught that humans are born with the spiritual life of Christ, which is the spiritual
rebirth? If they are born with Christ's life, why must they be born
again
(
John 3:3-5)?
Christ's life is eternal life, and eternal life is just that--eternal, everlasting. It's not given at birth, then lost, then given again. That is nonsense to the NT.
I am not alone in seeing that Paul is referring to the time when he was a child without the law. Other commentators I have found agree n this.
When Paul says sin "revived" then he died. he is speaking of understanding the law and his sin nature ( that was there but not active so to speak) was revived. The death is spiritual death . separation from God .
Paul is speaking of when the true rigor of the law became clear to him, he realized he was condemned to
physical death by it.
Adam was alive before he sinned, and God said the "DAY" you eat you shall surely "DIE". Now we know that when Adam ate the fruit he didn't die physically right then. He died spiritually and this was in his connection to God.
Adam died physically to show that he had
already died spiritually.
And since that time,
all Adam's progeny are
born in that same
spiritual death; i.e., no eternal life in their human spirit.
They must be
re-born spiritually to be saved from Adam's condemnation with which they were born (
Romans 5:18),
by nature (birth) objects of God's
wrath (
Ephesians 2:3), from which Jesus saves them (
Romans 5:9) through faith in himself and his atoning sacrifice (blood,
Romans 3:5) for the remission of their sin and right standing with God's justice; i.e., "not guilty," declared righteous.
Separated from God is spiritual death. Even if fallen angels and men who die in sin go to hell and are conscious. This is not to live in the life (Christ) but in death. Jesus said let the dead bury their dead when speaking of spiritually dead men. Dead in trespasses and sins. They are dead to God dead in spiritual life. When a person is born again they are now spiritually alive to God in Christ. Jesus said he is the life.
Because you don't understand it in
context of and in
harmony with the whole NT.
He says he was alive without the law once. This life is spiritual life in Christ. If a infant dies lets say at one hour of life. I believe Christ still died for them. And Jesus blessed the infants. This infant is in Christ by God's grace I believe. For Christ died for the sin of the whole world and for all men. The only way a child could go to God is if they have eternal life, to be "alive: spiritually in Christ. This is what I believe all infants have through the work of the cross and by Gods grace for them. We know that all infants have the true Light that lights them (John 1:9) this light will eventually reprove all sin. But until the child actually knowingly transgresses the law they are not dead yet as Paul seems to imply and as we see in other places.
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Paul is not referring to only the physical death of the law, for not all sin has a death penalty under the law.
This is what I mean by not understanding in the context of the whole NT.
"The wages of sin is death." All sin. (
Romans 6:23)
He said he was alive once without the law and then dead when sin revived. The expression sin revived and he died is telling.
Show me from scripture that a infant is not alive in Christ.
I already have. . .
Romans 5:18;
Ephesians 2:3.
By nature (birth) we are objects of wrath. We are
born with our nature.
We read in Romans 5 that the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
We see in
Romans 5:18-19 that condemnation came upon all men in Adam,
just as (in the same way) justification of life came upon all men in Christ.
Those are the boundaries of the two carefully-constructed
contrasting parallels of the benefits for those of Adam and the benefits for those of Christ.
The mystery that is not being understood here, is
not that children are born with eternal life (which they are not),
but that the results of Adam's sin overflow to those born of Adam, while the results of Christ's righteousness overflow to those born of Christ.
The true Light lights every infant that is alive. Yes they are born with a sin nature. But sin is not imputed to them while there is "NO LAW" . They are know anything and they do not know how to do right or wrong. To him that knoweth to do good and doeth it not to him it s sin. God only judges according to the light they have. Where no law is there is no transgression. The infant has not done good or evil yet. They are in grace as i understand. That grace is the grace of salvation purchased by Christ for them.
The alternative to this understanding is to condemn all infants at one day old to hell if they die. But this is not what I see in scripture. Jesus blessed the infants and said of such is the kingdom. Can any imagine God saying to a one day old infant that died. "away from me ye that work iniquity"?. But the infant has not worked any iniquity yet.
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I am not saying as you imply I am that when Paul says he was alive once without the law, that that life he speaks of is his natural human spirit life. I believe Paul as an infant (like I believe ALL infants have) had spiritual life in Christ through the grace of God and Jesus sacrifice for sin for the whole world. He died, not physically when the commandment came, but he died in that spiritual life connected to Christ. Eternal life is Christ. When we are in Christ we have eternal life. But as John said in 1 John if we hate our brother eternal life does not abide ( remain) in us any more. So yes a person can lose that eternal life in sin. When sin revives and they die, i see that death as them now being dead in trespasses and sins. And they need to repent and be born again to have Christ formed in them .
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Jesus said they are condemned WHEN they hate the light
Right, that's why Jesus always speaks of our judgment based on our actions.
Until they
actually hate the light which
demonstrates their evil hearts, they are not condemned.
They are condemned by the
heart which
hates the light, with which heart they were
born, and which is
why it condemns the light
But the true nature of that heart with which they were born was not
manifested to
themselves until they were presented with the light,
when they then hated it, which action then plainly shows to them the cause of their condemnation.
The opposite of being condemned is to be saved in Christ in the Light in the life and eternal life of Christ. The opportunity to "show
" itself, is when sin revives. This sin reviving I see as the sin nature now acting and alive. He then became alive unto sin but dead unto God when that happened, as all will do when the understanding of the law comes to them and their sin nature rebels.
This is not what is being said. We know that men sinned from Adam to Moses and God judged the entire world for sin in Genesis. We see many sinning all through the event from Adam to Moses. But we know that even if they did not have the Mosaic law God was reproving them of sin inwardly by the true Light that lighteh every man that cometh into the world (John 1:9). This light will reprove al things (Eph 5) . Jesus said that whosoever ( that would include all men from Adam to Moses) doeth evil hateth the light and that the light reproves them of sin.
Paul also said of such men who didnt have the law of Moses written in stone,
And again, you don't understand correctly because you are not seeing it in its context.
Paul is presenting God's law for judging mankind. Those who have the law will be judged by the law, those who do not have the law (Gentiles) will be judged by the law of their conscience.
These secrets of men is the inward reality of men. This is where the Seed , or word of God, Christ the true Light shines and works.
"This is all through the old and new Testaments. This is a mystery hid from ages and generation now made known.
Paul is not referring to the curse of the law specifically or the death sentence. he says he was alive without the law and dead when sin revived by the commandment .
We see more of this mystery when Paul speaks of it in Romans 10 He refers to Dueteronomy 30 in the chapter. This also shows the mystery that all men know and the work of the law inwardly and that Christ has always been there as the true Light lighting every man and reproving all men from the beginning
consider deeply this
"11 For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off. 12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? 13 Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it? 14But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it."(Duet 30:11-14 KJV)
Even before the law of Moses was given God has worked it in all mens hearts. This is how God can judge all men and the secrets of men.
Consider deeply this in context.
Those words were not spoken to all men, they were spoken to the people of God.
Infants also need Christ death for them, and only because of God's grace and the salvation offered in Christ can any infant have this life. It is God's mercy and grace and love that saves the infants. Jesus said they were blessed and of such are the kingdom.
No you are wrong here, the parable is a deep mystery and it does show that the Sower The Father sows Christ the seed , word of God in every heart. Though not in union with the hearts unless the seed takes root.
Consider the parable carefully and you will see that the seed is sown in every heart. But how the heart reacts to the seed is the issue. Some hearts are hard to the seed and others filled with other things.
If you can see and understand this parable you will understand what I am talking about in the great Mystery. I don't say this to be better than anyone or puffed up. But rather to attempt to speak of the deep things of God and the mystery of Christ in you.
"13 And he said unto them, Know ye not this parable? and how then will ye know all parables?
14 The sower soweth the word.
15 And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts.
16 And these are they likewise which are sown on stony ground; who, when they have heard the word, immediately receive it with gladness;
17 And have no root in themselves, and so endure but for a time: afterward, when affliction or persecution ariseth for the word's sake, immediately they are offended.
18 And these are they which are sown among thorns; such as hear the word,
19 And the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the word, and it becometh unfruitful.
20 And these are they which are sown on good ground; such as hear the word, and receive it, and bring forth fruit, some thirtyfold, some sixty, and some an hundred."(Mark 4:13-20 KJV)
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16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel."(Romans 2:14-16 KJV)
